the tail markings are a dead giveaway that it's a cacatuoide...but it does look rather like an orange flash in the dorsal/anal fin...inbred too much maybe?
the tail markings are a dead giveaway that it's a cacatuoide...but it does look rather like an orange flash in the dorsal/anal fin...inbred too much maybe?
yes, the dorsal does look too orangy unlike the tail.
anyway it's a far cry from it's original coloration.
maybe given time it will develope full pattern on the dorsal
fin too.
******
Richard
******
Canon 20D 100mm Macro EF-S 18-55mm EF-S 55-250mm EF-400mm f5.6 Speedlite 550EX 2x420EX ST-E2
http://www.trident.smugmug.com/
Guys, I have a quick question.
A friend of mine ordered a pair of apistogrammas and we think the smaller "female" might be a sneaker male. However, he doesn't want to complain with the seller, yet, because he wants to make sure it is indeed a male before he complains to this reputable seller. Here are some pictures I took:
The smaller fish is displaying the courting... sideways spasming , however doesn't get more yellow than in the pictures, the pelvic fin is not black (though some say some domestic strain females don't have this?), and the rear caudal fin is not round (granted you can see it's a little damaged). However! The dorsal fine is short and some people say they don't really go yellow till after the eggs are laid (which they aren't). Any opinions / reassurance would be great as he's planning to breed them, but an actual pair would be nice for that!
Also the larger male is now continually chasing away the smaller one, suggesting to me that possible the male is aware of the imposter? Please correct me if I'm wrong!
(If needed I have much larger version of the photos above)
My feeling is that the smaller piece is a male. The first few dorsal menbrane seems too pointed/sharp and long to be a female. Also the body colouration looks very much like a male. I have a tank of females and yours just doesn't seem to look like them.
But I could be wrong because he/she is still a young fish. Also, the aquarium morphs these days are getting really wierd. We have a forumer who have a specimen that fits exactly the description of a male that spawned.
Last edited by genes; 12th Dec 2007 at 20:07.
Eugene (^_^)
De Dwergcichlide Fanatiek
Now swimming: Plecos and Apistogrammas
Was the caudal fin at least round and the pelvic fin black or?
Neither. See for yourself in this thread. http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...ad.php?t=32354
I am not sure if there was a mistake. I still find it hard to believe that this specimen is a female that spawned.
Eugene (^_^)
De Dwergcichlide Fanatiek
Now swimming: Plecos and Apistogrammas
i agree with eugene that this looks like a male...and that the forumer's female looked frighteningly like a male...i was shocked to hear that that particular fish laid eggs!
Did the other female turn yellow?
Let me add a few more tips on how 2 males end up in the same bag. It's a very old thread but i think it'll do some good on giving some knowledge to those people who are intending to buy apisto.
Apisto fries as young as 28 days start to show aggression in the form of play. Normally in a batch of 100 fries, there can be a few very fast growers and playing boss every time they see a smaller fry. Those smaller fry might be slow growing males that have lost out during feeding time. Some children grows taller put on more weight than others etc etc. Therefore it also applies to those fries too. There will be taller,shorter,slimmer,etc etc. Physically there are differences even if smaller fries are often mistaken as females.
Physically smaller males or the term 'sneeker males'(sorry i didn't know about this term) are often bullied by larger males so in the natural world, what will they do to survive? They act like female. yes it's true. in order to stay alive and have a piece of food during feeding time they act like females in order not to be 'harass' by larger males. When food source are aplenty physically larger male show off their aggression and territorial behavior to attract females therefore the term 'looking like female' certainly sounds logical just to get a piece of food.
On the other hand there are physically larger females too, they grow almost equally like the larger males. Those larger females show more distinguish female patterns and will have a higher chances of ending up as a pair in your shopping bag.
Why physically smaller male even exist? i cannot be sure if physically smaller males do exist in the wild but i'm sure with captive breeding it' happens in a higher percentage due to space constraint. Unless breeders respect that not all 100 apisto fries will fit a 2ft tank during the span of their growing up phase.
The max a 2ft tank can hold fries of 3-4cm barely exceeds 15. The larger the tank, fries will be given a higher chance of :
1) growing faster
2) lesser casualty rate
3) no physically smaller males
4) can't think of anything at the moment.
Even with a trained eye, it's way too easy to make a mistake for differentiating females and physically smaller males. Thou there are tell tale signs which you might need to scrutinize.
The method of removing the physically smaller male and showing it the mirror method works wonders.
Thou i can only remember vividly the pattern markings,shapes on female i will not list those down since i've not been revising on the apisto topic for quite a long time. Those listed above are base on what i can remember so far.
If you do a taxanomy on caca's body(i'm sure the www do have a picture or two on taxanomy) i'm sure you'll be an expert in differentiating females and physically smaller males in no time. Till than happy apisto-ing.
Cheers!
Cheers!
Benetay
Wow, is this a good thread (/topic?)?
Could you post some pics that show well established sneaker males and real females that look similar with pointing out the defferences?
Thx.
Hi guys, I'm sorry for bringing this old thread. But I have a confusion on determining the gender (although the guide on the first post was very good, being a newbie at apistos, I can't tell 100%). So hoping you guys would be able to give confirmations
FEMALE (Hope it's not sneaker male) Sorry for crappy pictures, but the 'female' seems to be afraid of camera.
MALE (Hope it's not a brightly coloured female)
Thanks a lot
Do the last 2 pics show two different fish?
Hi Csababa,
no, they are of one fish. The top picture was taken yesterday, whereas the bottom picture was taken 3 days ago. Although, now it seems the black colour was not as strong as yesterday anymore, but still stronger than the picture from 3 days ago.
In that case I can't help you, unfortunately.
I think you have them correctly sexed.
Eugene (^_^)
De Dwergcichlide Fanatiek
Now swimming: Plecos and Apistogrammas
How do you mean that?
Thanks for the clarification, genes!
den is this male or female? sorry guys im kinda learnin.
Bookmarks