My new tank

**setiardi** · 6th Jun 2002, 20:09

To add on, Now I recall weeks b4, my discus got sick when I introduce the Cycle product to start the bacteria in a new sponge foam filter. Took me a few weeks, lots of water change and patience with 1 casualty to get them healthy. I remember not adding that liquid then they ok.SO WATS THE PROBLEM MAN!

**kelstorm** · 6th Jun 2002, 20:22

Guyz, my tank now got problem.After slowly build up the bio-load, now 5kg of live rock and 4 damsel, all is well until I add the oceanfree bacteria 8000. I add abt 200l equivalent dose while my tank hold abt 160L. In a matter of 30 minutes my fish are dead.
did not want to spoil your feelings.. that is the main reasons why i dun trust those products.. i always believe in letting nature run its course.. i never believe in bacteria that can store into bottles..anyway..the only way to save those rocks is to leave them in a matured tank if available.. if not, it is bye bye for them... right now, if possible, let the tank mature.. which i figure, u did not follow and were anxious to stock it..i recalled mentioning it earlier... never mind.. let this be a lesson...right now, the only thing to do is to let the filtration mature..there is practically nothing that can be done..your system had 'collapse'.. u have to restart again.. i'm sorry..[] as for your skimmer, it is trying to remove the excess wastes.. this shows that it is working just fine..

**kelstorm** · 6th Jun 2002, 20:26

use the existing filter media.. and empty the contents of the oceanfree [

] stuff into the tank.. then let it cycle..till the water is clean and clear.. then take the measure.. if properly cycled, ammonia and nitrite should read zero, only then, i would advice stocking up slowly.. mind u.. the process can take up to 28 days.. dun make the same mistakes again..[:

] alternatively, get some filterwool from those aquarists with matured tanks.. me willing to spare u some if u are interested.. PM me...[:

]

**setiardi** · 6th Jun 2002, 20:27

Yup agreed, had this feeling once see my fishes got stress out.Lesson learnt. Anyway one of my damsel still hanging on, anyway give him only 10% chance.

**Wind** · 7th Jun 2002, 23:15

How much does a damsel cost? Cos $2 at LFS in Sembawang.

**DragonGoby** · 7th Jun 2002, 23:27

Hi Kel,

I'm pretty sure that bacteria can be bottled, it's probably in the dormant state, but then . we still can't be to sure about their claims of the bacteria being alive.

Probably what happened to the tank was that the bacteria multiplied too quickly, using p oxygen in the process and suffocating your fish - I believe it's a process related to eutrophication. Just don't add too much at the beginning and you'll do fine.

Good luck with your tank!

Regards,
Hong Yee

**Marine** · 8th Jun 2002, 11:43

Hi Kel,

As for my case, my tank is now with corals &amp; livestock but the ammonia &amp; nitrite are still present and reads 0.5 ppm for ammonia and 0.2 ppm for nitrite. This readings have been the same for a long time (going to a mth). How to bring them low ?

**setiardi** · 8th Jun 2002, 13:48

DragonGoby, me agree 100%. Kelstorm, not to teach the master but I feel all is not lost yet.I did not bottoms up the liquid bacteria coz in doing so my liverock will definitely go. Wat I did is to circulate the tank and aerate it.Add my spare Otto internal filter and eheim 2227. 2 hours later skimmer back to normal (very little foam)Did 25% wc using DI unit yesterday and add (again) 2 damsel as a test.Both are alive, kicking and eating too. I rig the sanders using a 1.5l bottle with a 1/2&quot; PVC pipe as the collection cup. Will cycle tank for 14 days and check water parameter again. Target 0 ppm NH3. Equipment I can buy, time cannot. Anyway getting a chiller today. Cheers.

**kelstorm** · 8th Jun 2002, 23:30

How much does a damsel cost? Cos $2 at LFS in Sembawang.
----------------
Abt $1 at harlus..[:

]

**kelstorm** · 8th Jun 2002, 23:54

I'm pretty sure that bacteria can be bottled, it's probably in the dormant state, but then . we still can't be to sure about their claims of the bacteria being alive.
well, IMO, to bottle bacteria, yes.. it can be done.. but bacteria being alive?? i really doubt it.. and since it cannot be kept alive due to lack of oxygen and 'food', am i right to say that what u are purchasing is 'dead bacteria'? as such, why bother?? dun mind me.. me is strongly against the using such stuff..me prefer to use the natural method

Probably what happened to the tank was that the bacteria multiplied too quickly, using p oxygen in the process and suffocating your fish - I believe it's a process related to eutrophication. Just don't add too much at the beginning and you'll do fine.
alternatively, as the ammonia is rising due to the excess waste, it could be that your fishes are dying from ammonia poisoning

As for my case, my tank is now with corals &amp; livestock but the ammonia &amp; nitrite are still present and reads 0.5 ppm for ammonia and 0.2 ppm for nitrite. This readings have been the same for a long time (going to a mth). How to bring them low ?
Ivan, try reducing the feeding.. have u been adding stuff regularly???.. and how long have u run your tank.. is it a month? based on your above statement?.. what i figure could be that ur filter is not able to support the bio-load. U can try NOT adding anymore stuff till both your ammonia and nitrite readings are zero.

Wat I did is to circulate the tank and aerate it.Add my spare Otto internal filter and eheim 2227. 2 hours later skimmer back to normal (very little foam)Did 25% wc using DI unit yesterday and add (again) 2 damsel as a test.Both are alive, kicking and eating too. I rig the sanders using a 1.5l bottle with a 1/2&quot; PVC pipe as the collection cup. Will cycle tank for 14 days and check water parameter again. Target 0 ppm NH3. Equipment I can buy, time cannot. Anyway getting a chiller today. Cheers.
Chiller? mind.. u are really willing to spend.. to target zero NH3.. pls be patient..err.. i dun understand what u mean by &quot;equipment i can buy, time cannot&quot;.. time is an impt essence here leh... it will go down naturally...anyway..me know that u did not empty the contents into the tank (i figured that u have more sense than that based on FW keeping;eg, u dun empty the entire content of anti-biotics and expect miracles).. in the meantime, do continue to monitor the water parameters.. if 2 weeks is not enuff, go another week..

**setiardi** · 13th Jun 2002, 10:10

Now NH3 abt 0~0.25 mg/l.N03 &amp; N02 is picking up too. NH3 will pick up again I guess since adding 12kg of liverock, my final batch.Total now abt 24kg.And yes, continue using the bottle bacteria - less dosage this time.Will update on my DIY skimmer, got leak problems.

**kelstorm** · 13th Jun 2002, 10:57

Now NH3 abt 0~0.25 mg/l.N03 &amp;amp;amp; N02 is picking up too. NH3 will pick up again I guess since adding 12kg of liverock, my final batch.Total now abt 24kg.And yes, continue using the bottle bacteria - less dosage this time.Will update on my DIY skimmer, got leak problems.
----------------
in the meantime, dun add anymore stuff.. let your filter stablise first.. till the NH3 and NO2 hits zero..

**setiardi** · 14th Jun 2002, 13:46

Hi, surprisingly NH3 is 0 with NO3 12.5mg/l and NO2 at 1.6mg/l.Nitrite is coming down and nitrate is peaking. Need I change water now.Thought the addition of 12kg of rock will cause another cycle of NH3?

**DragonGoby** · 14th Jun 2002, 20:00

Probably why you're getting 0 readings for NH3 is that since your system is set up, the bacteria present would have quickly converted NH3 to N03 and NO2. Hence the high levels of NO3 ad NO2 you observe. It's a still high, so don't add any more livestock until nitrites reach 0ppm.

You're doing well - good luck! =)

Regards,
Hong Yee

**kelstorm** · 14th Jun 2002, 22:12

Probably why you're getting 0 readings for NH3 is that since your system is set up, the bacteria present would have quickly converted NH3 to N03 and NO2. Hence the high levels of NO3 ad NO2 you observe. It's a still high, so don't add any more livestock until nitrites reach 0ppm.
----------------
i agree with HongYee.. dun add anymore stuff.. and let the nitrite go down to zero.. changing water will only reduce the nitrates.. but that is not impt now.. it is still fine.. [

]

**setiardi** · 20th Jul 2002, 17:57

This is my tank after 3 months of setup. Currently still using 3 types of filters. A sump + overflow, a 2227 wet/dry filter and internal filter. Actually the last 2 filter mentioned will be sort of temporary until I'm sure my sump is really ready. Currently have 2 chromis, 1 maroon clownfish, 1 damsel and 1 emperor angelfish. Twice added the flame angelfish and purple firefish - both times died. Had my cleaner and fire shrimp die too. All died within 24 hrs of proper introduction. They are the last animals I added before I got algae outbreak 2 weeks back. My water parameters are all 0 No2,No3 and NH3.Ph is ard 8.3.Temp is within 26-27 range with chiller. Also have a few hard and soft coral. All fish and corals are added one at a time. So far my snails left 4 from 6 since adding 1 month ago. Also 1 orange legged hermit. Could the fatalities due to too much too fast. Or just my luck bought sick fish.Anyway pls comment on my tank, no idea if it's really healthy. So far everything else is ok.

**Tigger** · 20th Jul 2002, 23:48

Just to share some info.

Lighting
Recommendation is 2-5W per gallon. Yr tank is abt 15galon. Having 2x36W PL should do the job. Maybe u would like to consider 10 000K PL. More blueish. Gd for coral.

As for the aglae bloom, I supect u on the lite for too long a duration. I have talk to Patrick of marinelife, he recomend 6hrs white lite and 2 hrs actinic to prevent algae boom. thanks

**kelstorm** · 20th Jul 2002, 23:56

firstly, is that brown algae on the rocks? if so, chances are, not enuff lights is reaching it.. considering the fact that it is right on top.. if not, using blue lights is difficult to tell leh.. 3 filtrations methods.. that is a lot leh.. lets not forget that your live rocks and sand bed will provide another further filtration.. honestly, speaking, i can't seem to find any fault with the water parameters.. dun really know how come the fishes died.. sorry to hear that..[:

]

**setiardi** · 21st Jul 2002, 09:44

Tigger me tank have 2xpl 2sets.One set is 2x 10k and another set actinic blue and 65k.Thinking of adding a single PL set for actinic bulb. As for the brown algae at the top rock, actually the pic is a bit misleading. Had just rearrange the rocks prior to taking pics.Most probably that one was at the bottom.

**kelstorm** · 21st Jul 2002, 16:01

i know it is a bit ex.. perhaps u would like to try with other dwarf angels first? like coral beauty? to test the water again?? [:

]

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