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Thread: Some notes on my new Hailea Chiller

  1. #61
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    I think there are some assumptions to be made.

    for artica chillers, on their website, they state that 1HP = 12,000 BTU
    so a 1/4 hp artica chiller has a 3000/hr btu chilling capacity.

    --
    meanwhile, a 1/10 hp aqua euro chiller has a 1485 btu capacity, that makes it even more efficient at 1hp = 14850 btu

    --
    the teco tr 20 has a 1/3hp but a btu of 2620 so 1hp = 7860 btu
    teco tr 15 has a 1/5 hp but a btu of 2065 so 1hp = 10325 btu
    --



    Hailea's website does not show the BTU ratings, maybe the spec sheet that comes with the chiller might.
    http://www.hailea.com/produce.htm


    so as one can see, (IN THE aquarium CHILLER industry) BTU has no direct relationship to HP.
    I suspect though that there is a relationship of HP to actual power.

    (thus it is probable, not all 1/4 hp cool equally, but they probably consume the same amount of power?)

    ---
    so for the more adventurous. is it possible to calculate a theoretical power consumption of a chiller based on

    BTU, horsepower (or actual power), the amount of water to be chilled , specific heat capacity of water and air, the desired temperature and ambient temperature)

    I foresee calculus is involved.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refrigeration
    Domestic and commercial refrigerators may be rated in kJ/s, or Btu/h of cooling. Commercial refrigerators are mostly rated in tons of refrigeration. One ton of refrigeration capacity can freeze one short ton of water at 0 °C (32 °F) in 24 hours. Based on that:

    Latent heat of ice (i.e., heat of fusion) ≈ 144 Btu / lb (or 334.5 kJ/kg)
    One short ton = 2000 lb
    Heat to be extracted = 2000 * 144 = 288000 Btu / 24 hours = 12000 Btu/hour = 200 Btu / Minute
    1 ton refrigeration = 200 Btu / minute = 3.517 kJ/s = 3.517 kilowatts[8]
    A much less common definition is: 1 tonne of refrigeration is the rate of heat removal required to freeze a metric ton (i.e., 1000 kg) of water at 0 °C in 24 hours. Based on the heat of fusion being 334.5 kJ/kg, 1 tonne of refrigeration = 13,938 kJ/h = 3.872 kW. As can be seen, 1 tonne of refrigeration is 10% larger than 1 ton of refrigeration.

    Most residential air conditioning units range in capacity from about 1 to 5 tons of refrigeration.
    --
    I suspect horsepower to be an arbritary labelling in the aquarium industry anyway, look at wattage and btu where possible, for any wattage, the higher btu is probably the more desirable one to get where cost is not a concern
    Last edited by loupgarou; 29th Aug 2006 at 16:22.

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    Quote Originally Posted by loupgarou
    I suspect though that there is a relationship of HP to actual power.

    (thus it is probable, not all 1/4 hp cool equally, but they probably consume the same amount of power?)
    I have provided examples in my earlier posting in this thread that shows clearly that same hp ratings of different brands of chillers does not consume the same power. And this is quite easily understood because different designs has different efficiency.

    However all these while I always thought the hp:BTU conversion ratio is a fixed industry number/standard.
    What you have suggested now makes sense and help to explain why different brands of chiller of the same hp rating often claim they can chill different size of water volume. Granted different brands probably have different conditions when conducting their lab test but I used to think it is bullcrap. However with your explaination it all makes sense.

    It is probably interesting now to note that H20 LFS, which distribute Teco chiller in Singapore (or so they claimed) actually refused to rate their chiller in terms of hp. They told me hp rating is not universally acceptable for aquarium chiller.

    So we cannot trust the hp ratings of aquarium chiller, since they do not reference to the same BTU conversion.
    And we cannot trust the hp to power consumption, since different chillers has different efficiency.

    Now I wonder if we can completely trust the power consumption (watt) declared by chiller manufacturer.
    Last edited by vinz; 29th Aug 2006 at 18:29. Reason: Corrected mistaken editing by moderator.

  3. #63
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    Electrical power consumption and chilling capacity is not so directly related.

    It depends on the chiller design. Therefore, different makes have different HP corresponding the wattage.

    BC

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    Quote Originally Posted by loupgarou
    I think there are some assumptions to be made.

    for artica chillers, on their website, they state that 1HP = 12,000 BTU
    so a 1/4 hp artica chiller has a 3000/hr btu chilling capacity.

    --
    meanwhile, a 1/10 hp aqua euro chiller has a 1485 btu capacity, that makes it even more efficient at 1hp = 14850 btu

    --
    the teco tr 20 has a 1/3hp but a btu of 2620 so 1hp = 7860 btu
    teco tr 15 has a 1/5 hp but a btu of 2065 so 1hp = 10325 btu
    --



    Hailea's website does not show the BTU ratings, maybe the spec sheet that comes with the chiller might.
    http://www.hailea.com/produce.htm


    so as one can see, (IN THE aquarium CHILLER industry) BTU has no direct relationship to HP.
    I suspect though that there is a relationship of HP to actual power.

    (thus it is probable, not all 1/4 hp cool equally, but they probably consume the same amount of power?)

    ---
    so for the more adventurous. is it possible to calculate a theoretical power consumption of a chiller based on

    BTU, horsepower (or actual power), the amount of water to be chilled , specific heat capacity of water and air, the desired temperature and ambient temperature)

    I foresee calculus is involved.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Refrigeration


    --
    I suspect horsepower to be an arbritary labelling in the aquarium industry anyway, look at wattage and btu where possible, for any wattage, the higher btu is probably the more desirable one to get where cost is not a concern
    1HP = 12,000BTU (in terms of heat exchange). It is NOT arbitary!

    "meanwhile, a 1/10 hp aqua euro chiller has a 1485 btu capacity, that makes it even more efficient at 1hp = 14850 btu" does not make sense.


    BC

  5. #65
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    The HP rating used may the the design rating while the BTU/h is the actual rating...

    ... maybe... just speculating.

    In school, I never used HP for calculation of heat exchangers... always BTU/h or kW.

    BC

  6. #66
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    I think this is the answer the Loupgarou intended to post, but ended up mistakenly editing Nicky's post instead. I have ALMOST made a similar mistake before.

    Loupgarou, if I'm wrong, please speak up.

    -----------------

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicky
    I have provided examples in my earlier posting in this thread that shows same hp ratings of different brand chillers does not consume the same power.
    there is a possibility that hp is related to true power and the wattage list that you give is actual power, so to cause of the difference is the different power factor between the various chiller .

    nonetheless, hp cannot be used to judge the cooling power of a chiller, only BTU rating can.


    --
    Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
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    A woman: without her, man is nothing.

  7. #67
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    1HP = 12,000BTU (in terms of heat exchange). It is NOT arbitary!

    "meanwhile, a 1/10 hp aqua euro chiller has a 1485 btu capacity, that makes it even more efficient at 1hp = 14850 btu" does not make sense.
    what I mean is that, the 1hp =12000 is stated in jbj site. however, if one checks the ratings for other chillers, they will state
    1/10 hp, BTU 1485

    which like you said is hardly correct ...

    sources:

    http://www.aquatictech.com/chillers.html
    http://www.northcoastmarines.com/chillers.htm
    http://www.drsfostersmith.com/Produc...&N=2004+113768

    even if one were to state that 1hp = 12,000 ideally except for losses due to efficiency, hardly excuses this one "1/4 3,926btu" which implies 1hp = 15704btu

    so maybe the labelling is arbritary , or very approximated. ie: 1/4 hp labelling approx 0.32hp?

  8. #68
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    BTW, 1 HP is a proper scientific unit.

    1HP = 1 ton of chilling = 12,000 BTU/h

    As you said it, the way they put the HP in the specs really do not make any sense... may I should email one of those chiller makers to get their response.

    BC

  9. #69
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    Actually what loupgarou says is correct. In the commercial world we go by ton of refrigeration. When you tell a chiller make and tell them you want a 200hp chiller they have no idea what you are talking about.

    The most important thing is your Delta T. The difference temperuture between the input water temperuture (into the tank) and the water temperuture out of the tank. From there you can design your chiller capacity.

    As for what wattage it requires to run the chiller it all depends on the compressor and the design of chiller. Take my ex company for example, the chiller runs almost 24/7 so using a inverter compressor will use less power than a conventional compressor.

    Well, at least this is what the chiller manufacturer BS to me when my ex company wants to replace their old chiller and I was put in charge of the project.

  10. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by ranmasatome
    Err... this really confuses me.. IF Sp charges for apparent power... which is IV...then there would be no point in putting in those regulators since power factor is no where in teh equation and you still get charged whether you use the device or not.

    IF they charge for actual or true power which is IV x pf... then it would make sense .. cos putting in those regulators would give you a better power factor (lower) and hence save you more money.. no??
    apparent power is a vector sum of true power and reactive power.
    improving the power factor will reduce the reactive power, thus reducing the apparent power.
    thomas liew

  11. #71
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    I have finally rigged up my Hailea chiller model HC500. I have praised this chiller so much but the preliminary experience has not been good..

    There are some things that I like about the chiller but there are some things about it that are really bothering me. Bother me so much that I planned to go back to Petmart that sold me this to get it replaced.. Petmart gave me 1 year warranty. Let's see if they will stick to their words. I will report the outcome here.


    - Most serious one.. the internal thermometer of the chiller sucks. When it is showing 25C, my cheap thermometer is showing 23.5C and the water is freaking cold to the touch. Not only that, from 25C (when the chiller turns off) to 26C it only take less than 15 min !!!! Meanwhile my cheap thermometer did not even show 1C change. My tank is slight bigger than 4x2x2 ft. This cannot be because the ambient temperature is only 28.5C and the photo-period of my tank is long over. I am using Eheim 2028 to push the flow through the chiller. The specs say 1200-3000 L/hr. Is it possible the problem is due to the flow rate? I seriously doubt so, as SystemControl who also sells this chiller, told me a seperate controller is needed to prevent the chiller from kicking in 'too frequently, as frequent as every few minute'. Definitely sounds like same problem I am facing now. Unfortunately the problem (as well as why the additional controller is needed) was not properly articulate to me when I asked and because of that, I was not able to justify to myself paying more than half of the chiller price for the additional gadget. So looks like my problem is not an isolated one..


    - The hose connector is slightly too big for the eheim 18/22mm hose. I have to use boiling water to expand the hose plus use 2 fingers to make the hose wider and use vaseline to force the hose onto the connector. It is really bad design. Makes me think of the chinese saying 'close-door-manufacture-car'. Looks like Hailea still do not know the common size of the hoses used by aquarium hobbists in the world today..


    - Though the digital display is showing 1 decimal place, the temp cannot be set to that resolution; you can only set the temp to the next whole number.


    - This chiller is not as quiet as what I heard at one of the LFS. Probably that LFS is very noisy. In actual fact it sounds like those cheap mini-fridge when it is running. I would strongly discourage you to use it if your fish tank is in your bedroom, unless your objective is to drive your spouse/gf/bf away.


    - As expected the English used in the instruction booklet sucks. So bad that I have to read most of the paragraphs a few times aloud before understand the possible meaning. Why can't Hailea get a proper translation?


    So looks like I have bought myself a big black lemon with blue digital display. I took lots of pictures showing each steps of the installation but I don't think you want to see them now that I have reported so much problems with this chiller.

    Will report what Petmart says.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicky
    Here's the reply from spservices.. hehe.. I'm right..


    yes. i got it wrong.
    actually, the answer is there all the time; kwh power meter - kilowatt means true power.

    however, do note that the electrical tariff for home users have factored in the potential poor power factor that arise from running many reactive loads. thus, home users electrical tariff are higher than industrial users.
    thomas liew

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    Quote Originally Posted by ranmasatome
    Low tension accounts????? whats that? like people that dont use as much compared to big establishments e.g. takashimaya??
    Would those qualify as high tension accounts?? so its safe to presume taht for those accounts they use a different formula...hmmm...?? so perhaps thats why they use those power factor ehancers??
    low tension accounts - home users whose supply are 240v
    high tension accounts - generally buildings/facilities with their own transformer rooms and takes in 22kv and probably 66kv. these facilities' electrical tariff are made up of 4 components and do benefit from power factor correction equipment.
    thomas liew

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicky
    I have finally rigged up my Hailea chiller model HC500. I have praised this chiller so much but the preliminary experience has not been good..

    There are some things that I like about the chiller but there are some things about it that are really bothering me. Bother me so much that I planned to go back to Petmart that sold me this to get it replaced.. Petmart gave me 1 year warranty. Let's see if they will stick to their words. I will report the outcome here.


    - Most serious one.. the internal thermometer of the chiller sucks. When it is showing 25C, my cheap thermometer is showing 23.5C and the water is freaking cold to the touch. Not only that, from 25C (when the chiller turns off) to 26C it only take less than 15 min !!!! Meanwhile my cheap thermometer did not even show 1C change. My tank is slight bigger than 4x2x2 ft. This cannot be because the ambient temperature is only 28.5C and the photo-period of my tank is long over. I am using Eheim 2028 to push the flow through the chiller. The specs say 1200-3000 L/hr. Is it possible the problem is due to the flow rate? I seriously doubt so, as SystemControl who also sells this chiller, told me a seperate controller is needed to prevent the chiller from kicking in 'too frequently, as frequent as every few minute'. Definitely sounds like same problem I am facing now. Unfortunately the problem (as well as why the additional controller is needed) was not properly articulate to me when I asked and because of that, I was not able to justify to myself paying more than half of the chiller price for the additional gadget. So looks like my problem is not an isolated one..


    - The hose connector is slightly too big for the eheim 18/22mm hose. I have to use boiling water to expand the hose plus use 2 fingers to make the hose wider and use vaseline to force the hose onto the connector. It is really bad design. Makes me think of the chinese saying 'close-door-manufacture-car'. Looks like Hailea still do not know the common size of the hoses used by aquarium hobbists in the world today..


    - Though the digital display is showing 1 decimal place, the temp cannot be set to that resolution; you can only set the temp to the next whole number.


    - This chiller is not as quiet as what I heard at one of the LFS. Probably that LFS is very noisy. In actual fact it sounds like those cheap mini-fridge when it is running. I would strongly discourage you to use it if your fish tank is in your bedroom, unless your objective is to drive your spouse/gf/bf away.


    - As expected the English used in the instruction booklet sucks. So bad that I have to read most of the paragraphs a few times aloud before understand the possible meaning. Why can't Hailea get a proper translation?


    So looks like I have bought myself a big black lemon with blue digital display. I took lots of pictures showing each steps of the installation but I don't think you want to see them now that I have reported so much problems with this chiller.

    Will report what Petmart says.

    Nick,

    Sorry to hear that you have so much problem. I guess the old chinese saying is still true "1 penny money, 1 penny goods"...

    Looks like a china product is still a china product.

  15. #75
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    Petmart has asked the distributor to contact me.
    The distributor will send somebody to my place to see what they can do.
    Will report the outcome.

    Meanwhile, since I've already taken the pictures of the chiller, I thought might as well share it here..

    Views from the outside of the box








  16. #76
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    View when the box was opened






  17. #77
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    Air Filter






    Inside of the Chiller






    Label on the compressor (not made by Mitsubishi, damn.. got cheated )






    Labels on the outside



    Last edited by Nicky; 3rd Sep 2006 at 15:08.

  18. #78
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    Hose Connector and Connection
    Noticed how badly stretched the eheim hose is?







    Final Layout in the cabinet


  19. #79
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    The chiller looks very similar to the Resun chillers. From your description, the operation also seems to be like Resun's.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicky
    ...
    - Most serious one.. the internal thermometer of the chiller sucks. When it is showing 25C, my cheap thermometer is showing 23.5C and the water is freaking cold to the touch. Not only that, from 25C (when the chiller turns off) to 26C it only take less than 15 min !!!! Meanwhile my cheap thermometer did not even show 1C change. My tank is slight bigger than 4x2x2 ft. This cannot be because the ambient temperature is only 28.5C and the photo-period of my tank is long over. I am using Eheim 2028 to push the flow through the chiller. The specs say 1200-3000 L/hr. Is it possible the problem is due to the flow rate? I seriously doubt so, as SystemControl who also sells this chiller, told me a seperate controller is needed to prevent the chiller from kicking in 'too frequently, as frequent as every few minute'. Definitely sounds like same problem I am facing now. Unfortunately the problem (as well as why the additional controller is needed) was not properly articulate to me when I asked and because of that, I was not able to justify to myself paying more than half of the chiller price for the additional gadget. So looks like my problem is not an isolated one..
    ...
    Yes, it should be flowrate problem. I have that problem when the flowrate is too low. The "reservoir" or cooling chamber inside gets cool too fast cut off before the flowrate is fast enough to cycle the water.

    BC

  20. #80
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    How about the inaccuracy of build-in thermometer? Do you know why it is showing 27.xC when my external one is showing 25C?

    Surely if the flowrate is too slow it should be the reversed, right?

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