Cycling Multiple tanks with centralised filter

[Wildconservationist]

Hi All;

I will like to gather views and suggestion on the above stated.

Background:
Will be starting a 3 tier L:4ft x W:1.5ft x H:25cm tanks and will like to see options and views in how to go about cycling the tanks.
Tanks will be used mainly for fresh water breeding purpose.

Hardware:
3 x 4ft X 1.5ft x 25cm tank
Total volume: 3 X 135L= 405L
Each tank will be having about 2~3cm ADA soil.

Filtration: Fluval FX5 or FX 6
Tech Specification:FX 6( Similar to FX 5)
Capacity: 1500L
Pump output: 3500L/hr
Filter circulation: 2130L/hr

Chiller:
1 x Hailea HC-1000A [ 1 Hp ]
- Flow-rate: 1500 - 4000 L/H
- Recommended for Aquarium from 1000L~2000L


Planned ideas:
-Each individual tier will have an overflow point to channel water back for filtration.
-Will be using ADA soil as base substrate.
-Will be using 1 unit of Fluval FX 5/6 for filtration.

The above are stage 1 of setup. I presume that i can use the normal cycling process for these 3 tanks.
However, there will stage 2 of this project. And the real question is here..

Stage 2 of project Maybe months later.)
1: Additional 3 x [2ft x 1.5ft x 25cm] tanks
- Total volume: 67.5 x 3= 202.5L
2: Additional 1 x 2ft x 1.5ft x 1.5ft tank
-Total volume: 121.5L
With the increase of water volume and load, i will be adding 1 x sump tanks to cope with the bio-load.

Now this is the question that i will like to find out...

What will be the most ideal suggestion/ideas to employ so that i can successfully introduce the additional 4 tanks to the previous system so that i can fully utilized the centralized filtration system?
Hoping to create the minimum impact to the Stage 1 system which maybe by than loaded with breeding projects..

Looking forward to all suggestions and ideals.
Wildconservationist

[thebaldingaquarist]

Hi,
I am quite intrigued by the proposal. But in my head right now i have a few questions.


Assuming all the tanks are connected to the same filter in parallel. Filter to the chiller in serial.

Are the inlets for the filter, present and future, going to be located at the same height? if not, the "higher" tankswill have more water flow out and less flow in, as compared to the "lower" tanks right? This will take some serious fine tuning and some fail safe needs to be in place, in case a filter inlet is clogged.

The chiller needs to be piping water to all the tanks concurrently, whats the strategy to even out the outflow among all the tanks?

[Wildconservationist]

Hi Erctheanda;

Thank you for the fast response, as according to my proposal( Still open for changes).. the answers as in red...


Assuming all the tanks are connected to the same filter in parallel. Filter to the chiller in serial.

Are the inlets for the filter, present and future, going to be located at the same height? if not, the "higher" tankswill have more water flow out and less flow in, as compared to the "lower" tanks right? This will take some serious fine tuning and some fail safe needs to be in place, in case a filter inlet is clogged.
Answer: All tanks will have an overflow point which is drilled and i maybe fixing at 20cm or 22cm. Water will flow down back to the filter when it reach 20~22cm. As for the water returning to the tank, there will be a ball valve, to control or restrict the amount of water going back to the tank.
Preventive measure for clogging the filter will be installation of filter guard at the overflow point.

The chiller needs to be piping water to all the tanks concurrently, whats the strategy to even out the outflow among all the tanks?[/QUOTE]
Answer: Piping connection as below:
Overflow1+ Overflow 2+ Overflow 3----> FX5----> Chiller----> Back to tank.
With Stage 1 setup, it might be a bit tricky to get the chiller to cool all 3 tanks down evenly. And I'm expecting the chiller to kicks in really often cause heat will be absorbed really fast with 3 x 4ft tanks.
Therefore,at stage 2 installation, there will be a sump tank incorporated into the design. And i will be planning to incorporated the design that some of the shrimp keeper are using to cool their tanks.Which is as follow:
Sump--> internal pump-->chiller---> array of S.S(Stainless Steel) pipes---> sump

And with the sump tank incorporated along the same level/height with FX5/6, i will be splitting the out flow of the sump internal filter and line up with the FX5/6 because FX5/6 is working on gravity feed theory and with the sump tank on the same level, the FX 5/6 might not be able to work...

[Wildconservationist]

So for Stage 1 installation, the path will be as follow:

Tank 1+ Tank 2+ Tank 3---> FX 5/6---> Chiller---> Tank1+ Tank 2+ Tank 3

Stage 2 installation:
All tank overflow---> Sump---> FX5/6--->U.V light---> back to all tanks.
Sump---> Chiller---> Array of S.S pipes--->Sump.

[David]

Hello WildC

Do remember that the amount of beneficial bacterial your communal filter can have is the total amount of surface area of the amount of bio media your filter can hold. The ratio to each tank is no longer in terms of water volume but rater the amount of bio load of each tank. I could be wrong but I think I am correct.

Always remember that for any unfortunate event in one tank is going to be spread to all tanks in the case of pathogen or protozoan. This means one sick tank will become 3 sick tank in no time. What is the sizing of your UV Filter? Do remember that the effectiveness of any UV is dependent on wattage of UV and flow rate through the UV.

Then, what about your contingency plan should your communal filter and/or UV Filter breaks down? You could be like me and squirrel spare parts but there will always be a time when the spare parts cannot save you and the filter fails. Then what? As Murphy's Law would have it, 'It Always Fails You At A Time When There Is No Alternate Solution'.

PS: WildC.....try not to use red as highlighter for text because it makes reading very difficult? Green perhaps better?....

[Wildconservationist]

Hi David;

In regards to beneficial bacterial, i have thought about it and i believed that a Fluval FX5/6 which can hold 5.9L of media inside could provide quite a big area for the beneficial bacterial to colonize. However, in order not to be totally dependent on FX5/6 space for beneficial bacterial colonizing, each tank will have a hamburg Matten Filter system incorporated into it as well. So basically, At stage 1 of the installation, the whole system will be running on 1 x FX5/6 and also Hamburg Matten Filter in each tank.

And at stage 2 of the project, when the sump tank comes in, beside having the usual Bio media(Biohome, ceramic ring etc). I will be implementing at least 2 x Fluidized bed reactor system within the sump system.
1 x Fluidized sand reactor.
1 x Fluidized Purigen reactor.
1 x Fluidized Carbon beads reactor.

Fluidized reactor is actually implemented to increase the amount of surface area for Beneficial bacterial to colonized

U.V light installation for Stage 1 of the project, I'm looking at having 1 18watt or 36watt and i think Coralife turbo twist has an unit that suggest to treat up to 500L tank.
That's for Stage 1 of the project.

Once Stage 2 of the projects comes in, I'm having the thoughts of using 2 x Unit of Coralife Turbo twist since i will be having more water flow speed from the FX5/6 since it will not be connected to the chiller. Hopefully the installation of UV light will prevent spreading of diseases.

As for contingency plans, these are the thoughts that i have...
If filter failure is at stage 1,the system can be shut off...by turning a ball valve to cut out from the FX5/6 and be running on the Hamburg Matten Filter system till replacement arrive.
If the filter fails at Stage 2, the system can be switched between the sump or the FX5/6 if either fails. And if both sump pump and FX5/6 fails, the system still can depend on the Hamburg Matten Filter system.( Switching can be done with a ball valve as well).

So sorry for using red... I have omitted the quotes from my reply..

[Wildconservationist]

Since Hamburg Matten Filter system is air driven, i will be either using 1 unit of Hi-Blow 60 at Stage 1 of the project and at Stage 2 of the project, an additional unit of Hi-Blow 60 will be added.

[felix_fx2]

matten filter will work as long as water flows thru the foampads.

for your case, already have water movement since using overflow. it can double up as a prefilter too.

[thebaldingaquarist]

My thoughts.

If individual filtration is used (hamburg matten), shouldn't just stick with individual filtration?

I would say that the benefits of centralised filtration is
1. water parameters is constant across tanks - pathogens and viruses included.
2. possibly more power saving - with that massive chiller, i am not so sure about this point

what i read from the responses.. i would imagine that if one day power outage, water will flow from the top tanks to the lower tanks, due to "gravity" right?

Any picture or schematic? cannot visualise..

[David]

WildC.....hey...no issues ...just that the red makes it difficult to read...

As long as you have covered all areas and a good contingency plan, I guess it will work just fine.

[David]

For the fluidize sand filter, it has a life span and the whole contraption has to be discarded as its sealed. On top of that it traps a lot of muck. I prefer the bio ball from aqua-medic.

[Wildconservationist]

Felix;
Understand that as long as there water passing through it.. it's going to work just nice.. However, I thought that since the filter matt is there... No harm with an additional aeration to the setup.

[Wildconservationist]

Hey Eric;

Over-filtration is always better than under filtration right?
And with the overflow constantly removing X liters(27L of water if the level is set at 20cm OR 16.2L of water if the level is set at 22cm) of water from the tank, there will be a constant replacement of water to replace/displace those ammonia,nitrite and nitrate down to the sump and canister filter.

I agree with the constant water parameter across all tanks, including pathogens and viruses. But in order to prevent pathogens and viruses from spreading, prevention measure are a must... Like installation of UV light,quarantine of new purchase or buy from reliable source.
As for power saving, i reckon the saving will not be much as well. But savings can be derive from other channel like using LED lighting etc..
However, the main reason for running a single canister filter to running 3 canister filter for all 3 tanks, 3 external filters will take up too much spaces. And all those spaces can be put to better uses.
As for the chiller, the intention is to provide a better condition for all the breeding live stock... Comparing the additional cost and providing a better condition for the live stock, i think i will chose the latter.

In the event of power outage, all pumps will be cut off... Thus no water will be pumped into the return pipes.. The only scenario that i can think of is all the water back flow into the sump and over flow from there. But this can be solved by installing a single direction valve, to prevent back flow..

I have a picture of the whole system drawn up somewhere... Let me find it, scan it and upload to discuss...

[Wildconservationist]

Hey David;

I agree with you that fluidized sand reactor will traps lots of mucks.
But this fluidized sand reactor that i had in mind, it will be after the initial sump filtration.After the filter wools, ceramic ring etc..
So this fluidized sand reactor is to allow more bacterial to colonized and remove ammonia,Nitrite and Nitrate. At the point where the fluidized sand and other fluidized reactor are placed, their life span will be longer than the usual.

[Wildconservationist]

Anyone got inputs of how to go about cycling multiples tanks?
I'm more concern about cycling all the Stage 2 tanks..
All the 4 x 2ftx1.5ft x 25cm tanks will have ADA soil inside which will leak a certain amount of nutrients/chemical into the main filtration system..
(Due to the scale of this project, i cannot afford to setup up all tanks at the same time mainly because of all the equipments that's involved during stage 1 installation).

Thanks in advanced
WildConservatioinist

[David]

Consider seeding and/or using BioHome (the red ones) or its equivalent

[Wildconservationist]

Hey David;
I don't really get what you mean by seeding...
I definitely be using Biohome inside the FX5/6 which is part of the list of media that i will be using...
OR

Get the sump and FX5/6 up and running in stage 1.

Best Regards

[Wildconservationist]

Hey Eric;

Here's the drawing for discussion:

Stage 1:
Stage 1.jpg

Stage 2:
Stage 2.jpg

[David]

Bacteria seeding. If you are using the BioHome, the red one then you so not need. Just that you need to supply NH to start the process.

Since you are using ADA soil, you are more or less covered.

[Wildconservationist]

So David;

you mean that once the stage 1 tanks are cycled properly, even when i introduce tanks from Stage 2 will not cause major impact?
Cause i believed that ADA soil will leach certain amount of ammonia,nitrite and Nitrate to the water...