Planning a big 4ft 67gallon "Natural setup" killies tank

[johnchor]

Hello bros,

i am planning a big 4ft 67gallon "Natural setup" killies tank once i clear out my current tank stock.

some questions:
1) what type of filter to use for such a tank, sponge filter or OHF?
2) what type of plants are very tough and low light requriments? jave ferns, java moss anymore? duckweed ok?
3) should i use black sand\gravel or black shrimp soil? do they affect PH? up or down?
4) i saw a BOYU brand 4ft LED under-water tube light, quite cheap. can this be use for such a heavy planted tank. can the light be used above water? i dont like the light to heat up the water.
5) i would like to keep norman's lampeye, clown killies and some other small killies like max 3cm if possible.
6) can these small killies mixed with shrimps? will the killies eat the shrimp?
7) what type of shrimps is very tough and can endure high temp and do not need a chiller?
will the shrimp eat the killies eggs?
9) any small bottom dwellers eg: catfish loach or gobies can be mixed?
10) any good snails that can be mixed?

thanks

[lucasjiang]

Hello bros,

i am planning a big 4ft 67gallon "Natural setup" killies tank once i clear out my current tank stock.

some questions:
1) what type of filter to use for such a tank, sponge filter or OHF?
2) what type of plants are very tough and low light requriments? jave ferns, java moss anymore? duckweed ok?
3) should i use black sand\gravel or black shrimp soil? do they affect PH? up or down?
4) i saw a BOYU brand 4ft LED under-water tube light, quite cheap. can this be use for such a heavy planted tank. can the light be used above water? i dont like the light to heat up the water.
5) i would like to keep norman's lampeye, clown killies and some other small killies like max 3cm if possible.
6) can these small killies mixed with shrimps? will the killies eat the shrimp?
7) what type of shrimps is very tough and can endure high temp and do not need a chiller?
will the shrimp eat the killies eggs?
9) any small bottom dwellers eg: catfish loach or gobies can be mixed?
10) any good snails that can be mixed?

thanks

Hi, i dont keep killies so i might not be able to answer all of your questions, however i will attempt to answer some

1) this depends on the bioload of the fish you are keeping. If the bioload isnt very high (which i think will be the case since you are just keeping a few small killies) i think a sponge filter (or even two) would be sufficient.

2) You can try hornwort, it is a very fast grower. However, it might not like low light conditions, medium light would be better. Duckweed might overtake your tank surface in no time and would be hard to remove, so that would be a no no for me.

3) shrimp soil generally lower the pH to about 6, which is ideal for shrimps. From my experience with lapis sand and lava rock gravel, it normally buffers the pH to about 7-7.5.

4) Cant answer this, i dont use lights

6) I dont think they will eat shrimps, but they will definitely enjoy a meal of shrimplets, as almost all fishes will.

7) Malayan shrimps, yamato shrimps, cherry shrimps, wild cherry shrimps, caridina propinqua

8 ) sorry, no idea about this too, but i think they might, afterall it is a source of protein for the shrimps

9)For this i think kuhli loaches, neon gobies (stiphodon sp), would be ok. Cant think of any others at the moment, but as long as they are non aggressive it should be alright.

10) You will have to define 'good' here. Are you looking for one that will not infest the tank quickly?

[johnchor]

hello bro,

10) You will have to define 'good' here. Are you looking for one that will not infest the tank quickly?
good = do not destory plants, will not bring dieases to fish, do not infest the tank quickly etc. does it make any sense to keep snails in a planted tank?

1) cherry shrimps looks good but i thought it needs low temp like 24c
2) how about those yellow shrimps?
3) cardinal shrimp from sulawesi?
4) blue pearl shrimp?
5) white pearl shrimp?

thanks

[lucasjiang]

hello bro,

10) You will have to define 'good' here. Are you looking for one that will not infest the tank quickly?
good = do not destory plants, will not bring dieases to fish, do not infest the tank quickly etc. does it make any sense to keep snails in a planted tank?

1) cherry shrimps looks good but i thought it needs low temp like 24c
2) how about those yellow shrimps?
3) cardinal shrimp from sulawesi?
4) blue pearl shrimp?
5) white pearl shrimp?

thanks

I think nerite snails will be good, they fulfil the requirements, and they are fantastic algae eaters

Yellow shrimps and cherry shrimps are different variants of the same species, neocaridina heteropoda. They can tolerate room temperature, but personally i feel cherry shrimps are even more hardy than yellow, hence i suggested cherry.

Blue pearl and snowball (which is white pearl) are also different variants of the same species, neocaridina zhangjiajiensis, i havent kept them before hence i am not sure of the hardiness, but they should be able to tolerate room temp too.

Cardinal shrimp, caridina dennerli is a no no. It can definitely survive without chiller, but it extremely sensitive, it likes high pH of about 8+ but prefers low gH. If you want it to thrive, it would be better to setup a sulawesi tank specially for it.

[Draka]

1) I agree with the filter thing, especially if you are getting plants. You might want to consider a HMF, some member was recently constructing one. I've only been using one for a few months, but I'm sold on them, plus cheap and low/no maintenance.

2) If you want floating plants that are easily removable, amazon frogbits would be something to consider. I've had bad experience with water lettuce personally, so I won't recommend them. Pellia is good, although it overtakes the tank quite quickly for me and some people don't like the darker colour. Myriophyllum Mattogrossense is a good light coloured plant, some of it comes up on the marketplace once in a while. No experience with Java ferns personally. Hornworts are good.

3) Soil brings down pH, so it might be desirable for some killies as the water is conditioned automatically.

4) Sorry, not so good with the technical stuff.

6) Small killies can be kept with shrimp if you don't mind them snacking on juveniles and shrimplets!

7) Most of the Neocaridina genus should be no problem.
Blue pearls and snowballs have recently been reclassified under N. palmata, and although I have no experience with blue pearls, I've had snowballs and normal ones and they're totally ok with warmer temperatures, although I have to say their "output" is much less than N. heteropoda lines like cherries, rilis, yellow, sunkist.
Malayan shrimplets are very tiny and I have known someone to use them as fish fry food.

8.) N. heteropoda shrimp in general do not consume fish eggs, unless the shrimp have been starved. Not so sure about N. palmata. In this respect, I wouldn't use yamato shrimp as I suspect they would consume fish eggs; they eat everything.

9) No idea about these sorry.

10) Nerites are what I'd recommend too bro, but just note that some of them have the regular habit of coming out of the tank to "dry" their shells if the water is too acidic. Initially you have to take care to pick up those that have dropped out of the tank back into the tank but they learn quick and don't climb so far as to drop out of the tank after a while. Baby sulawesi snails, comes up regularly on the forum as well, will not infest the tank, though they munch regularly on the plants, but if you don't mind and are going for the regular plants I mentioned, this shouldn't be a problem.

[johnchor]

hello bros

thanks for your kind and expert advice.
i have read up the internet. and came out with a list of shrimps that i wanted to keep with small killies.

1) N. heteropoda var yellow - yellow shrimp - the reason i choose this is because not many yellow shrimps around. hardy shrimp that can do well in SG temp.
2) Caridina cf. babaulti - green shrimp - it wont hybrid with Neocaridina - hardy shrimp that can do well in SG temp. is there any in SG LFS?
3) CRS or any Red Sulawesi Shrimp- i wanted a red shrimp but i do not want cherry as it will hybrid with yellow shrimp. any other good choice for red shrimp that will not hybrid with yellow?
4) what about a blue shrimp? i read neocaridina zhangjiajiensis pearl blue will hybrid with cherry red...

bro draka
does your snowball hybrid with cherry red?

and plants yes thanks bro again for great advice. so many to choose from.
do you guys use LED T5 or T8 light for plants?

thanks!

[akillifan]

I have some yellow fire shrimp currently with me. Think still need cold water so, keeping them in a tank around 26 C. Bought 8, and after 1 month only 1 casualty. Got it from seaview but quite rare, so must watch out for them....

[Draka]

1) N. heteropoda var yellow - yellow shrimp - the reason i choose this is because not many yellow shrimps around. hardy shrimp that can do well in SG temp.

Sunkist is another one you might consider, darker orange kind of colour.

2) Caridina cf. babaulti - green shrimp - it wont hybrid with Neocaridina sp.- hardy shrimp that can do well in SG temp. is there any in SG LFS?

Hard to have these buggers reproduce though. Hmm you could try c328 I guess, they do bring bags of them in. Polyart should have a tank of them.

3) CRS or any Red Sulawesi Shrimp- i wanted a red shrimp but i do not want cherry as it will hybrid with yellow shrimp. any other good choice for red shrimp that will not hybrid with yellow?

Are you planning to get a chiller? What is the pH you will be maintaining the tank at? CRS are very sensitive to temperature and frankly, prolonged period of time of being above 28 degrees Celsius they can't take it. Sulawesi Shrimp are very sensitive and difficult to keep and I don't think they would do well if you can't give them the parameters like those bro lucasjiang mentioned. However, if you do wish to experiment anyway, keep away from Harlequins and Red stripes, they won't even begin to last without a dedicated tank.

4) what about a blue shrimp? i read N. palmata pearl blue will hybrid with cherry red...

Pearl blues imho would potentially hybrid with cherry red. By the way some people mix up blue pearl and blue rilis, they are different. Anyway either will still hybridise. Just a personal experience, but sunkist and blue rilis can be mixed, cause their offspring would be green to yellow. Just don't choose those blue rilis with red colour on them.

bro draka
does your snowball hybrid with cherry red?

Very long ago since I had snowballs, yes they do hybrid. Waste of time, lightens the colour only.

do you guys use LED T5 or T8 light for plants?

erh can't remember leh

[johnchor]

hello lucas bro

your sugesstion to keep caridina propinqua Orange Sunkist Shrimp seems like a good alternative to yellow shrimps.
i read that these are from indonesia are they expensive and diffcult to keep?

thanks

[QUOTE=lucasjiang;704057]Hi, i dont keep killies so i might not be able to answer all of your questions, however i will attempt to answer some
7) Malayan shrimps, yamato shrimps, cherry shrimps, wild cherry shrimps, caridina propinqua