Thinking of Marine Tank

[blackghost]

Hi guys

i'm thinking of going full marine for my 2ft tank. can anyone advise me what are the equipments nessarary for the setup?

this is my 2nd try. my 1st try was unsucessful.that was 5-6 years ago. so i'm now going through carefully what is needed to setup a marine tank.

i'm thinking of putting in live rocks, some corals, 1-2 anemones, and tropical marine fishes.

best if you guys could include the brand and cost of the equipment, it would much easier for me to do my research.


many thanks in advance

[BFG]

My 1st advice would be for you to get the biggest tank you could afford. But if a 2ft is what you want, then get the biggest 2ft available! But beware though, if you choose a tank which is higher than 2ft, you might have a problem with your hand reaching the back bottom and lighting to reach the sandbed where some of the corals might be placed.

2nd advice is for you to get a very good skimmer. Don't skimp on this important device for your tank. Branded stuff do work and they work really well. Personally, I'll go with Deltec. Deltec MCE 600 is the model you should aim for if your setup does not include a sump. Had seen a reefer using this model with success without using a sump. His only complaint was that the skimmer collection cup was too small and had to be emptied every 3 days. If you want to use a sump in your setup, I'll recommend a APF600. Below is a link for you to see the price list and the place where you can buy the equipment.

http://www.reefdepot.com.sg/

3. Lighting. ATI light tubes are the best if you are going for a T5 setup. IF money is not a problem get the ATI Powermodule. If otherwise, other lightset with parabolic reflector is enough. There are 2 light sponsor in this forum. Find them in the sponsor section. Or you could check out the buy and sell section in the marine forum locally.

4. Chiller. This is a must in my personal experience. Don't try to do a setup without one. If cash is not a problem, Arctica 1/5hp is the one to aim for. If otherwise, Resun CL450 should be just nice, CL650 if it's a 2x2x2ft tank.

Other stuff you'll need.
A couple of timer for your lightset. 2 media reactor, 1 for phosphate and 1 for carbon to be connected in series with phosphate 1st follow by carbon. Phosphate media to absorb phosphate in the water column and carbon to remove the yellowing compound. These reactor will be placed in the sump though. Drip kalkwasser to replace water that are being evaporated and add calcium for the coral. Wavemaker to provide circulation in the tank and to prevent deadspot from occuring in certain part of the tank. If possible, use distilled water with salt mix, not tap water. Use distilled water too for your top-up.

The points above are just summarised in order for you to make an informed decision. You'll need to do your own research in order for you to have success in your own setup. Refer to the Marine Link sticky that I have compiled. There are also links to some local reefing forum. This hobby require patience and time to develop. Nothing good ever happen fast in reefing.

[blackghost]

wow..

i didnt know it needed that much effort.

some LFS gave me the impression that marine tanks are easy to setup and maintain, an example will be a small 1ft tank with a hangon filter.

and i have the notion that the difference between freshwater and marine tanks are the protein skimmer and live rocks.


ok. thanks for the information. regarding the chiller.. do i really need it if i want to keep a tropical marine tank? since tropical marine would be the same temperature as in singapore?

[BFG]

Yup, lfs do give you impression that it is easy. If you see my setup and the cost that is involved, you could have nightmare. On a serious note, there are alot of work involved with marine setup. You could do it cheap but you'll need to tinker with your setup every week or you could do the lazy man setup using automation but the cost will be very high and you still need to tinker with your tank every week, just that you'll spend lesser time than the previous setup. Provided you know what you are doing.

You could start spending time reading on various marine forum on the needs and knowledge to maintain the upkeep of a marine setup. I have spent quite a period of time reading up but I do learn something new every week. It is hard at 1st but it is not impossible.

[ah fat]

of course there are low cost substitutes for marine too.

cooling options - use pc fans or a diy chiller, rem someone selling for 30bucks
protein skimmer - use a weipro(30-40bucks for 2011) or macro with a good pump(30bucks)
live rocks - standard must have with the more the better. 5bucks/kg at lfs
powerheads - think is quite important since water movement is important
media reactors - if you got the money, why not?? but if you don't, get a cannister 2nd hand for around 30 bucks and dump the phosphate(20-50bucks) and carbon(quite cheap if im not wrong) media in it. though it won't be as efficient.
water - tap water + chlorine and chloramine removers. though there will be phosphate in it.
lights - since you are keeping coral than you need a strong one. a 3 tubes t5ho lowest around 70 i heard

additional items - anemones needs super strong lights. dn think you should try on beginning.
you will spend tons on additives and food for corals and fishes

there can be never ending good and expensive stuff, for me, i will settle with average and cheap stuff. all prices is of what i know at the moment and may not be accurate

[blackghost]

so safe to say...

that if all the things you guys recommend and listed here.. i shld be able to run a marine tank.. quite successfully rite?

[ah fat]

hey bro, cannot say like that.
success or failure also depends on how much effort you put in.
what i listed is the bare minimum required.
i do have a rougly 3gal tank with star polys, zoos, a clown, a boxer shrimp, 2 snails and 2 featherduster.
it runs ons a hanging filter with a phillip 16w light and a pc fan and a airdriven skimmer.
i would say its hardwork to maintain with the algae boom (no phos remover) and water change regulary.

it would be better if you read up and decide what you want to put in the tank.
will give a better idea of what is needed on what is not for it to be successful

[BFG]

Ah Fat is right. There are no guarantee. You could spend alot of money but it won't guarantee success. Also, success, as a whole depend on individual. Some will be happy with an anemone and a few clownfish and will call it a success while other will go all out and keep alot of corals and call it a success. You'll need to read more and choose the kind of setup that you'll be happy with. No 2 tanks will be the same and your mileage may vary. The most important thing is to have the parameter in the right level. Whether you go the cheap route or branded, is another matter.

[ah fat]

oh.. mentioning about the right parameters. think you MUST look at how and what to get for maintain such parameters too.
my small tank went ka-boom killing 6 fishes and a lobster before i know there is such thing.
and talking about lobsters, there are compatitability regarding live stocks.
lobsters kills small fish. so dn buy lobsters. haha. i regretted buying it.
sounds sadistic but i was happy it died.

[blackghost]

orh. okay. then can you guys tell me about basic marine tank water parameters then?

i've been going through websites.. but somehow.. i dont seem to understand anything.

different sites provide different information.

at least when i come here, i get a clear cut answer from the pros.


thanks in advance

[ah fat]

im not a pro but what i know is

magnesium aka (mg)
calcium aka (ca)
carbonate aka alkanity aka (kh) aka water hardness
acidity aka ph
nitrate aka no3
nitrite aka no2
ammonia aka nh3

this are the basic you will need to take note. for beginner you should read from bottom upwards as the most important.

ammonia will appear in new tank -> convert to nitrite -> convert to nitrate -> convert to hamless nitrogen gas.

the ammonia and nitrite part is fast and the only part to worry is when you just started the tank and there is not enought bacteria.

the nitrate part is harder as the bacteria needs to be anaerobic so always accumulate thus requiring frequen water changes to assist removal.

ph for marine should like around 8.1 to 8.4

kh is needed for coral growth and to buffer ph changes

calcium and magnesium is for hard coral growth which you will eventually go into next time.

[blackghost]

thanks for the information guys.

i've being going around looking for equipment.. but this are just basic research..

what would you recommended? cannister filters or hang-on filters? considering.. i have 200-300 dollars for the whole setup.. including decorations and livestock

and also, the media reactor, what the price range like? cant seem to spot any media reactor in the more common LFS..

erm, i'm setting up a 60cmX30cmX38cm marine tank next month hopefully. now i'm already in the process of converting my freshwater setup to a brackish setup for my puffers, intending to go all the way to marine..

meanwhile, me doing my theory research.

any pointers? like specific brands of protein skimmer or filter, where to get them and stuff would be very helpful..

oh, and me average. price of the equipment and everything would total about 300 dollars.

[BFG]

To tell you the truth, the budget you mention might cover the cost of the livestock only. Maybe a few kilo of live rock too. Do consider setting aside a substantial budget.

[blackghost]

ok..

than lets say that is the cost to setup the tank

livestock.. i can get slowly..

hee..

do help. really want to setup a marine tank for years and years.

[BFG]

You could be looking at $1-2k per feet. Bigger tank would need $2-3k per feet. It's an estimative index to plan for your budget requirement. Of course you could lessen the amount spent by getting 2nd hand equipment but you got to make sure that they are worth it in the long run.

[blackghost]

oh my god...

didnt expect it to go that high..

me still student.. allowance get also from internship. only around 600 plus per month.

shucks

maybe have to rethink this..



but lets say.. i can do things cheap.. den forgo some equipment. like chiller and media reactor..

keep things simple. just for a fish only tank??

hmmm...

[BFG]

Blackghost, there are hidden cost involved as well like additives and the monthly electrical charges. My current 4ft is reaching to near 5 figure soon and it is still not fully stock with coral that I want. Equipment wise, it is also not fully equip with what I wanted too.

The marine part of this aquatic hobby is way different than the freshwater equivalent. You couldn't leave the tank alone by itself unlike the freshwater counterpart. There are stuff to do like monitoring the salinity level every week, ensuring the magnesium are at it's recommended or optimum level and also not forgetting calcium levels too! Temperature is important too that's why most marine aquarist ( reefer ) uses chiller to help keep the temperature constant. None of the coral will do well if the water temperature goes above 30 degrees celcius.

Before I went into this hobby, I had done some reading from various forum in regards to equipment. What I saw was that there are some equipment that was needed to run the tank successfully and there are some equipment that are good to have, in the sense that it will help me with the upkeep of the tank, but you could manually dose some additive that you might forego this equipment. You'll also need a pumphead or ' wavemaker ' to provide water current for your tank inhabitant. In a freshwater tank, it is always the canister filter that will move the water in the tank but in a marine tank, a dedicated wavemaker is always needed.

Not everything from the sea can be added into the tank. Compatibility is the order of the day. And not all the fishes that you'll see in the lfs will stay true to it's original shape and form when you'll add them to the tank. There are fish that will look cute when it is still in the juvenile stage but when it grows into adult stage, it will surely looks drab and most will be the terror in the tank. Corals are another matter to look into. Not every coral can be placed side by side or even in the same tank. There are corals that will leech out chemical into the tank that will prevent other corals to grow or even kill them. Some coral will sting other coral when they are placed next to each other. There are also corals that will not have problem when you placed them side by side to another coral BUT when comes to feeding time, when they extend their feeding tentacle to catch food, this tentacle will sting the other coral that are placed next to them.

The above are just some info that you'll need to know before you venture into this hobby. It is important to be aware of what you'll need to know now to make an informed decision about starting a saltwater tank. But it is still not complete and there are other stuff you'll need to know too but I believe I've covered some of the basic mentioned here. My advise is to do your research and plan carefully. Take your time like what I did before embarking into this colorful hobby. Visit the marine link to get some ideas or knowledge about the marine hobby and if you find something that is interesting and is not available in the marine link, inform me and I'll add it in so that it could benefit the next person who will be doing his/her research in this forum. I am not an expert and am still learning along with my setup.

Hope this helps!

[ah fat]

hmm.. 200-300 possible lah
get a second hand skimmer for around 80
get a 2nd hand cannister for around 50
liverocks get 2nd hand for around 3-4bucks/kg, get more than 10kg.
than buy the lights also around 70plus
than buy a fan to cool
should be around 200 here
the rest 100 spend wisely on salt and ls
than slowly build up your reservoir of additives and ls


if you wanna go cheaper but start even sooner.
go for fish with live rocks only
than dn need so good lights.. just use a cheap flourescent
dn need skimmer, just do a biweekly water change
than slowly save up and change the settings till u get enough to get into corals.

[blackghost]

if you wanna go cheaper but start even sooner.
go for fish with live rocks only
than dn need so good lights.. just use a cheap flourescent
dn need skimmer, just do a biweekly water change
than slowly save up and change the settings till u get enough to get into corals.

err..

dn need skimmer ah?

http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...896#post249896

i'm confused..

btw, wat substrate is suitable for marine tanks? i currently have a grade c-0 sand bought from OTF (pasir ris farmway). 7 dollars per 10Kg pack. its currently in the tank in my brackish setup. can i use this substrate or do i need to change substrate when its nearer to a more marine setup?

would be helpful if u guys can provide specifics. me thinking of a fish and live rocks only tank..

thanks in advance

[BFG]

You do need a skimmer, you'd be surprise what mine pull out of the water. Substrate wise, I am using Grade 1. Not too 'light' that my wavemaker would easily push around the tank. You'll need-

Tank and sump,
stand,
skimmer,
skimmer pump,
return pump,
pump for water circulation in the tank,
salinity meter ( to gauge the salinity of the saltwater ),
light set ( T5 with ATI tube, 1 white, 1 blue tube ),
Salt mix ( Tropic Marine, Marine Environment ),
distilled water ( don't use tap water ),
sea water ( if you don't want to buy distilled water and salt mix ),
test kit ( ammonia, nitrate, nitrite,phosphate,ph ),
chiller ( if you going to buy coral ),
timer,
magnet cleaner,
fish food ( hikari frozen mysid shrimp ),
live rock,
sand,
pvc pipe ( connect the tank to the sump ),
hose ( connect the return pump to the chiller to the main tank ),
hose clamp,
thermometer.

These are the items you may need. There might be others that I have missed out. Please do your homework and research in order to have an idea to maintain your setup.