Calculation for lights

[stevensim]

Hi All,

I have a question. When calculating the wattage requirements, Do we take the height of the tank itself or do we take only the height of the water in the tank ??

Problem is that there is a vast difference in the wattage requirements if I only use the height of the Water in the Tank.

My Tank is 3ft x 1.5ft x 2 ft high. The Gravel is about 3.5" and water is about 1.5 " from the top. that means I only have a height of 19" for the water.

Thanks for the help in advance.


Cheers

[plantmania]

You think too much . Watt per gallon rule is based on pure estimation through people's years of experience. For my case, I minus off 10 % off the total gallon. 60 gallon(based on tank dimensions) -> 54 gallon and just use that for computation.

Others based on water volume, not tank, you will get lesser gallons but it's still safe to use. This calculation is only suitable if your water volume is near the tank dimension volume.

It's not exact science, people measure by range, 2.5 to 3.5 watts per gallon. It will be nuts to measure 3.256123 gallons just to be accurate . E.g
Aiming for 3 w / gallon, try the easiest combo of lights to reach that mark.
1. Tank dimension = 60 gal
Wattage of light needed = 3 x 60 = 180 watts
This will be about 54 watts of lights x 3....

2. water volume = 50 gal
Wattage of light needed = 3 x 50= 150 watts
This will be also equals to about 54 watts of lights x 3....

3. water volume = 10 gal( same tank as 2.)
Wattage of light needed = 3 x 10= 30 watts
Obviously..... you will wasting tank space and getting too little light. Use common sense. Unless you are using substrate that's almost the depth of the tank, then the 30 watts is enough, won't it look silly ?

Too many factors to be "accurate" , depth of substrate, densities of water with impurities, lighting lumens, intensity,space between light and air and water, etc....

[stevensim]

HI Bro plantmania,

I know it is just a estimate, but I keep getting BGA and Green spot Algae...

I have a 4 x 36 watt , and a 1 x 54 watt for my tank. I suspect this is the root cause for my problem. The rest of the KH, PH, NO3, PO4 and CO2 are o.k.

Assuming if all other areas are o.k., Could this be the cause ?


Thanks in advance

Cheers

[plantmania]

plant more! plant like you never plant before.

Try to cover every inch of exposed gravel. Add floating plants like frogbits, salvina, duckweeds, water lettuce.

Parameter ok ? how ok is ok ? it's never ok if you have algae....what's your fert, how you dose , when you dose, how frequent you dose? Got base fert ? how deep? how much gravel on top? Why you assume everything ok ? What bioload ?

How many hours of light ? Got other light source nearby ?

New tank? less than 6months old ? If so, wait patiently , plants will eventually win over algae... Tank maturing takes time.

Or you can try this way..... Black out treatment for 3 days(72 hours) straight to remove most algae.Reduce fert dosage to a third(or none at all) and no additional iron to be added, cut down lighting to around 10 hr, Change 50% water and then don't change water for at least 3 months. Of course , still plant more PLANTS.Feed a bit more food for the fish, twice a day. Just need to endure the algae for at least a month.... See if things improve...

[stevensim]

Hi Bro Plantmania,

The tank is about 8 months old already. And planting cover all surface of the gravel. I am feeding the fish 2 times a day and doing a weekly water change of 70%. Here is what I got :

Tank Dimensions (LxWxH): 3ft x 1.5ft x 2ft
Lighting Intensity(No of Watts) : 198 watt
Type of Lighting (FL/PL/MH) : PL
No. of Hours your light is on: 9 hours
CO2 Injection Rate (bps) : 4 bps
Type of CO2 (DIY/Liquid/Tank) :tank
Method of Injection (e.g. Diffusor/Reactor): Bioplast reactor
Substrate Used : dennerle
How Thick is your base fert : 1cm
How thick is your gravel : 8cm
Liquid Fertilizers Used : lushgro 12ml, NPO3 1/4 teaspoon, PO4 4 ricegrain, lushgro Micro 10 drops
Frequency of fertilization : 2 x per week
Tank Temperature : 27
Type of Filter (overhead/internal/canister) : canister
Filter media used : Red color type biohome
How long has your tank been set up : 8 months


Chemical Properties (Fill what you can)
---------------------------------------

Carbonate Hardness (kh): 4
Total Hardness (gH):
PH : 6.4
NH4 (ppm):
NO2 (ppm):
NO3 (ppm): 10
PO4 (ppm): 5
Fe (ppm):

Bioload (Your Fish and Plants)
------------------------------
36 tetra, 6 shrimps, 5 sae. Hair grass (lawn), glosso (Lawn), Rotola, Tiger lily.

Describe your problem :

Green Spot algae on glass after a few days of cleaning and water changes.
Hair Algae on Hair Grass.

Thanks again for the help.

[plantmania]

I think your lushgro dosage is too much for your tank. Since you are dosing BOTH aqua and micros, your concentration for the trace Iron is pretty high, it's almost 1 ppm... Your phosphate is very high....198 watts, about 3 WPG, but 2ft deep tank and old set of lights -> perhaps less than 2 WPG with color spectrum shift....

What's NPO3 ?

Suggestion: Since plants only can make use of fert during 9 hours everyday.... and since it's 8 months without change of light bulbs....

1. You need to reset your Phosphates... do a 70% water change to lower it to around 2 ppm... Don't dose PO4 for first 1 week, then dose one third of what you are doing for PO4 before per week....

2. Lushgro aqua -> single dosage every week (12 ml)

3. Lushgro micro -> Two set of dosage (1ml each) 2 days after your lushgro aqua.

Day 1-> Aqua only... (12 ml) + PO4(1 grain ?)
Day 3 -> Micros (1 ml)
Day 5 -> Micros (1 ml)
Day 7/8 -> water change(50%) -> Repeat Day 1....

Dose them in the morning , before lights on. Don't dose at night....

If you need N(Nitrogen and Nitrates from Aqua) Day 5 can be replaced by another 12 ml of Aqua but NO Micros..... It will add another 0.6 ppm of Fe....

[PeterGwee]

I'll double check and recheck the CO2 levels for a couple of days and make sure it is really in the good range for the entire photoperiod before moving onto the nutrients for possible issues. Excess nutrients do not cause algae unless it is ammonia (from too many critters, buildup due to poor CO2 levels.).

Suggested Routine

Prune and remove as much algae as possible.
Clean the filter
Do a large 50-70% water change.
Check and double check the CO2 levels over a couple of days to make sure. Check it both at the am and pm timing.
Once you are sure of the CO2 can you start to add the following...
1/2 tsp of KNO3 2x a week and later 3x a week when the plants start to grow well.
3-4 rice grain of KH2PO4 3x a week
1/2 tsp of Seachem Equilibrium after the water change only.
10ml of lushgro micros 3x a week
Main thing is to keep a close eye on the CO2 levels during the routine as always.

Regards
Peter Gwee

[stevensim]

Hi Bro Plantmania,

Sorry typo error, it is NO3.


Have done the Water change and following the dosage. you recommend. I also suspect too much of Aqua also. My red tiger Lily has been growing very very fast.

But what is the difference in dosing in the Morning and night ?

Thanks in Advance.

Cheers

[stevensim]

Hi Bro Gwee,

In the Morning PH is 6.7, KH is 4 that work out to be 23ppm. In the night PH is 6.5 KH 4, that is 37ppm.

This has been taken in a 1 week period last week.

I have just Prune and remove as much of the hair algae as I can, did a 70% water change, clean the filter also yesterday.

Your suggested routine does not include the Lushgro aqua, do I still need to use it ?

Will monitor another week and see the result.


Thanks a million.

Cheers

[plantmania]

At night, only algae will be actively using your fert especially those brown/red algae..... During daytime, or with sufficient lights, plants will be actively consuming your fert. You dose to feed the plants , not algae

Passive consumption also happen at night, but not as much... Maybe someone else can say otherwise....

I find Peter's suggestion on the very high side....

E.g
PeterGwee suggested 10ml of Micros 3x ....That's very high.... Maybe he can explain why ? If the iron is not consumed, there are almost 20 ppm of Iron after the 3rd dosage.....

Your phosphate level is already 5 ppm with 4 grains..... 3 times a week as suggested by him with probably hit 15 ppm......

Seachem Equilibrium addition will probably brings all the chemical readings down to 0.1 ppm and below , common among mineral based stabilizers... Maybe the use here is to bring the high level of nutrients down?


[quote:17a8869814="stevensim"]Hi Bro Plantmania,

Sorry typo error, it is NO3.


Have done the Water change and following the dosage. you recommend. I also suspect too much of Aqua also. My red tiger Lily has been growing very very fast.

But what is the difference in dosing in the Morning and night ?

Thanks in Advance.

Cheers[/quote:17a8869814]

[PeterGwee]

[quote:260ee97da6="stevensim"]Your suggested routine does not include the Lushgro aqua, do I still need to use it ?[/quote:260ee97da6]

Stevensim, you do not need the lushgro aqua with the routine sugggested. The KNO3 dosage would cover both NO3 and K demands for plants over the week.

Regards
Peter Gwee

[PeterGwee]

[quote:77b0e56e9f="plantmania"]PeterGwee suggested 10ml of Micros 3x ....That's very high.... Maybe he can explain why ? If the iron is not consumed, there are almost 20 ppm of Iron after the 3rd dosage.....[/quote:77b0e56e9f]

You do not measure traces by proximity of Fe content. It is proven to be a lousy indicator. Dose the traces and measure the Fe....do the measurement again 2-3 hrs later...zero? Add more traces or Fe? Nah...the key to finding the optimal amount of traces requires you to keep the other nutrients and CO2 in good range before varying the amount to a certain tank size. Observe the plants over a couple of weeks to see if there is any improvement both in growth and quality..if there isn't, you have probably found the max rate needed.

[quote:77b0e56e9f="plantmania"]Your phosphate level is already 5 ppm with 4 grains..... 3 times a week as suggested by him with probably hit 15 ppm...... [/quote:77b0e56e9f]

Not sure what kind of rice you are eating but mine is approx. 1/64 tsp per rice grain which is about 0.7ppm-1ppm of PO4 per dose.

[quote:77b0e56e9f="plantmania"]Seachem Equilibrium addition will probably brings all the chemical readings down to 0.1 ppm and below , common among mineral based stabilizers... Maybe the use here is to bring the high level of nutrients down?[/quote:77b0e56e9f]

Eh...do you know what is Seachem Equilibrium? It is not for lowering Fe content (heck..any stuff doing that other than an RO filter?) but for increasing the GH (Mg/Ca) slightly so that it is not in limiting levels. Not so critical as long as there is enough of it.

Regards
Peter Gwee

[plantmania]

It might work well for your tank to add so much micros. I don't take measurements for Fe as test kits don't work well or work at all, estimation based on listed ingredients for that product. Stevensim can test it out... My opinion is that there might be a bloom on certain algae for his tank...

Anyway, ricegrain or not, that's how stevensim measured his dosage for PO4, and he ended up with 5 ppm. If he add more according to what is being mentioned, obviously the content will be much higher....Personally I use fleet enema so I don't measure by grains...

I have not used equilibrium or have anything against using it, but I know mineral based stabiliser tends to nerf trace elements. Equilibrium add Ca/Mg which is good, the greatest interest to me is probably K2O .... for the potassium, it all depends on my water supply and the mineral content already in my substrate. For Stevensim, it might be good for him to use, to supplement K, Ca and Mg. Another note is that it also add iron even though by a smaller degree.