Substrate

[SwordZ]

Hi all!
Currently, planning to get some soil/substrate for my hairgrass. Can anyone recommend a budget 2~5kg soil/substrate?

[thebaldingaquarist]

I have used ANS, HELP, ADA and GEX.

All the soil works for me and HG. but i will not recommend GEX.

[Urban Aquaria]

Just get ADA aquasoil, the overall price difference isn't that much compared to the other brands.

You can get smaller quantities of it from places like Y618 or Polyart, but it usually works out more cost effective to just get the standard 9 liter bag, can keep for future tanks or sell in smaller portions to others.

[elwaynetan]

I will second Urban Aquaria. Rather the quality!

[hiisoka]

ADA for me,
never go wrong

[Phillipians]

Maybe the first question is how big is your tank? 2 - 5kg is a really quite a bit of difference.

If only 2kg then to save cost ANS is pretty alright. Quite budget and good enough for HG. If 5kg and above, then seriously you might as well go for ADA. As mentioned earlier its good cost effectiveness in the long run.

[bennyc]

when i started, i use a mixture of soil (nobrand, H.E.L.P, ADA ). no brand from seaview cost ~$15 for 5 kg. ADA is around $45 for 5 kg. Looking at my soil now, most (around 50%) had become powder, only the top portion still stays in shape (small round soil) Since it is a mixture, i cannot tell which disintegrated the most.

Anyway, my personal opinion is HG are not very particular, i have seen them grow from sand gravel too. But considering you might try other plants in the future, which most hobbists have "itchy hand" and "walk to lfs to see see but end up buy something" syndrome. Investing in a good one will be a good decision for the long run. My experience have taught me the motto "do it once, do it good". Painful for the pocket but good for many things else.

Maybe the first question is how big is your tank? 2 - 5kg is a really quite a bit of difference.

If only 2kg then to save cost ANS is pretty alright. Quite budget and good enough for HG. If 5kg and above, then seriously you might as well go for ADA. As mentioned earlier its good cost effectiveness in the long run.

Phillipians, i am confused with the cost effectiveness aspect, do you mean the soil disintegration, lesser need for ferts, or? i always hear people say that but what exactly seems not described.

[SwordZ]

Mine is a 61 cm by 46 cm by 46 cm tank. Umm can you all please kindly state the prices of the brands you named? Hopefully its not going to damage by wallet too badly, I still kinda need some expenses for school

[Urban Aquaria]

Mine is a 61 cm by 46 cm by 46 cm tank. Umm can you all please kindly state the prices of the brands you named? Hopefully its not going to damage by wallet too badly, I still kinda need some expenses for school

For your tank size, you'd need at least around 9 liters of soil to fill it properly and get a nice sloped scape.

ADA Amazonia Aquasoil 9 liter bag is around S$38-$40... just for quick comparison, a 2 liter bag of Gex Soil is around S$12-$14, the 4 liter bag is around S$20, so when you add up the cost of multiple packs to fill up the tank, ADA actually works out cheaper.

There are even cheaper brand soil at LFS, but the words on the bags are in japanese or broken english, and can't find much info on them online either. Honestly if you are only saving $10-$20 getting those, you're not saving much compared to the entire setup of a tank... nowadays, you'll likely to spend the same or more money just buying a movie ticket and popcorn combo.

If you use ADA aquasoil and encounter any tank issues, its easy to get advice from others to diagnose and find a solution, as alot of people have been using it for years... but on the other-hand, if you use other brand soil, then it becomes more difficult to find solutions as much less people use those.

Think of it this way, the soil substrate is perhaps the most important long-term component in a planted tank and unlike other equipment which can just be easily swapped out if its not good or efficient, you'll have to do an entire tank overhaul if you want to change the substrate... so might as well use the tried and tested stuff from the start and save the hassle of future changes.

[SwordZ]

Thanks! I guess I have to start saving up then . Could you recommend where to get the cheapest ada soil?

[Dodofish]

Thanks! I guess I have to start saving up then . Could you recommend where to get the cheapest ada soil?

Go to your favorite lfs is better. Because they will served you with a smile! And if you have questions, be sure they are willing to help. I ever spent close to a thousand at a regular lfs, bought something of wrong size and was directed to a section to help myself.

Saving a few bucks will not help a lot. It's like what urban shared.

or you can also consider learning the hard way, anyhow buy, burn notes to try. Hehehe.

i also feel a good substrate is important. So far, I have tried ans, gex, and easy aqua. I prefer ans out of the three, it's definitely richer in nutrients. You can skipped the last two.

[Urban Aquaria]

Thanks! I guess I have to start saving up then . Could you recommend where to get the cheapest ada soil?

Seems everywhere all around the same retail price, though i guess some LFS might give abit of discount to their regular/old customers.

You could also keep a lookout at the forum trading section, sometimes there are chaps selling used ADA aquasoil that are only used for a few weeks or months and still contain most of the initial nutrients... even if the soil is used for more than a year, its still good as a high cation-exchange substrate, can hold ferts well and release steadily to the plants.

[SwordZ]

Umm, actually all that I want is something that allows me to plant the plants well. Also, I don't really have a favourite lfs... Anyway, could you guys please explain to me (really sorry about this) the difference between soils like ada and rocky substrate?

[Zeonic]

Just follow the advise from the brothers here. Go for ADA Amazonia soil. And also watch the videos on how to plant hairgrass and the proper initial water filling method.

I would go for the powder form.

[Phillipians]

when i started, i use a mixture of soil (nobrand, H.E.L.P, ADA ). no brand from seaview cost ~$15 for 5 kg. ADA is around $45 for 5 kg. Looking at my soil now, most (around 50%) had become powder, only the top portion still stays in shape (small round soil) Since it is a mixture, i cannot tell which disintegrated the most.

Anyway, my personal opinion is HG are not very particular, i have seen them grow from sand gravel too. But considering you might try other plants in the future, which most hobbists have "itchy hand" and "walk to lfs to see see but end up buy something" syndrome. Investing in a good one will be a good decision for the long run. My experience have taught me the motto "do it once, do it good". Painful for the pocket but good for many things else.



Phillipians, i am confused with the cost effectiveness aspect, do you mean the soil disintegration, lesser need for ferts, or? i always hear people say that but what exactly seems not described.

Hi BennyC
Actually what I meant is if he is going to buy more, than it makes more sense for him to get the quality one (ADA) as the price difference is less than if I only need to buy 1 or 2kg of it. Long run, easier to replace 1 - 2kg in small tank than 5 - 9kg in a bigger tank. So its more cost effective in this sense.
Also if he is really on strict budget, then no choice ANS. No matter how cost effective it is, he does not have then cash for it.

[Phillipians]

For your tank size, you'd need at least around 9 liters of soil to fill it properly and get a nice sloped scape.

ADA Amazonia Aquasoil 9 liter bag is around S$38-$40... just for quick comparison, a 2 liter bag of Gex Soil is around S$12-$14, the 4 liter bag is around S$20, so when you add up the cost of multiple packs to fill up the tank, ADA actually works out cheaper.

There are even cheaper brand soil at LFS, but the words on the bags are in japanese or broken english, and can't find much info on them online either. Honestly if you are only saving $10-$20 getting those, you're not saving much compared to the entire setup of a tank... nowadays, you'll likely to spend the same or more money just buying a movie ticket and popcorn combo.

If you use ADA aquasoil and encounter any tank issues, its easy to get advice from others to diagnose and find a solution, as alot of people have been using it for years... but on the other-hand, if you use other brand soil, then it becomes more difficult to find solutions as much less people use those.

Think of it this way, the soil substrate is perhaps the most important long-term component in a planted tank and unlike other equipment which can just be easily swapped out if its not good or efficient, you'll have to do an entire tank overhaul if you want to change the substrate... so might as well use the tried and tested stuff from the start and save the hassle of future changes.

Actually Urban aquaria sums up pretty much what I wanted to say about the cost effectiveness in the bolded statement.

[Urban Aquaria]

Umm, actually all that I want is something that allows me to plant the plants well. Also, I don't really have a favourite lfs... Anyway, could you guys please explain to me (really sorry about this) the difference between soils like ada and rocky substrate?

ADA aquasoil and gravel (ie. the "rocky" substrate you mentioned) have very different characteristics which suit different type of aquariums.

Here are some pros and cons i can think of so far:


ADA Amazonia Aquasoil

Pros:
- Nutrient-rich content, ideal for plant growth.
- Buffers pH and kH to create a favorable environment for plant growth.
- High cation exchange capacity (CEC), which means it can store alot of nutrients for plant to use, so the ferts you dose and bio-waste broken down into nutrients by beneficial bacteria are efficiently held by the soil for plant use.
- Soil granules and shape are ideal for planting plants and their roots can grip and spread in the substrate easily.

Cons:
- Need extra care when initially adding water to the tank, and when doing tank maintenance or re-planting, or else it can get messy and cloudy.
- Not practical to do conventional substrate cleaning (ie. gravel vacuum), or else it kicks up the soil and becomes cloudy. Have to allow the waste to breakdown in the soil.
- If used in non-planted or very lightly planted tanks, there will be a higher chance of nutrient imbalance and algae issues, hence need to manage bio-load more closely and do more water changes to flush out the excess nutrients.


Gravel

Pros:
- Inert, therefore no extra nutrients being released into the water column initially.
- Can move around the gravel without kicking up as much dust and dirt.
- Easy to clean manually by using a gravel vacuum.

Cons:
- Inert, therefore very little or no nutrient content, which means you need to dose fertilizers or add root tabs to provide nutrients for plants.
- Does not buffer pH and kH, hence the water conditions may tend to fluctuate often and not be as ideal for plant growth.
- Low CEC, therefore nutrients are not held in the substrate as effectively.
- Depending on gravel size and shape, may not be as ideal or as easy to plant in (especially for smaller carpet plants with shallow roots).


As you can see from the comparison above, the substrate choice just depends on what type of tank you want to keep. If its a tank with the focus of growing lots of plants, then ADA Amazonia aquasoil is the most ideal.... if its a tank with not much plants and mainly focused on keeping fishes, then gravel would be better as its easier to manually clean on a regular basis.

[SwordZ]

Thanks alot guys (emotional gratitude) , if so can I know where to get the gravel substrate? I'm mostly planning on planting only hairgrass and java moss, while the fish are my main focus

[Urban Aquaria]

Most LFS usually stock a wide selection of gravel substrates in various sizes and colors, just have to shop around to find the ones you like.

Alternatively, you could also consider using sand instead, the advantage of sand is waste material and excess food tends to just sit on top of it (rather then getting trapped and rot within gaps in gravel), so it's abit easier to clean, especially if you have messy fishes.

[AQMS]

Hi Swordz,
i see you are on a budget, what is your range? 1 pack of 10 kg sand (lapis) will cost around $8 - $18. I just bought 1 pack of 10kg yesterday at $8.
If you use sand then you have to buy fertilizer(powder form which you need to put below the sand substrate),or for a simpler solution you can get root tabs but it is costly.