Advertisements
Aquatic Avenue Banner Tropica Shop Banner Fishy Business Banner
Results 1 to 18 of 18

Thread: Aphyosemion bitaeniatum

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    14
    Feedback Score
    0

    Aphyosemion bitaeniatum

    Advertisements
    Fresh n Marine aQuarium Banner

    Advertise here

    Advertise here
    Anyone can successfully breed it? I tried several times but all eggs die within 7days. Whats the problem?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    I've bred A. bitaeniatum 47KM North Lagos - Ibadan. I found they laid lots of eggs but when placed on moist peat for incubation they fungused within about 3 days. I had a lot more success incubating them in a pot of water with a layer of peat. As I understand it, when dry stored on peat, the peat helps to cut down the spread of fungus, so maybe this is what happened with the peat in water.

    After selling a few pairs of their offspring I have a reverse trio left which I hope to breed later this year when theres more rain.

    Good luck with yours.
    Regards
    Tom

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Choa Chu Kang, Singapore
    Posts
    3,148
    Feedback Score
    0
    Country
    Singapore
    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent
    Anyone can successfully breed it? I tried several times but all eggs die within 7days. Whats the problem?
    Vincent, I'm beginning to suspect that the BIT will do much better in slightly more acidic water. I'm getting tons of fungicized eggs as well, with only a few tough surviving frys in a moss-packed 8-Litre plastic tank.

    I do not actively harvest the moss but am now experimenting with 'tweaking' their water with PMBB. If that doesn't work, I'll collect all the moss and dump them into 'cleaner' but aged water (given that Kwek Leong knows my preference for tanks with mulm & detritus ).

    Perhaps I'll also take up Tom's idea of having peat in water as well, albeit in a ladies' stocking (not as messy & easier to spot frys, I guess), instead of a peat bottom layer. Wonder how the eggs will fare with PMBB & a peat bag...

    Another thing to consider, Vincent, is whether you have an inmature pair.

    Quote Originally Posted by blinkytom
    I've bred A. bitaeniatum 47KM North Lagos - Ibadan. I found they laid lots of eggs but when placed on moist peat for incubation they fungused within about 3 days. I had a lot more success incubating them in a pot of water with a layer of peat. As I understand it, when dry stored on peat, the peat helps to cut down the spread of fungus, so maybe this is what happened with the peat in water.
    Hiya Tom, this 'peat bed' is something I honestly hadn't thought of. Worth a shot, I think. BTW, how did you set up this BIT breeding tank?? (sorry if I had asked that before).

    After selling a few pairs of their offspring I have a reverse trio left which I hope to breed later this year when theres more rain.
    Hmm... a reversed trio is quite dicey ain't it... one female against two amorous males!! :wink: Also why wait for rain? What's with the water coming straight out from your taps?

    Are you collecting rain water for breeding because it's 'softer'?
    I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
    Ronnie Lee

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    14
    Feedback Score
    0
    how to check it is inmature? they should be as long as the adult size.
    Besides, I tried to stored in moist peat or water with peat and java moss but the eggs usually turned white in 3rd day.


  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    Ron,

    My BIT set up was a 12x8x8 tank filled with 100% rainwater. I used top and bottom mops but I tended to find more eggs in the top mops. Apart from the mops and a sponge filter the tank is bare. They were very productive without the need for conditioning the sexes separately. The female never thinned out at all which I thought was quite suprising.

    I suppose a reverse trio could be a bit risky but thats what I started off with and as I said, I found them very productive. If it ain't broken, don't fix it. The males weren't hard drivers and the shows between the too males were very impressive.

    I use rain water for them as I was getting very male bias ratios. I thought if the pH was higher I would get an even worse ratio. I'll try the tap water as well as rain water this year to see what I get. BTW, as in the majority of England, my tap water is very hard and alkaline. Perfect for my Tanganyikan cichlids but not so good for the killies. What is the tap water like in Singapore?

    Vincent, If your eggs are fungusing no matter what you do I would guess it is a maturity problem. I don't really know a way to tell if they are mature enough apart from trial and error. But if they are adult size they should be mature enough. Just keep trying.
    Regards
    Tom

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Choa Chu Kang, Singapore
    Posts
    3,148
    Feedback Score
    0
    Country
    Singapore
    Quote Originally Posted by Vincent
    how to check it is inmature? they should be as long as the adult size.
    Besides, I tried to stored in moist peat or water with peat and java moss but the eggs usually turned white in 3rd day
    Vincent, I'm working on F2 (2nd generation) of my BIV Lagos and because of compatible size, I had 2 pairs in the moss-stuffed breeding tank. Unfortunately, one female jumped and I ended up with a reverse trio (2M/1F).

    This trio are at one inch and I can't be sure if they're mature, but I also observed that higher temps yield more fungicized eggs. So I added an airstone to try lower the temp. If your BIT eggs are stored on peat, perhaps you should find a cooler location.

    Anyway, when I spotted the first egg (which later turned white) I decided to give the PMBB a shot. I'm not sure if I overdid it but the water was pretty tannic and the breeders could hardly be seen!

    Guess what... I had just collected about 20 eggs and although there were a few white fuzzy eggs, the rest 'looks' ok, albeit somewhat stained light-brown from the tannic water.

    I transferred these presumed-good eggs to a 3 inch hatching tray, added java moss, an airstone, a drop of "Liquid Fry No.1" and about half a cup of PMBB. I'm crossing my fingers and hoping for the best. If this works, I'm gonna start marketing PMBB!

    If this doesn't work.... I'm gonna 'borrow' my wife's stocking for a peat bag (but ssshhh.... don't tell her! :wink: )
    I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
    Ronnie Lee

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Choa Chu Kang, Singapore
    Posts
    3,148
    Feedback Score
    0
    Country
    Singapore
    Quote Originally Posted by blinkytom
    My BIT set up was a 12x8x8 tank filled with 100% rainwater. I used top and bottom mops but I tended to find more eggs in the top mops. Apart from the mops and a sponge filter the tank is bare. They were very productive without the need for conditioning the sexes separately. The female never thinned out at all which I thought was quite suprising.
    Thanks, Tom for the details... but more questions! :wink:

    How many mops did you use and do you just harvest the mops, to incubate in a separate hatching tray? Does this hatching tray also have a 'peat bed'? What's the incubation period that you observed in your climate?

    I suppose a reverse trio could be a bit risky but thats what I started off with and as I said, I found them very productive. If it ain't broken, don't fix it. The males weren't hard drivers and the shows between the too males were very impressive.
    hmm... I can imagine that it is so, but my BIV Lagos males are rather docile. At the risk of sounding envious, how productive is 'productive' and how large are your breeders?

    What is the tap water like in Singapore?
    A while back, I tested my water and read pH 6.5-7.0 but according to this article, water coming to me from Choa Chu Kang Waterworks is supposedly pH 7.0–9.0 !
    I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
    Ronnie Lee

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    Ron,

    I had at least 1 top and 1 bottom mop but I try to put as much as possible in (depends how many species I'm breeding at the time). I havested (time permiting) about every two days. I put the eggs in a small dish with about 0.5cm of peat on the bottom topped up with tank water. I just left the eggs there and kept adding more. I looked everyday for any fry which had hatched and moved them to a raising tray with just some Java moss. I found it was about 11 - 12 days before the first fry came.

    I was getting between 15 and 25 eggs every 2 days. The female was about 1.5" and the males about 1.75". They were being fed a standard tropical flake in the morning and frozen food (bloodworm, brine shrimp, daphnia, mosquito larvae) in the evening. I know live foods are the best conditioners but the shops in my area are terrible. If they have any live food in then most of its dead and its very expensive for what you're getting.

    I'd love to have 6.5-7 tap water. Mine is about 8.5.
    Regards
    Tom

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    14
    Feedback Score
    0
    hi blinkytom,
    you mean one pair can produce 15-25 eggs in every two days? I have 1 male and 2 female, they have 2 -6 eggs in everyday. do you think they are inmature? I keep them in 20inch tank.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    Vincent,

    Yes my BIT were producing between 15 and 25 eggs every 2 days.

    To boost the number of eggs, you could separate the sexes and condition them for a week or so. Maybe your females just need a rest or maybe the male isn't working hard enough? If the harvesting method isn't working for you, you can try the natural method (heavily planting the tank).
    Regards
    Tom

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Choa Chu Kang, Singapore
    Posts
    3,148
    Feedback Score
    0
    Country
    Singapore
    Hiya Tom,

    It just occured to me that I don't know what your fish look like. Does it resemble anything like the pic I posted in an earlier thread?.

    Also, doesn't the "Lagos" belong to the species bivittatum instead of bitaeniatum or has it been revised again? (wished those ichthyologist would make up their minds :wink: )

    When the rain comes, let your Lagos have a go at it and update us. I would be keen in a bag or two of 47KM North Lagos - Ibadan.
    I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
    Ronnie Lee

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    Ron,

    Looking at your BIV profile page, your male looks very much like a BIT and the female more like a BIV. I have never seen a BIV male with long flowing fins like that and I'm quite sure BIT females don't have so much colour in the dorsal fin. My fish are definatly BIT, I'll try to get some decent pics of them in a minute.

    According to Tim Addis' website there is no BIV found at Lagos, only BIT. http://www.killifish.f9.co.uk/Killif...bivittatum.htm

    You certainly can have some of their eggs when I get some. I might just go and throw a mop or 2 in with them now. At the moment I have them in a rearing tank with 10 Aplocheilichthys spilauchen which are taking ages to grow and definatly aren't big enough to produce eggs.
    Regards
    Tom

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Choa Chu Kang, Singapore
    Posts
    3,148
    Feedback Score
    0
    Country
    Singapore
    Quote Originally Posted by blinkytom
    Looking at your BIV profile page, your male looks very much like a BIT and the female more like a BIV. I have never seen a BIV male with long flowing fins like that and I'm quite sure BIT females don't have so much colour in the dorsal fin. My fish are definatly BIT, I'll try to get some decent pics of them in a minute.
    Tom, you probably don't realize how big a can of worms you opened for me, with your "BIV/BIT Lagos" statement, BUT I'm very glad you did!!

    The more I research online, it becomes clearer that the "Lagos population" belongs to the bitaeniatum, and NOT a bivittatum. I appeal to those who're maintaining Aphyosemion "bivittatum" Lagos to verify their sources.

    A few of the reference links (there were many more...);
    KillieTalk March 17th 2000 - Aphyosemion bitaeniatum thread.
    Tim Addis's Aphyosemion bitaeniatum page.
    DKG's reference to the bitaeniatum
    Vasco Gomes's Chromaphyosemion sub-genus page.
    Skandinavisk Killi Selskab's 18th Internationale Killi-Show - 1999 (look under: Group 600 - Aphyosemion 1)

    According to Killi-Data Online (updated on August 23rd 2003);
    VALID SPECIES = bitaeniatum
    CURRENT GENUS = Aphyosemion bitaeniatum
    AQUARIUM POPULATIONS = Afagnagan, Agbetiko, Agomé-Klozou, Apapa, Benin City, Cotonou, Dévé, Gammi, Igolo, Ijagema River, Ijebu-Odé, Ikeja, Ikpenlé, Iwere, Lagos, Lakossa, Meko, Oron, Port Harcourt, Porto Novo, Satoké, Takon, Tchékpoé-Dédékpoé, Umudike, Warri, Yemoji River, Zagnanado and Zinvié.

    You certainly can have some of their eggs when I get some.
    Thanks Tom! I'd love to add another Aphyosemion to my specie-dedicated tank (how are those "47KM North Lagos - Ibadan" pics coming along? :wink: ). Let me know the costs or if there's something you want to swap for.

    PS: My Lagos female looks alot like the BIV Funge's female but I'm VERY SURE that I had not gotten them mixed up.
    I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
    Ronnie Lee

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    Ron,

    I'm glad I helped in my own special way :s

    I also had a look in my Aqualog Catalog and that also backs up your research. Is this book available to you guys in in Singapore?

    I would have pics but there was one major flaw in my plan, I'd forgotten to charge the batteries. I finish school early tomorrow so I will definatly get some tomorrow afternoon.
    Regards
    Tom

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    14
    Feedback Score
    0
    I successfully breed them, 1 fry was born yesterday, and some eggs are eyed-up.

    I changed some water with distilled water, so I guess it is beacuse of water hardness.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    England
    Posts
    55
    Feedback Score
    0
    Well done, Vincent! You're well on the way now.

    I think water hardness is a problem with the BIT. I've had a pair of them in a breeding tank with hard water over the last few days and got very few eggs which all fungus whether in water or on moist peat.
    Regards
    Tom

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Choa Chu Kang, Singapore
    Posts
    3,148
    Feedback Score
    0
    Country
    Singapore
    Congrats Vincent! I was collecting some Lagos eggs over the weekend and I must say that the PMBB/peat combo worked quite nicely. Only problem is... the water is tannic and I can't see the breeders! :wink:

    I'd like to try using distilled water as well... so how much of that did you use?

    Tom, I await good news from you too.
    I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
    Ronnie Lee

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2003
    Location
    Hong Kong
    Posts
    14
    Feedback Score
    0
    My wife collect 0.5L of Distilled water from her office every day

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •