Timebomb or Sia meng, could you please eloborate on how much bleach to use and how much vinegar to use? is ita concentrated ones or dillute them with water....
Hi, fellas,
I don't know why the word "Decapsulation" reminds me of "circumcision". Maybe it's got something to do with removing something from something :wink:
Anyway, many thanks to Gwee Sia Meng who came to my house the other day to show me how decapsulation is done, I've got a new page on my website now. Just in case you are wondering, I'm still a whole person The decapsulation was for the brine shrimp eggs and not me.
If you like to take a look at how Sia Meng does it, go to:
http://killies.com/Decapsulating.htm
I must say it was a lot easier than I had initally thought. You guys should try this sometime.
Loh K L
Timebomb or Sia meng, could you please eloborate on how much bleach to use and how much vinegar to use? is ita concentrated ones or dillute them with water....
If I have a dollar & you have a dollar & we swap, neither is better off. BUT if I have an idea & you have an idea & we swap we are both richer
Rashid,
I think we were using about 300 ml of bleach to about one litre of water. The amount of bleach to use is not a critical factor as the rate with which the eggs turn orange would depend on the amount of bleach used. In other words, if you use less bleach, it will take longer for the eggs to turn orange, that's all.
As for vinegar, it will work the same way too. The more vinegar you use, the faster the bleach will be neutralised.
We were using concentrated bleach, by the way.
The thing about the whole decapsulation process which struck me the most is that contrary to what I thought earlier, the amounts of bleach, vinegar, water and eggs to use and the timing factors are not that critical. A little more or less bleach or vinegar, a bit faster or slower, the eggs will still be decapsulated and remain alive.
Loh K L
ok thanx for the clarifications... will definately try it out.. but 1st must get new supplies of brine eggs as I ran out mine...
If I have a dollar & you have a dollar & we swap, neither is better off. BUT if I have an idea & you have an idea & we swap we are both richer
Thank Loh and Sia Meng, I managed to "decapsulate" the eggs. Unforunately, they all failed to hatch. Any idea what went wrong?
We won't know what went wrong unless you provide us with more details. We know you decapsulated the eggs and we assume you did it successfully but how did you go about hatching them?
Loh K L
Kwek Leong and Sia Meng,
Thanks for sharing the technic, very helpful to fish breeding people.
There are few possibilities I could think of:-Originally Posted by MCSim
Possibilities 1
The brineshirmp eggs might have turned orange and you might not have realized it. You did not stop it in time, thus killing the eggs. The reason could be due to the lighting, I will usually have a table lamp besides to check on the colour.
Possibilities 2
The salt solution is not concentrated enough to draw all water out of the eggs. I suspect that the bleach could have went into the eggs, the last process is to draw both bleach and water out of the eggs. If you had wash the eggs thoroughly with tap water and vinegar, you will notice that there should be no smell of bleach. However, the second day, after soaking the eggs with salt water, you will realize that there is smell of bleach. I suspected that the bleach is drawn from the eggs thus giving you the smell. If the salt water is not strong enough to draw the bleach out of the eggs, it could have killed the eggs from inside. Thus an additional step might be required on the second day; Pour away the salt solution and make a new batch of concentrated salt water to store the eggs. This time round this process is not used to draw the water out of the eggs, but to preserve the eggs.
Lastly, how long have your eggs been kept? If the eggs were dead before the decapsulation process, even if you have done the steps all right, it will never hatch!
Regards
Finally, I tried.
I bought the "coffee filter" from Cold Storage, cost me $1.7, couldn't get it in NTUC. Vinegar, about $1 for 800 ml. Normal grade brine shrimp eggs.
It takes me about 25~30 minutes for the whole process except 1 hour airing the bbs eggs.
But I realize that after vinegar bath, running water and salt bath for the decapsulated bbs, after 5 minutes, there is a slight odour vinegar and bleach. hmm, so, I decided to clean the bbs with running water again and have another salt bath for them. I took some closed up picture and I notice some eggs are actually "spoilt". 1 hr later after I placed them in the fridge. I draw some bbs out for airing which hatch rate is about 60%~70% after a day, same as before decapsulate. I'll try to post the picture and try the premium grade BBS when I have time.
Terry,Originally Posted by sard
Hope I didn't interprete your posting wrong, but go look through the decapsulation article again. It didn't mention anything about airing the processed eggs, but to maintain them in a strong salt solution and kept in the fridge.
I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
Ronnie Lee
I think what Terry meant was aerating, the first step in the process of decapsulating the eggs. Sia Meng used the word "hydrate" when he first posted his method on decapsulating the eggs. On my website, I said "rehydrate" because I think that's the correct word to use. Our brine shrimp eggs must have been taken out of water and "dried out" before it was sold to us. So when we soaked them in water again, it would be rehydrating them.
Loh K L
Sorry for my poor "armmor", should have check the dictionary before posting . Ya, it's aerating .
The 3rd picture from top, description here :
""" The solution is hooked up to an air pump and aerated for about one hour. This is to rehydrate the eggs so that their shells become soft. """
Ehh, not important, as long as i have it done :wink: .
Kwek Leong and Sia Meng,
Thanks for the info. I managed to decapsulate the eggs although I have kept my brine shrimp eggs for a year. I found out that the shrimp survival rate are much higher after decapsulation because of cleaner water. Previously, my shrimp are able to survive for a few hours only and now, until todate, the shrimp still surviving after 3 days.
Jennifer Ooi
Living in Pearl of Orient
Hi Jennifer,Originally Posted by jkillis
The conventional hatching method requires more energy for BBS to break through their shells. This results warm incubation temperatures and metabolites from the hatching medium which create ideal conditions for a bacteria bloom which will kill the BBS.
The other reason
As your eggs have been kept for a year, harmful bacterial might have congregate the surface of your brine shrimp eggs. These bacterial might kill your BBS after they hatch. The process of decapsulation of eggs thoroughly disinfect eggs (the bleach kills the bacterial), thereby reducing the bacterial load of the hatching medium during incubation.
I hope this will give you a clearer picture why your shrimps survive longer.
For your information
It is possible to keep BBS hatch from the conventional method over few day. Just make 100% water change. This is what i do, if i need to raise BBS to adults.
Regards
How do you do a 100% water change when the BBS is so small?
Jennifer Ooi
Living in Pearl of Orient
Hi Jennifer
I usually pour the brineshrimp in a coffee filter and rinse them with tap water (a few second) before I place them back to a new brine solution. BBS are very hardy, they can take this treatment.
If you are interested to know how I raise brineshrimp to adults please read http://mykillies.tripod.com/PMBS.htm
Regards,
Didn't really want to resurrect zombies , but I wanted to acknowledge the shoulders we stand on.
timebomb, I followed your and Sia Meng's documentation of how to decap BSE and successfully did mine yesterday. Thanks very much to the both of you (though you all probably don't read the forums anymore).
I had some trouble with two things:
1. determining when exactly to stop the bleaching process
2. how to stop the reaction fast and to all eggs evenly.
If I understand the below correctly, the eggs are pretty tough and tolerate minor errors on our part with stopping the reaction late.
But how much of a time allowance is there? I see from Sia Meng's photos that the bleached eggs are a pure orange. Mine are 80-90% orange, but there's about 10% floating/suspended which are a little more white. Can I risk going for 95-99%% orange when bleaching, and still have hatchable eggs? Anyone?
Hi
I've been hatching my first decapped batch over the past couple of weeks. And I'll be decapping my second batch this weekend.
Findings from the previous batch:
1. There are still many unhatched: typical of my un-decapped eggs. I'm guessing my stoppage of the reaction wasn't done evenly, so maybe some eggs became unviable. I need to decap in smaller batches, so my tiny sieve isn't overwhelmed. Also, maybe it's my decapping and hatching pH. I see most research papers recommend about 8+ for hatching, and even up to 10 for decapping, so I'm going to add sodium bicarbonate this time. It might also be incomplete de-chlorination when washing with sodium thiosulfate soluton instead of acid (c.f. Bruggeman et al), so I'll change to citric acid wash. Will mess about and report back.
2. There are less eggshells to fiddle with - which was the main attraction of decapping. There were still some transparent ones floating, or worse in the middle of the water column, though I'm less worried about accidental consumption as the shells will be thinner. Since my main aim in decapping is convenience, perhaps I'll run the decap process longer to more completely remove the shells. We'll see how that affects viability of the cysts.
3. Decap time seems a little shorter. Needs more observation because of my workflow being constrained by my office hours. My initial hunch is the shrimp are emerging earlier.
4. Shrimp quality - I see many more fat round shrimp (rather than elongated ones) when I harvest on time. Looks nutritious!
Bookmarks