Want To Setup Plant Carpet

[s050399b]

Hi, I intend to setup a Plant Carpet, covering the entire base of my tank (preferably about 3" min in height), and probably 1 or 2 tall plants at the side to cover the tubes.

What do you guys recommend?

I was thinking about Riccia or Moss. Could anyone comment on their CO2 intake? Or other special plant diet?

Is it possible to grow the above plants w/o CO2?

I'm thinking of rearing fancyful goldfish only.


Pls share your valuable experience with the newbies,

thanks,

[hwchoy]

no goldfish in planted tank.

[Aeon]

Yeh no goldfish please!
I like using Glossostigma as a carpet plant but they need lots of of light and CO2 to spread horizontally. If you have that go ahead.
Eleocharis Acicularis (hairgrass) is also good for creating fields of long grasses and pretty easy to grow but initial planting is a really painful chore. Took me 3 hours of bending and standing to plant an area of about 3/8 of my 2ft tank.

[cheeboonyong]

[quote:e3313b78="hwchoy"]no goldfish in planted tank.[/quote:e3313b78]

is that a purely asthetic reason or is it because the goldfish cannot survive in planted tank? curious to find out

[hwchoy]

goldfish eats practically everything! same goes for koi.

incidentally both these fishes were bred (over the last couple of hundred years) for the purpose of being viewed from the top. not sure if glass bowl existed during Ming period but I don't think so. Certainly have never seen any glass antiques, only ceramic.

[victri]

Goldfish in a planted tank can be done, but you need to do a lot of research into both plants and fish. In a tank, you'll probably be considering some nice sideview ranchu or ryukin etc.

- Water cannot be too acidic or fins will rot (most CO2 injected water will be slightly acidic). Don't use ADA soil or similar product that makes water very acidic. Ideal pH for goldfish is 6.8-7.6pH.

- There are only a handful of plants that goldfish don't eat. They'll probably try to nibble anways. Prepare to have bites on plants/roots.

- Goldfish produce A LOT of waste. Will affect water parameters and have waste accumulation problems if you have gravel. If you use riccia or moss as carpet, you'll probably be securing them to steel mesh, which will also trap waste. Danger of ammonia poisoning (blood streaks on tails).

- If you are serious about rearing quality goldfish, you'll be raising them in greenwater.

- Sick goldfish require a heater in the water. High temp not good for plant growth.

- Some amount of salt might be needed in the water to help the goldfish produce the slime that makes their scales healthy. Too much salt might affect plant health.

There are a lot more concerns, but I think you know where I'm driving at. Unless you devote much time and research into this, you'll probably end up with either nice plants and so-so goldfish, or nice goldfish with so-so plants. I have seen nice goldfish in nice planted tanks, but those owners have put in a lot of work and research beforehand. It can get very challenging. It's good that you ask before taking the plunge.

[PeterGwee]

Why do you want to keep a herd of goats when you want a lush ground of grass?

Regards
Peter Gwee

[greenie]

Something like this in mind?

[s050399b]

[quote:f0192cfc6b="greenie"]Something like this in mind?

[/quote:f0192cfc6b]


yes!!

[s050399b]

how do u make green water?

[s050399b]

[quote:54e4e85145="Aeon"]Yeh no goldfish please!
I like using Glossostigma as a carpet plant but they need lots of of light and CO2 to spread horizontally. If you have that go ahead.
Eleocharis Acicularis (hairgrass) is also good for creating fields of long grasses and pretty easy to grow but initial planting is a really painful chore. Took me 3 hours of bending and standing to plant an area of about 3/8 of my 2ft tank.[/quote:54e4e85145]


to how long does it grow to?
btw, does it grow if you cut it in the middle of the hairgrass and plant it somewhere else? or it will die off? need to duplicate to lots of hairglass before it will acheive carpet effect,

[s050399b]

as for the dirt that will be trapped in the "carpet", doesn't the plants make use of the dirt as fertilizers? pls advise,

i was thinking that it will be much cleaner to have "carpet" because all the waste will be eaten up by the plants....

pls advise,

[hwchoy]

to how long does it grow to?
btw, does it grow if you cut it in the middle of the hairgrass and plant it somewhere else? or it will die off? need to duplicate to lots of hairglass before it will acheive carpet effect,

no, what you see growing in green is just the leaves, you cannot cut it in half and replant. you need the growing point which is where the root is.

[hwchoy]

[quote:a59843475a="Aeon"]Eleocharis Acicularis (hairgrass) is also good for creating fields of long grasses and pretty easy to grow but initial planting is a really painful chore. Took me 3 hours of bending and standing to plant an area of about 3/8 of my 2ft tank.[/quote:a59843475a]

you're overdoing it or you're not using a proper pincer. you should just plant small clumps 2cm apart (too close and you disturb the previous clump you just planted). Also don't need to arrange them nicely, just use pincer, grip the clump at the root and shove it into the gravel, just leave the tip showing a little, it'll find its way out.

took me half an hour to plant 3 feet.

[victri]

First of all, you need ask yourself if you really really only want to keep goldfish and nothing but goldfish. Then you need to do your homework. Goldfish is certainly not an easy fish to keep. If you haven't kept goldfish or planted tanks before, I wouldn't advise you to jump right into the deep end and try to have a planted goldfish tank. Before you go ahead and plan your aquascape, use an internet search to find out what plants you can keep with goldfish. There are only a handful. The pure lack of results from the internet search should give you an idea of how difficult this is. I can't really think of any carpet plant that goldfish won't eat. I can tell you offhand that hairgrass and glosso and APP (elatine triandra) will be eaten or pulled out. Believe me, they will try to eat anything and everything. I hope you don't get some expensive Hemianthus callitrichoides to end up as salad for them. If you want to keep all these nice plants, then goldfish are probably not a good idea.

For plants to take in fish waste, they would have to be growing pretty well in the first place. Without proper light and CO2, you can expect growth to be slow. Half-eaten plants grow pretty slow too, if they even survive. You can't solely rely on plants to take in all the goldfish waste. Even with the best filter around, frequent water change is a must. You'll soon realize that they can really produce tons of waste that must be siphoned out daily/weekly. This can become a pain if you have carpet plants or gravel. Can I ask how many goldfish you have and your tank size?

Now for the hardcore part. Time for more homework. Look for information on rearing fancy goldfish. To keep very nice (competitive) goldfish that you spent hundreds or thousands to buy, most well-known breeders keep them in greenwater ponds. Greenwater is essentially floating algae. It is believed to promote good body growth and can be produced with strong light and some ammonia in the water. More than half the water is changed weekly/fortnightly, and a little bit of the greenwater is retained to seed the fresh water. This is a very delicate balance between getting the right amount of greenwater and controlling the amount of ammonia in the water. Use your imagination. Greenwater in a tank can be quite unsightly as you won't be able to see your nice Amano-style planting technique clearly. If you have greenwater, don't expect other plants to grow nicely.

Just keeping goldfish will ensure you have lots of issues/problems to learn about. Add to that the issues/problems that you'll have to address with a planted tank. You can take this as a subtle warning or challenge. Like I mentioned previously, it can be done, but it's not easy to have both. Most of the time, either the fish or the plants will not be at their best.

[s050399b]

I have with me the following
1) 3 feet tank with 3" of gravel
2) plants => java ferns + hydrallia?
3) 12 feeder goldfish + 2 fancy goldfish
4) 4 apple snails + one sucker fish

5) ample lightening (white light) from DIY
6) DIY CO2, but quite easier used up, about less than 4 days.
7) 10 tablespoons of salt


thinking of getting rid of the sucker fish as it keep sukcing on goldfish, and some of them are bleeding, and tails gone. so thinking of using plants to absorb the waste.

[s050399b]

[quote:fbab76165c="hwchoy"]Also don't need to arrange them nicely, just use pincer, grip the clump at the root and shove it into the gravel, just leave the tip showing a little, it'll find its way out.

took me half an hour to plant 3 feet.[/quote:fbab76165c]



hihi, where can u buy hairgrass? and how do you multiply them? i was thinking if i could buy 2 bunches and grow them into 10 bunches?

i'm doing the same for my hydrllia

[budak]

I was at NA NAture Aquarium yesterday and saw that Chan has grown a very lush carpet of tennelus in his 1.5x1.5 tank. Every square inch is covered by the plants, looking like a lush marshland. Chan uses just plain gravel and 2x36W PL. He told me he limits iron dosing for this tank so that the tennelus stays a bright green rather than turn reddish. The tennelus carpet has more "form" compared to a hairgrass carpet where the thin stems merge visually into each other, and Chan has managed to get larger specimens to develop in the centre of the tank. Overall, a very successful effect I won't mind imitating.

[hwchoy]

[quote:978b0b8ad9="s050399b"]
hihi, where can u buy hairgrass? and how do you multiply them? i was thinking if i could buy 2 bunches and grow them into 10 bunches?

i'm doing the same for my hydrllia[/quote:978b0b8ad9]

hydrilla is a stem plant, which you can chop into two and plant both to get two plants, macam earthworm lah. hairgrass is a rosette, cannot chop.

if you want a lot of HG, go and buy from Teo. but don't be greedy, each clump that you plant should not have more than 5-10 strands (of leaves and roots) otherwise it will overcrowd.

if you serve in SAF, you know how to fall-in parade square right? do the same for hairgrass planting, about 2cm part will do. then have patience for next 6-8 weeks, plus good lighting and CO2.

[s050399b]

one question:

if i were to rear other fishes, how does one clean the grass carpet? uproot all the grass and clean the sand?

pls advise.........