Changing of substrate to another totally. How will Flora and Fauna react?

[Aquanoob]

I am not sure whether this is the correct section to place my questions.
If it is not, the mod can shift it to the appropriate section. Sorry for the trouble.

Now, this is my situation: I started my planted tank last October with little consideration for the appropriate substrate, and I simply choose the black quartz and fine sand with no root tabs for my tank. I started to plant, and at a later stage started adding fertilisers, but the plants just can't flourish. I am thinking of switching the current lousy substrate totally to GEX light green water plant sand so that the plant can get nutrients from the soil. My question is will the flora and fauna survive this ordeal?

I only have zebra danio, white cloud minnows and cory at the moment with the intention of adding a few algae-eater soon. My plants are from the Anubias, Hygrophila, Bacopa, Marsilea, Crypts and Echinodorus family.
This is what I intend to do:
1. Move the fauna to a holding tank or pail and use an air-pump to supply
oxygen into it. Just feed a little everyday for the entire transition period.
2. Move the flora to pails at first before planting it back to tank, but can they survive the period?
3. Empty the entire black quartz and sand. Wash the tank for water calcium stains and algaes.
4. Put in the GEX water plant soil. Put back the flora and water to start the cycling for about 7 days. I will be using back the same filter materials, and using either mineral or distilled water to start the cycling.
5. Move the fishes back into the tank after the cycle.

Am I doing the right thing or did I miss some essential steps?
By the way, do I still need to add in substrate fertiliser or just the Gex soil will be enough?
All advices and guidance are appreciated.

Edited: From what I checked, the cheapest 2kg GEX water plant soil is $12 minus 15% discount so is $10.20.
If anyone know of any cheaper source, please pm me. Thank you.

[Blue Whale]

Aquanoob bro, actually Wilfred is using GEX, I see very little problem with it. My black sand looks like quartz too but I seen actual quartz which reflect light more. Now basically same situation. Plant could not flourish/survive. Ok...before switching over to ADA AzII, I do have my dilemma. But AzII also took some time to adjust to it. Wil's tank size same as me but we bought seperate place and decided at seperate time without informing each other. GEX Soil with Seachem Flourish, hardly any other stuffs he is adding. So far his tank looks fine.

If you going to the workshop this Sat, I think GC is a good place to ask more on GEX Soil or those who have attended the first workshop. Support your decision to change but I can't offer more info on the soil, haven't try yet.

[blue33]

I suspect is the CO2 and ferts issue and not the substrate you are using, i seen people using lapis sand growing like nobody business, i dont see why your substrate got problem.

If you really want to change the soil, then try to use back the old water/plant/filter, they comes with the bacteria from your old tank.

Try at your own risk when someone without experience advised you.

[reveru]

hi, actually i have had similar situation like yours before i switched to nutrient-rich substrate. some background, i used black quartz with root tabs. the plants were able to grow, but they never flourished and their growth always seemed a bit impeded. after i switched to better substrate, the growth was immediately obvious after the transition period of approx 1-2 weeks.

personally, i would say that discarding the black quartz would be a sound choice if you intend to grow plants. as for the point adrian raised, i am not sure about lapis sand as quite many forum-ers use them and still grow plants very well! so perhaps, the issue is with the black quartz sand?

i think GEX soil is quite good, no need to use ADA soil if you wish. However, you may wish to note that price wise, ADA soil is cheaper if you get the 9 kg bag. Not sure what your tank size is, so can't comment. Your fauna will probably survive the transition if you do daily water change to the pail (my guess will be around 10% each time) but whether your plants survive or not depends on their current health. I tried to keep some of my plants in a pail with light and excel dosing but after a week, most of the leaves melted. hope yours will turn out better than mine.

good luck!

[Aquanoob]

Thank you Michael, Adrian and Reveru for your constructive comments.
I believe I will start on the substrate-change soon, and hope that I will
have a more flourishing planted tank.

Michael: Yes, I am going for the GC workshop this Saturday and will check on the GEX soil with them.
Adrian: I am using just plain black quartz with absolutely no nutrient, that is why I am trying to give the plants a better substrate. I don't have CO2 and t is supplementing by Excel and other micro and macro ferts but the plant are still unhealthy and slow-growth.
Reveru: Initially I also thought of just putting in root tabs to solve the issue but it is not a long-term solution and the cost is also higher. Regarding the plants, I will put them back into tank after the substrate is ready, so I guess they will be out about half day, and I will plant heavily at the initial stage. I realised that the cost per kg for the ADA 9L soil is actually cheaper, but my tank is just 2ft and I don't need so much of it. If anyone want to share, just pm me.

Few final questions: Do I need to put in further substrate fertiliser if I am using GEX or ADA soil? I ever went to one of the reputed LFS and they say still need to put some "powder" in-between the soil to make the water clear and to cultivate bacteria?

[k3nlim]

You might like to create a slope from the 9L of soil, you will need this amount. I have a 2 feet tank too and 9L is not sufficient to make a nice slope.

Just two cents of opinion, the black quartz with their "sharp" edges over time will compact and cut into the roots of the plants. There are some differences between the red(shrimp, lesser of certain nutrients i presumed) and green(for plants) GEX packs, i could be wrong. Further substrate fertiliser is all depending on the needs and types of plants you're intending to have, however, additional fertiliser could prolong the "life span of the soil".

[blue33]

If you look at Dennerle product they are using quartz sand and they can grow fantastic plant. What missing in your setup is CO2, without CO2 you are limited to certain plant, infact when you using Excel you are supplying carbon to the plant, the amount you supply and the ferts you provide may not be enough to your plant growth(could be due to your lighting also), another thing is the temperature also.

[reveru]

Hi aquanoob, no need to thank, not sure how much help I am anyway. just sharing my "black quartz" experience with you that's all.

As adrian has pointed out, i think that it is highly probable to be able to grow good plants even with quartz sand. However, for me as a newbie starting out learning to grow good plants, using a proper substrate will make my learning curve less steep and easier to handle. Perhaps if you really understand plant growth really well, growing plants with quartz will be feasible as well as decorative. Personally i will just stick to the newbie basics and use nutrient rich substrate. If not, see my plants don't grow well i will feel very demoralised also.

Btw, i think that if you have 2 ft, you should just get the 9L bag of ADA amazonia II. It's barely enough for a 2 ft. If you have a flat scape, then yes it is enough, but if you want to create depth by sloping, think you will need another 3L bag. For me I used 9L bag of amazonia II, plus 3L of amazonia II powder, initially. But still not enough slope (as you can see from my thread). After that, I bought another 3L bag of soil powder, and used 1L to enhance the depth. Now i have 2L of amazonia II soil powder spare, don't know what to do with it also.

So in conclusion, 9L not enough! Anyway, good luck!! Hope it works out well for you!

[Blue Whale]

Phew...lucky I am not the only one. Adrian is correct on Lapis. You guys just made my day.

I have better experience with Lapis where plants simply grow like nobody business. But once you hit by a snail outbreak, lapis becomes a very good hiding ground. As one ages, eye sight will simply go down, hence it makes the snails harder to spot. Even with a 13 strong hunter group, there will still be something like hundreds of snails hiding in the sand if you ply open. So there is my only concern on lapis, not that lapis is not good.

Az2, comes in two forms, two size. 3L, 9L and Normal, Powder type. Powder type will be costlier than non-powder. As Reveru pointed 9L is barely. I put in 12L, one each, and still find it barely suffice. The last iwagumi workshop Thio and Vincent made a valid point, you just cannot put everything in. You need to keep some for later adjustments. So for 2ft, I would recommend 2x3L and 1x9L in terms of quantity. But when comparing price, it would be more economical to get 2x9L instead.

[tawauboy]

are you injecting co2 and dosing fertilizer into your water column?
with co2 injection, you can get good plant growth even with a pure lapis sand substrate. plants are able to get nutrient from both the substrate and water column.

if you are not injecting co2, plants will have poor growth even with a rich substrate.

if you are already injecting co2, you can try inserting fertilizer sticks into the substrate. if you are able to improve plant growth significantly, then consider making a big change to your substrate. with this route, you'll be able to determine whether your substrate is the issue.

[Blue Whale]

Yeap. Earlier stage when I started off, its about the period when Vinz showed off his Aro in his planted tank. I use 3 CO2 system if it does not sound too exaggerating. Tank with Solenoid and 2 x DIY. So the CO2 tank was 3bps but on timer. I only use regulator when the solenoid gives way and decided to die on me. (Mods please make correction if my terms are not correctly use)

As for experiment wise, I added 3L of ADA Az2 to the tank before I could make the HC grow. The water quality significantly once Az2 is introduced. So I am quite sure its the soil. Plant nutrients wise, no change throughout the 5 years. Entire Seachem series. Only iron I use Alife one which is a lighter version compared with Seachem. Lapis wise I use an entire bag of JBL fertilizers as the base fert. Black sand/quartz really look cool but I did not use fert base since I saw some successful examples but experience wise, maybe just not there yet...I sucks...ha.