just something to share about blue green algae.

[Navanod]

The really quick and easy answer would be to spam large floating plants like frogbits.
When you start seeing the frogbits turn yellow and die, it means the algaes are also suffering from nutrient starvation. Throw away most of the dying frogbit and then maintain.
Note that any other plants would also likely die though...except maybe some of the more hardy mosses

[ralliart12]

Incidentally, I use the same method to treat my fish when they have initial fungus on the body.

I simply dab the local spot with salt solution with a dropper...

Is your "salt solution" mixed with Hydrogen Peroxide?

...Anyone know more abt this cheap and straight forward method of clearing BGA?...

I'm also very interested to know how to clear BGA, because as you can see (focus on the unplanted soil near the top of the photos):





I'm in trouble (& furthermore, the photos are color-corrected, i.e. they are decently close to what I see in real life).

...When i started having this problem and asked around, was constantly either refered to using some strange chemical which i have no clue about or tearing down and restarting the whole tank.

I will actually be quite wary about introducing unknown chemicals into a closed environment. & I can't afford to tear down this tank anymore, i.e. done it once already.

BGA is a kind of bacteria, smelly, and to remove, you need to get rid of it completely...

Is that the main reason why algae eaters (in generals, the snails, the Amano shrimps, otos, & the SAEs) wouldn't consume it?

...Therefore, more hydrogen peroxide is needed to nuke the tank...

Any residual effect from this "much more" Hydrogen Peroxide? I believe Hydrogen Peroxide oxidises to form water (H2O) & oxygen when introduced into water; actually, I'm curious to know, in a waterless environment, what does it do? Evaporate almost instantly?

...Then you will have to follow-up with ample supply of CO2 and nitrate.

I'm considering to apply this in a dry-start method implementation, so I believe supply of CO2 isn't an issue, i.e. the infected area (the topsoil) is in direct contact with the air. However, explicitly supplying nitrate will be a challenge. & furthermore, wouldn't excess nitrates give opportunities to other algae forms? What role does nitrates play into this BGA elimination?

...I am actually very impressed that bro tetrakid managed to use it to treat fungus on his fish...

Actually I do not know if his "salt solution" contains H2O2 though.

just be vigilant. once it tip beyond the threshold level...

If there's no fauna & only flora, may I know how do I determine the "threshold level"?

...H2O2, once in the water, is a very potent oxidizer that strips electrons (hydrogen ions) from everything it comes into contact with. This is deadly to the BGA and algaes and the reaction normally produces harmless H2O (water) and O2 (pure oxygen, the bubbling that is observed)....I recalled an old lab experiment where we pour H2O2 on a piece of fresh raw pork liver and it started bubbling as mammal have the enzyme for breaking down oxidizers in the liver...

I wonder what will happen (chemically & physically) if I mist it on substrate that's not underwater?

...The real danger of dosing too much is there however, and it'll also skew the redox potential (which can kill off all the bacteria in the filters) of the tank so go easy on the thing...

Oh no, I wouldn't want that, i.e. theoretically, after doing dry-start implementation for a while, I'm supposed to have some amount of beneficial bacteria in my substrate.

...Lastly, this chemical is an explosive precursor and is controlled by the police and only very diluted forms can be sold. If you see any concentrated H2O2 (mostly 30% or higher), especially overseas, do not buy it, thinking that it'll be better or cheaper.

I got mine from Guardian pharmacies. Actually, is there a reason why they are kept in such dark bottles? & do their shelf life decrease exponentially once the cap is opened?

[Navanod]

H2O2 will still break down into water and oxygen, when if left on their own, it just needs energy to drive this reaction, hence the dark bottle to prevent light from getting in.

2 (H2O2) -> 2 (H20) + O2

Opening the cap should not impact shelf life as much as temperature would.

You can certainly spray it on the soil, and it'll simply kill everything in that localized area.

[ralliart12]

H2O2 will still break down into water and oxygen, when if left on their own, it just needs energy to drive this reaction, hence the dark bottle to prevent light from getting in..Opening the cap should not impact shelf life as much as temperature would...

So...advisable to store it in the fridge?

...You can certainly spray it on the soil, and it'll simply kill everything in that localized area.

There should be no long term (residual) effects on the substrate right? i.e. since all oxidisation should happen almost instantaneously & shortly?

I'm thinking of pouring some (H2O2) into a misting bottle & misting the affected topsoil area with it; any thoughts/warnings?

Secondly, what will happen if I mist my HC with it (the H2O2 solution), in order to clear any BGA that is possibly on the HC but undiscernible to my eyes (since the HC is also green)?

[Navanod]

Yes, you can store it in a cool dark place like a fridge. In the diluted 5% form, it wouldn't be a hazard.

I do not think there will be any long term effect by misting the top soil, except maybe some reaction with the soil pellets which should not be a major concern.

On the HC, I'm certain that it'll melt the leaves. The only thing I can think of now is an antibiotic application but then again, you want to cultivate soil bacteria.
Leave the HC alone for now, the BGA is also probably doing the same from the picture.

[ralliart12]

...I do not think there will be any long term effect by misting the top soil, except maybe some reaction with the soil pellets which should not be a major concern...

May I know what type of reaction? Will it render the topsoil infertile?

...On the HC, I'm certain that it'll melt the leaves...

Is it because I have no water in the tank, that's why the H2O2 will melt the HC leaves? Or even with the tank flooded, direct application of H2O2 on HC leaves will just melt it? Even so, why? Why is HC so sensitive? Shouldn't HC, be a "higher-level" organism than algae & be more "resistant"?

...The only thing I can think of now is an antibiotic application but then again, you want to cultivate soil bacteria...

So, on the topsoil where I mist the H2O2, I suppose I will lost the bacteria colony there?

...Leave the HC alone for now, the BGA is also probably doing the same from the picture.

Actually, not really, i.e. notice on the right hand side of the overview photo, there are more "holes" in the lawn? I suspect the HC around that area is fighting a losing battle to the BGA, otherwise it will fill up those holes already.

Donovan, may I dose undiluted SeaChem Excel on the HC directly? 2 questions:

1. Will Excel rid BGA?
2. Will dosing Excel on emersed HC melt them leaves as (you suggested) H2O2 does?

[ralliart12]

& also, do I need to physically remove the "supposdly-dead" BGA after I attacked them with H2O2?

[Navanod]

May I know what type of reaction? Will it render the topsoil infertile?

Is it because I have no water in the tank, that's why the H2O2 will melt the HC leaves? Or even with the tank flooded, direct application of H2O2 on HC leaves will just melt it? Even so, why? Why is HC so sensitive? Shouldn't HC, be a "higher-level" organism than algae & be more "resistant"?

So, on the topsoil where I mist the H2O2, I suppose I will lost the bacteria colony there?

Actually, not really, i.e. notice on the right hand side of the overview photo, there are more "holes" in the lawn? I suspect the HC around that area is fighting a losing battle to the BGA, otherwise it will fill up those holes already.

Donovan, may I dose undiluted SeaChem Excel on the HC directly? 2 questions:

1. Will Excel rid BGA?
2. Will dosing Excel on emersed HC melt them leaves as (you suggested) H2O2 does?

I'm not a chemist but my guess is it'll react with the humic acids in the soil, as well as any iron. It may actually "free" these things up for the plants but that's just my guess.

Ok, let put it this way, if the H2O2 is strong enough to kill the BGA, it's going to be strong enough to damage the HC's leaves. If you directly hit a higher organism like a fish with it, it's still going to burn it's skin. HC is more sensitive because of it's tiny size I guess, I'm just speaking from past experience where I tried to "clean" newly bought HC of pests and algae using chemicals like potassium permanganate.

For the bacteria colony, the same rule as above applies. H2O2 is a harsh chemical that leeches electrons. Everything gets hit equally at ground zero.

Seachem Excel undiluted will also damage the HC. Again, if it kills the BGA, it'll also damage the plant. Excel is a strong reducer, a chemical related to formaldehyde (the chemical used to "fix" tissue samples in hospitals and museums so they'll never ever rot).
Instead of stripping electrons like H2O2, it donates (actually, is bombards) electrons onto everything it touches. When diluted, plants and animals tolerate it by blocking it out with their skins/epidermis. A direct hit at ground zero would literally bleach & melt the entire HC.
Same damage as H2O2, except minus the O2 bubbling. Instead of O2, it produces carbon based byproducts that is then used by plants as a substitute for CO2.

[Navanod]

& also, do I need to physically remove the "supposdly-dead" BGA after I attacked them with H2O2?

I think you should, since BGA can form spores under adverse conditions, then come right back again at a later time.
Don't try to remove everything though, these spores are everywhere in the environment anyway. Just remove what you can see to lower the chances of a revival?

[Navanod]

You know...with all this being said...are you very certain that its BGA?

[ralliart12]

You know...with all this being said...are you very certain that its BGA?

Any way to tell for sure? But shouldn't H2O2 kill all algae without discrimination?

[felix_fx2]

ralliart12, mind me saying one thing. time to bring in the great flood
That amount of growth is enough for a kick start using DSM.

btw don't introduce shrimps directly after flooding, wait a day or 2.

[EricNg]

H2O2 will be reduced into normal water eventually... dont have to worry

[Navanod]

Any way to tell for sure? But shouldn't H2O2 kill all algae without discrimination?

Yes it should kill all algae. But if its normal green algae, then why bother? I'm just hoping to save you some work and cash
BGA normall forms biofilm, and is a slimy film layer that smells bad...unlike algae

[BlessChwee]

I have patches of green algae on the substrates and I dont know if its BGA. beside using this chemical, is there any other way to get of rid of this type of algae. I saw that not switching the lights for 3 days can get rid and anyone tried this method ?

[ralliart12]

...But if its normal green algae, then why bother? I'm just hoping to save you some work and cash ...

Oh, misting the topsoil should be easy, i.e. I have a clean mister bottle sitting idle & since there's no water in the tank I'd figure I'll simply cover the HC regions with a piece of cloth & mist away.

As for the "cash" part, I've a few bottles of hydrogen peroxide sitting around the house doing nothing too. So no worries here.

But thanks.

...BGA normall forms biofilm, and is a slimy film layer that smells bad...unlike algae

I don't dare to smell the topsoil, i.e. I'm afraid I may inhale foreign substances into my body

ralliart12, mind me saying one thing. time to bring in the great flood ...

PM-ed you something.

...That amount of growth is enough for a kick start using DSM...

I was expecting more (coverage) actually; I have seen DSM implementations on this forums (& overseas forums) that makes mine seem modest, if not a failure (of DSM).

Anyway, Shadow mentioned the leaves *should* rot away too, as they switched into submerged mode, so this (meagre) amount, theoretically also means nothing when water floods the tank.

...btw don't introduce shrimps directly after flooding, wait a day or 2.

Actually I intend to kept the tank, "pure-planted" for a few months (up to half-a-year) before introducing the 1st batch of fauna.

[Navanod]

Best is you try it at a corner first then. And maybe hit a tiny clump of the Hc to see too?

[felix_fx2]

I will make use of Dsm to let plants take proper root and flood when the spread is some what decent enough.

I know there are alot who let dsm grow to fully cover before flooding. But I got no patience

[BlessChwee]

I have posted in another thread asking if mine is gsa but no resposne so can someone here please confirm before I try this H202 method

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[Shadow]

yes that look like BGA to me. BGA have strong smell, smell like first rain of the season, if you know what I mean .