Sump filter for Planted Tank

[wf7850]

Hi Guys

Just pondering, how many members here uses SUMP filter for their planted tanks?

Cos i am contemplating to swop my 2-tier 4ft tanks for one customised 5 or 6 ft tank c/w cabinet. The question is - what will be the best filter type? Two canisters? or sump?

Did a search on many forums for the pros and cons of a sump filter on a planted tank, some say good, some say okay... but no definite answer. therefore trying to get feedback on how many members here actually uses sump and have their advise.....

Thanks in advance.....

[vinz]

The short answer is: can, but not ideal.

Sumps are usually set up as trickle (aka wet-dry) filters. This kind of filter is designed to encourage gaseous exchange at the bio-media to provide enough oxygen for the bacteria in it. In a planted tank, you don't need that because the water is normally high on O2. It also causes high lost of CO2 which we want to keep.

I'ld say go with double canisters, or get the Eheim 2260. I'm using a 2250, but I've since upgraded the pump to the equivalent of that on the 2260.

2 canisters allow you to set up multiple inlets and outlets. The new/upcoming Eheims have dual inlet I think. Alternatively, you can split the outlets of the more power filters.

[wf7850]

i was thinking, if able to reduce the trickle part so that the media are all submerged in water, the amt of CO2 loss shld be reduced. anyway Vinz, thanks for the clear and concise explanations. really appreciate it.

[schema]

Vinz
How much did u paid for your 2250? and the upgrade pump?
was thinking of upgrading my current filter to 2260.....
any idea how much this beast will cost?
where to buy?
Anyway I am on a 5ft with 2028.....haiz...too slow.....

[vinz]

Schema,

I got my 2250 2nd hand as part of a package from another hobbyist. I've asked about a brand new one before but I can't remember the price. $400++ is the number in my head, but I can't trust it.

For the upgrade I bought a new Eheim 1260 Universal pump and some extra fittings, which came up to over $200.

Instead of upgrading to a 2260, why don't you just get another Ehiem 202X series filter? It's a cheaper option and you don't have to split the output.

[schema]

Vinz,
Are u suggesting me to get another filter to supplement?
I got another Jagno 200 (300l/hr), was thinking of adding but the extra plumbing, power consumption and the holes shortage(on the Euro bracing) is putting me off.
So now thinking of 1 single filter to do the job, potential candidate is 2260, but just measured my cabinet.....CANNOT FIT! wa lao!
The 2250(1000l/hr) with modded pump(to ??l/hr) might be good solution.

Are u selling your? upgrading? can talk? Heehee

[blur one]

From what I know there are 3 people using sump filters for planted tanks.... Michael Koh, Green Tea (Nick on AF Forum) and myself.

Yes CO2 Loss is high even if all media is under water as the cascading water down the pipes will cause CO2 loss.... but what I know is many people use sump filters for large planted tanks in the US.

For my 6 by 2.5 by 2.5 tank I go through a 5 liter btl of CO2 in about 2.5 months.

[vinz]

[quote:cf656ee364="schema"]...

Are u selling your? upgrading? can talk? Heehee [/quote:cf656ee364]

You wait long long, ok?

You might not need to upgrade the pump. I was running my 6ft on the 2250 without problems. In fact, initially it was too strong. The filtration guidelines don't scale up to large tanks very well. Besides, a planted tank does not really need that much media volume.

I upgraded the pump head only because I installed a chiller and needed to power the water thru that.

Oh wait, I just realised... the 2080 is also 1000l/hr right? Slowed down liao ah? Do you clean the filter and the impeller cavity regularly?

If it's mainly circulation problems, I suggest you get a couple of power heads and install them stragetically. The filtration is sufficient, it's more of a current issue.

If you have an internal CO2 reactor inline, consider running that with a powerhead instead of with the filter outlet. If you have NA's custom external CO2 reactor, check the tube in the middle... sometimes after long term use, it sinks down too low into the socket and actually block the flow.

Oh yah, if you decide to get a modified 2250, it might work out cheaper if you buy the 2250 spare parts from QianHu/YiHu and the desired Universal pump and self-assemble. I can help with that part if you want. Other then then pump, you will need to change some of the filter plumbing. Alternatively, just get the "dustbin" and use a different brand powerhead and do some (rather tricky) DIY with PVC pipes.

And measure whether the holes in your eurobracing can accomodate the input hose. Outlet hose for a 12XX series Universal Pump is 16mm (internal diameter). But the inlet hose for the 2250/2260 cannister is 25mm. There isn't a complete j-pipe for the 25mm either, so you will need a bit more space behind the tank. I have 2 to 3 inches of space behind my tank.

[schema]

Precisely, I am driving the water thru a chiller before entering the tank, so head loss is plenty.
Beside low circulation, I find the filtration is inadequate cos when I scrutinise the water, I can see particles floating about!

Setup:

tank --- tomtom skimmer --- 2082 --- external reactor(DIY) --- chiller ---tank

wat I identify problem area are
skimmer intake - intend to split the intake using splitter (possible?)
2082 - not power enuff.

I do clean the filter regularly and thoroughly, even took out the impellor and indicator ball to clean using toothbrush.

Thanks for the lead to QianHu, thats a good idea (buying spares), any idea how much the dustbin will cost?

Update price for 2250 is $280

[vinz]

Not sure on the prices.

Eheim sells each and every stand alone part as an individual item. So you need more then just the "dustbin".

You will need:
From 2250 http://www.eheimparts.com/client/product.aspx?type=2250
4007410 Double tap with quick release coupling for hose 4007940
4017200 Elbow connector for hose 4007940
4017300 Suction cup with clip for hose 4007940 (2 pieces)
7277650 Intake pipe
7472950 Inlet strainer
For the above items, I doubt you can find alternatives.

4007530 Hose clamp for hose 4007940 (2 pieces) Optional. You can just get the normal hose clamps from hardware/DIY shops.

7269300 Sealing ring
7276550 Upper lattice screen
7276600 Lower lattice screen
7276650 Sealing ring
7276900 Threaded inlet connector
7277050 Plastic nut
7290850 Base plate
7472800 Canister lid
7675700 Canister with lid securing clamp
7675850 Attachment set If it's just 4 screws and washers, you can always buy from hardware/DIY shop.

From 2260 http://www.eheimparts.com/client/product.aspx?type=2260
7675950 Suction elbow (to fit the 126X series universal pump)

This list excludes the hoses, outlet pipes, rain bar, etc, and the universal pump.

If 2250 is $280, I wonder if assembling from the spares makes $ense anymore. If you are inclined to, you can make a trip to Qian Hu and go browse the accessories mart with a calculator. The spares are all on the shelves. What you can't find, you can ask the counter staff for price and availability.

[wf7850]

[quote:82239a9282="blur one"]
For my 6 by 2.5 by 2.5 tank I go through a 5 ltr btl of CO2 in about 2.5 months.[/quote:82239a9282]

WOW...!!!! 5 ltr in 2.5 months....!!!!

comparing your 6ft tank of 1061 ltrs against my 2 x 4ft tanks with combined capacity of 508Ltrs, the 5 ltr CO2 that i have is still registering 1000PSI after 13 months running at 3bps..... hmmmm.... tis is really what i call HIGH CONSUMPTION....!!!!!!!!!!!!

blur one, i believe the costs of the refill is not that much an issue, it's rather the time and effort to have them refilled every 2.5 months..... rite???

[schema]

Paging for Vinz

So assuming if I buy a new 2250, I will only need to buy only the pump(1260) and the suction elbow set (7675950), rite?

Do u think I can buy the suction elbow set (7675950) anywhere else other than QianHu?

Mike

[vinz]

Got rid of my pager years ago. :P

Yes, you are right. 2250 + 126X universal pump + suction elbow set.

No idea who else might sell the suction elbow set. It's a rather uncommon part to wear out, so I wouldn't bet that any shops carry it normally. Maybe a friendly FLS can help you order in?

[joestoys]

If you have an internal CO2 reactor inline, consider running that with a powerhead instead of with the filter outlet. Vinz

Vinz is there a reason why running from a power head instead from filter? thanks

[PeterGwee]

[quote:7bfc6d95de="joestoys"]

If you have an internal CO2 reactor inline, consider running that with a powerhead instead of with the filter outlet. Vinz

Vinz is there a reason why running from a power head instead from filter? thanks [/quote:7bfc6d95de]

Filters are design to clog over a period of time and that can slow down flowrate which will affect the efficency and response time of the reactor. (CO2 levels will vary or drop if that happens and an undersize reactor will have poor CO2 issues.)

Regards
Peter Gwee

[blur one]

[quote:e38f5f8003="wf7850"]

blur one, i believe the costs of the refill is not that much an issue, it's rather the time and effort to have them refilled every 2.5 months..... rite???[/quote:e38f5f8003]

15 Bucks a refill at Nature...so its not that bad...sometimes when lugging the dammed CO2 tank I feel like changing to a cannister.....

[loupgarou]

blur one, i believe the costs of the refill is not that much an issue, it's rather the time and effort to have them refilled every 2.5 months..... rite???


15 Bucks a refill at Nature...so its not that bad...sometimes when lugging the dammed CO2 tank I feel like changing to a cannister.....

if cost not an issue, then get 5 tanks loh, change once a year..

----
as for lugging co2 tank. I now put the co2 tank in a luggage bag with wheels, roll it down to kovan mrt and fill it at system & control