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Thread: "Passionately Curious"

  1. #81
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Aquaria View Post
    Based on your video, it looks like both rotors at the top of the reactor are spinning quite well... the bottom part in the reactor is actually not a moving rotor, its just a permanently fixed support to center the up-flow tube.
    Oh man. I almost planning to trim it tonight. LOL. Thanks for enlightening me, UA!

    In that case, I will try to:
    - slower the CO2 bubbles release rate to see if the situation is better.
    - try to clear the air trap from the top of the reactor.

    Hopefully it can digest 100%.

    Here is the fine bubbles coming out from the out flow pipe.

    http://youtu.be/szINHfiEbRw


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  2. #82
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    When you started the filter and reactor after installing the hoses, did you tip the reactor into horizontal position so that most the initial excess trapped air was exhausted out from the chamber? If not, then it'll take quite a while for all that trapped air to clear out over time, including the air pockets from the filter too (shake the canister filter to get more of the trapped air bubbles out). Just have to wait until everything settles in.

    Normally there will be a Co2 gas pocket accumulating at the top of the reactor chamber when the Co2 injection is on... that is normal. When the Co2 injection is off, the Co2 gas pocket will gradually dissolve away and eventually there will be no more of it. Just check it at night when the Co2 injection is off to see if there is still a gas pocket, there shouldn't be. If there is then its probably air coming from the filter or somewhere in the joints that is accumulating air in the reactor.
    :: Urban Aquaria ::
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  3. #83
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Quote Originally Posted by Urban Aquaria View Post
    When you started the filter and reactor after installing the hoses, did you tip the reactor into horizontal position so that most the initial excess trapped air was exhausted out from the chamber? If not, then it'll take quite a while for all that trapped air to clear out over time, including the air pockets from the filter too. So just have to wait.

    Normally there will be a Co2 gas pocket formed at the top of the reactor chamber when the Co2 injection is on... thats normal. When the Co2 injection is off, the Co2 gas pocket will gradually dissolve away and eventually there will be no more of it. Just check it at night when the Co2 injection is off to see if there is still a gas pocket, there shouldn't be. If there is then its probably air coming from the filter or somewhere in the joints that is accumulating air in the reactor.
    Hi UA,

    I recall I did not tilt it horizontally during setup. There was lots of air inside the reactor during setup, but it was gone overnight and reactor run smoothly. I will check it tonight to see if the gas still there when CO2 is off. Hopefully there won't be. Thanks for your advice.


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  4. #84
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    I have checked the Reactor when CO2 was off and there is no air trap in it. The water even raised up into CO2 tube. Everything seems smoothly run. So I adjusted the CO2 rate a bit to see how it goes. Hopefully no bubbles come out tomorrow.

    http://youtu.be/vdvUeAOlIBQ


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  5. #85
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Hi @jackychun, nice thread please keep it going.


    Wanna share some info using the Ista Turbo CO2 reactor. I used this setup when I first got my CO2 system (after reading @UA's review). It worked very well, and the kinks and quirks are as per what @UA has mentioned, follow his advise and you're good.


    However I have recently removed it, reasons being:



    • I upgraded my filter from Eheim 2213 (450l/hr) to Eheim 2071 (950l/hr). The increased flow rate causes undissolved bubbles to be pushed out as per what you're experiencing. So high flow rate AND/OR high bubble count will cause this. IMO, this is just a minor annoyance.
    • Priming the canister with the inline reactor can be a chore. I would imagine this gets better with practise, and also when the system stabilises hence little need to touch the setup often. Again, slight annoyance.
    • The reactor's hose size is 12/16mm, so I had to use a reducer to step down from 16/22mm when connecting to my canister filter. This is the real show-stopper for me, as I later realised how important good flow is to a planted tank.
    • Sera has a 16/22mm reactor (actually Ista Turbo is a copy of that), but it's hard to come by in Singapore. Also, I'm sure it will still reduce flow rate regardless of hose size.



    I'm currently using an inline diffuser, it's out of the tank, fits my 16/22mm hose, less bulky, easy to setup, and I still get good pearling. Bubble count hasn't increased much. I do get slight misty effect (it's not as bad as I would've imagined) which I don't mind, and I read it's actually good for the plants.


    The biggest upside is now I get really GOOD flow though out my tank, and I'm still waiting to see if it has a positive effect long term.


    So, my advise is this: Don't get obsessed with 100% dissolve rate, it is useless unless you get the CO2 to all plants through good flow and distribution. Although your canister hose size doesn't need to be reduced, any inline equipment will impact flow rate. Observe and experiment, there's many ways to skin a cat. IMO, CO2 is cheap, don't go to it, let it come to you.


    Good luck!

  6. #86
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Are you referring to sera active reactor 1000? I couldt find it anywhere in the Internet about the hose size info, can you point me to it?

    Btw which inline reactor are you using now?, Up Aqua, Ista or Intense ? I need to buy one soon for my new setup

  7. #87
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    I read from AQ that both Sera 500 & 1000 fits 16/22mm hose. Do a forum search. GC used to sell it but I think they stopped bringing in, you can try calling them.

    I'm using Intense inline atomizer. I've used Intense in-tank atomizers before and I like their build quality. It's about $10 more expensive than Up-Aqua. Also, the new Up version is designed with "replaceable" parts, but I don't see replacements parts for sale anywhere which kinda defeats the purpose. I read the new Up version is prone to leaks due to this "enhancement", and the build quality is not as good (breaks easily). Do a search in AQ for this.

    Hint: I bought my Intense from petmart, auntie there is a nice lady and like to make small talks. Warm up to her and she always give discounts haha. Seaview has Up diffusers at good price but always no stock.

  8. #88
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    I finall have confirmation that sera 1000 fit 16/22mm hose.
    Attachment 52573
    Buy, Rob or Steal, I am going to get this

    May I know here did you put your intense inline diffuser? After the chiller and straight into the tank or before the chiller? I am trying to "eliminate" any potential mist in the tank.
    Last edited by Realcaster; 19th Mar 2016 at 01:03.

  9. #89
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Okay here's the thing, what I'm doing may raise a few eyebrowns so take it with a pinch of salt. My current setup is as such:

    Intake -> pre filter (mech/sponge/wool) -> inline diffuser -> Eheim 2071 (full biomedia) -> lily pipe

    The pre filter cleans the water before it hits the diffuser and enters the filter. The filter has only biomedia so as to make up for the loss in flow rate incurred by the prefilter. CO2 has to flow thru the biomedia before it hits the tank, thus helping to dissolve much fine bubbles and reduce the mist effect. I can add a layer of wool in the canister to further reduce mist but I figure flow rate is more important.

    Essentially I'm using the canister filter as a CO2 reactor. It's not a common method here in sg, but I've read many people have been doing this for years in UK/US with good results and no ill effect on the canister filter or bio system. There are talks about how it will kill the bacteria and spoil the filter but not a single documented case so I don't really buy it. Oh well, I'm doing it and will see if it really works! Been running this setup for almost a month. Prior was running an atomizer under my intake in tank when using a classic 2015, same principle.

    Also, Eheim filters seems to work best for this. I've tried doing this with the classics and pro 3 series without any problems. No air traps, no burping, no fish death. Then again my bubble count is low (2.5bps). YMMV!

  10. #90
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Btw you'll want to run the diffuser BEFORE the chiller. The idea is to let the fine bubbles travel thru as much hops and loops before it hits the tank. Fine bubbles from the atomizers are surprisingly easy to dissolve.

    Ista reactors uses the rotating blades to chop the CO2 into fine bubbles, and swirl them in the chamber to dissolve them. Same principle, different technique.

  11. #91
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Sorry Jacky for hijacking your thread

    oh well, let's continue .... You manage to eliminate all mist I presume?

  12. #92
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Sorry Jacky! Last comment on this I promise!

    @realcaster mist is greatly reduced but not completely eliminated. I noticed the mist is not obvious if you don't use black background. My tank's background is using frosted translucent film, won't notice the mist unless I press my nose on the glass. PM me for more questions!

  13. #93
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Hi Realcaster and Ivan Choo, I am glad that you guys discussing here. All of the information is very useful and lots to learn from.


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  14. #94
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    On the topic of external Co2 reactor i came across another from ista, which seems to be a better design but will cost abit more then the one uguys are using i think its close to $30 and im thinking of getting it
    http://www.tzong-yang.com.tw/en/prod...hp?item_id=407
    I was told the model is 540


    I-540-1.jpg
    I-540-3.jpg
    Looking at the installtion diagram.. there shouldnt be any trap air. what you guys think?

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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    @exo this works more like an inline diffuser than a reactor. Water passes straight thru it. The rotating blades don't really help much, I think it's more for asthetics. My bro in law uses this, he said the hose connection nut don't tighten well if your hose is soft (e.g. Grey hose, no Eheim green hose).

  16. #96
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Woah... thanks for the heads up... im gona use grey hose. Ill have to scrap this plan then.

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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    @exo The Ista inline diffuser at $30 a pop, I'd rather pay a bit more for Intense. If I'm not wrong, Intense was one of the first in market to introduce CO2 atomizers with super fine bubbles. Look around in LFS with nice and well maintained aquascapes (e.g. FB, GC), you can easily spot the Intense atomizers in their tanks.


    Funny thing is I hardly see LFS using CO2 reactors.


    @jackychun, in-tank or inline diffusers/atomizers are other options you can explore if you're feeling adventurous.

  18. #98
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan Choo View Post
    Hi @jackychun, nice thread please keep it going.


    Wanna share some info using the Ista Turbo CO2 reactor. I used this setup when I first got my CO2 system (after reading @UA's review). It worked very well, and the kinks and quirks are as per what @UA has mentioned, follow his advise and you're good.


    However I have recently removed it, reasons being:



    • I upgraded my filter from Eheim 2213 (450l/hr) to Eheim 2071 (950l/hr). The increased flow rate causes undissolved bubbles to be pushed out as per what you're experiencing. So high flow rate AND/OR high bubble count will cause this. IMO, this is just a minor annoyance.
    • Priming the canister with the inline reactor can be a chore. I would imagine this gets better with practise, and also when the system stabilises hence little need to touch the setup often. Again, slight annoyance.
    • The reactor's hose size is 12/16mm, so I had to use a reducer to step down from 16/22mm when connecting to my canister filter. This is the real show-stopper for me, as I later realised how important good flow is to a planted tank.
    • Sera has a 16/22mm reactor (actually Ista Turbo is a copy of that), but it's hard to come by in Singapore. Also, I'm sure it will still reduce flow rate regardless of hose size.



    I'm currently using an inline diffuser, it's out of the tank, fits my 16/22mm hose, less bulky, easy to setup, and I still get good pearling. Bubble count hasn't increased much. I do get slight misty effect (it's not as bad as I would've imagined) which I don't mind, and I read it's actually good for the plants.


    The biggest upside is now I get really GOOD flow though out my tank, and I'm still waiting to see if it has a positive effect long term.


    So, my advise is this: Don't get obsessed with 100% dissolve rate, it is useless unless you get the CO2 to all plants through good flow and distribution. Although your canister hose size doesn't need to be reduced, any inline equipment will impact flow rate. Observe and experiment, there's many ways to skin a cat. IMO, CO2 is cheap, don't go to it, let it come to you.


    Good luck!
    Hi Ivan,

    Thanks for your advice. Ya, as long as the plants grow well, that is fine for me, too.
    Anyway, I have reduced the CO2 bubble rates and can see less bubbles coming out from the outflow.

    Agree with you that the first priming made me sweat because I didn't expected that would be quite difficult to suck the water down. However, after sometimes that was fine. And once the filter started working, everything is fine.

    Since Eheim Ecco Pro 300 works with 12/16mm hose, that is just nice to work with this ISTA CO2 Reactor, so I don't have any issue with the connection so far. Just plug, connect and play.

    Very interesting discussion about CO2!
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  19. #99
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    I was doing some read up on Fluid Dynamics, apparently, smaller hose size does not affect the flow rate, however, it's the smaller hose size that causes higher frictions which actually slow down the flow. The lost in flow speed is due to frictional losses. For easier understanding, if you change to a 50mm diameter hose, the volume of water moved per hour remains the same, assuming there are no frictional lost.

    To minimize frictional lose, any transition to smaller hose size should be as short as possible.

    Now that is different from height of the pump outlet to the aquarium outlet, the higher is the tank outlet from the pump outlet, the slower will be the flow. It's just like a man need to carry a heavy load up the staircase, energy is loss. Any respectable pump maker will provide a graph on flowrate vs height, Eheim does.

    Hope this info helps
    Last edited by Realcaster; 19th Mar 2016 at 11:54.

  20. #100
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    Re: "Passionately Curious"

    Quote Originally Posted by Ivan Choo View Post
    @exo The Ista inline diffuser at $30 a pop, I'd rather pay a bit more for Intense. If I'm not wrong, Intense was one of the first in market to introduce CO2 atomizers with super fine bubbles. Look around in LFS with nice and well maintained aquascapes (e.g. FB, GC), you can easily spot the Intense atomizers in their tanks.


    Funny thing is I hardly see LFS using CO2 reactors.


    @jackychun, in-tank or inline diffusers/atomizers are other options you can explore if you're feeling adventurous.
    Hi exo, Ivan Choo,

    I actually intended to buy a inline diffusers at first since it is very compact in size and quite effective.
    I almost bought one ISTA External CO2 Ceramic Reactor (similar to an inline diffusers) from Nature Aquarium but they didn't have the size for 12/16mm hose but only 16/22mm.
    So, I decided to just buy ISTA External CO2 Reactor with the available size for 12/16mm hose. I was so lazy to do so many transition in hose size. :P

    ISTA has good video showing how to connect the above mentioned inline diffusers here. If you use 16/22mm hose, that would be good to try!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OXaPiorxgAo

    Jacob Aquarium also has a good review about the similar inline diffusers product. Also, I notice that Jacob advice is not to connect the inline diffusers from the inlet. Ivan, if your setup working fine, I think that might works too. For me, I play safe by just use it from the outlet.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ShDqHj0KlWM
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