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Thread: foam/bubbles on water surface

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    foam/bubbles on water surface

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    Hi All,

    I'm new to fish keeping, and I have a question I hope someone here can help answer.

    I have a 2ft tank with overhead filter. In the tank is some java moss tied to driftwood and stainless-steel mesh, some plants I cannot ID, a couple of corys, ottos, and cardinal tetras.

    The tank was setup abt 1 wk ago, and the pass few days I notice tiny foam-like bubbles on the surface ... (I scoop them up, the next day more appears ...)

    The fishes and plants seems okay, but I'm curious as to what is the cause of the foam/bubbles and is it a prelude to something more serious?

    Many thanks in advance.

  2. #2
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    Hi naikoob,

    The bubbles forming at the surface of your tank water are probably bubbles emitted from plants when the oxygen level of your tank water reaches a saturation point. It is more evident when a layer of scum is formed due to protein build up from fish food.

    On the side note, you might want to test for presence of ammonia (the bubbles could also be ammonia gas which is deadly to fishes if your pH is above 7) as your tank could well be in the cycling phase.
    Plant Physiology by Taiz and Zeiger

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    hmmm ... don't think i've got enough plants to cause a saturation in O2 ...

    i was afraid it will be ammonia, so i did a 50% water change on last nite, but more bubbles appear this morning. maybe i should get a test-kit after work.

    thanks.

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    NH3 will not appear as bubbles. They will stay dissolved in the water... most of it as NH4+.

    BC

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    errhh bclee

    tiny bubbles that would not clear and building up at the waterline edges where the tank glass is one of the tell tale signs of excessive NH3/NH4...the bubbles is not the NH3/NH4 itself...but one of the tell tales signs...[:]

    Pretty much when one pisses into a toilet bowl, full of NH(excuse me for my crudeness)there is alot of air foam and does not go away....i am guessing that the NH increases water surface cohesiveness that traps air bubbles.......

    An NH test kit is only an indicative understanding but I think the NH test kits cannot distinguish between NH3 or NH4
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  6. #6
    Well, I can suggest 2 other reasons.

    1) Increased protein layer floating on top of water because of fish food
    2) If you're using Nutrafin Aquasafe. The water conditioner feels kinda soapy and will generate a lot of bubbles esp at the outlet of your OH filter

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    ----------------
    On 1/15/2003 6:44:40 PM

    errhh bclee

    tiny bubbles that would not clear and building up at the waterline edges where the tank glass is one of the tell tale signs of excessive NH3/NH4...the bubbles is not the NH3/NH4 itself...but one of the tell tales signs...[:]

    Pretty much when one pisses into a toilet bowl, full of NH(excuse me for my crudeness)there is alot of air foam and does not go away....i am guessing that the NH increases water surface cohesiveness that traps air bubbles.......

    An NH test kit is only an indicative understanding but I think the NH test kits cannot distinguish between NH3 or NH4
    ----------------
    Not agree...

    The bubbling (not in the urine but the tank) are likely due to organics... not NH3... that increase the cohesiveness. At least at the ppm that we are talking about. You have enough NH3 to get a "soapy" feel... the fishes probably would be gone by now.

    A NH3 kit most likely reveal nothing if your plants are settled and N cycle is completed.

    NH3 kit will tell the total NH3/NH4. How much is NH3 and NH4 will depends on the pH of the water? That can be worked out. Generaly, at pH < 8, majority is in NH4.

    BC

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    Hi Bclee

    I understand the angle you are coming from...while NH3 or NH4 depends on the PH level, most aquarist fall into this pit trap thinking that NH in acidic water is not toxic...given a certain amount of NH, it can still be lethal.
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    my own guess is that its a protien film... a couple of things to note

    1) you don't need to saturate your water with O2 to get bubbles from photosynthesis
    2) you need to saturate your water with O2 to get pearling
    3) In most planted tanks, we develop protien films on the surface... this looks a bit like an oil stain in the water... stick your finger in the water and stir a bit... then look at it from and angle... if you see oil like patched then its a protein film
    4) As your plants photosynthesize and give off small bubbles, these get trapped under the film...

    If it is a protein film, my advise would be either to get a surface skimmer, or some fishes which like eating the film... either that or you can try some solutions which break down organics compounds.
    Allen

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    allen

    the bubble formation around the rim of the waterline even without the protein film. This is predominately during the N-cycling period, where in my experience during the build-up of NH.

    The second time I experienced this formation is when my biological glass was expired. The tell tale signs can vary....in my case, my tank will have a bacterial bloom every week that clears after 3 to 4 days....then the cycle repeats...after it stops, the bubble formation came followed by high NH, NO2, and NO3 readings.

    The third time was when my male betta was building a bubble nest...whahahahahaha...just kidding
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    At ppm level, I seriously do not think NH3 will affect the surface tension. Rather, the organics in the water, not necessary protein film, most likely caused the bubbling.

    The organics in the water in some cases will link to the NH3 spike as you mention. Basically it is rotting stuff giving rise to NH3.

    BTW, protein in your urine is a very bad sign...

    BC

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    that would be true.....basket bclee...i dont have protein in my urine but elsewhere...whahahahahahahahahaha[]
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    Hmmm.... interesting. Cos I make up solutions of Nh4No3 at 350g/L for PMDD (that's 350000ppm BTW) but I dun remember it being soapy...

    The film at the top is always there if you keep plants. I am not so sure it is protein from fish food, cos even if no fish, no food, just plants; the film will still form.

    Anyway, I dun think the bubbles are from photosynthesis though, since the original poster mentioned that he/she is using a over-head filter, it is probably from there...

    ck

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    I did a search and find that NH4+ is quite harmless. In fact, it is the NH3 level that will kill. That means, even at low pH, although majority exist as NH4+, it is the NH3 part that kills.

    Anyway, detactable NH3 from the test kit is always bad news no matter if the level is harmful or not.

    BC

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    On 1/16/2003 6:43:51 PM

    Hmmm.... interesting. Cos I make up solutions of Nh4No3 at 350g/L for PMDD (that's 350000ppm BTW) but I dun remember it being soapy...

    ck
    ----------------
    Oh yah... CK you are right ... the soapy one is NH3(aq) solution.

    Remember the smelly bottle of reagent on the lab bench?

    NH3 + H2O <---> NH4+ + OH-

    Only happen when you dissolve NH3 in water.

    BC

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