Questions - New Tank 60x30x24cm

[tcg170980]

Hi guys,

I am starting a new planted tank - 60x30x24cm

Bought 2*ADA amazonia 9L, 1* Powersand and the above tank.

Intending to purchase: CO2, 2217 and hailea H28 - unless there are better suggestion.

I need suggestion for :

-Light - prefer LED - suggestion? 100-200 +- range. read 6500k is optimal for plant. Is there a different if i get 10000k or higher?
-Filter - 2217 - or any suggestion?
-Do i need to lay a layer of aquasoil on top of the bigger substrate for better planting?
-which brand of solution for growth etc is tested and gentle to the pocket in the long run.

Thanks,
tan

[fateddee]

Hi bro,
Regarding the Light: It really depends on what kind of plants you intend to grow. I myself have a 60x30x36 tank and i'm using Odyssea Evo 48W Led.
This is a high intensity LED light and consist of a mixed LED (12:4) giving off 2 kinds of wavelengths 10000k and 6500k respectively.
One of this light should be sufficient... Width of the light is 14cm (this was told to me by the shop uncle)
You can find it at east ocean or other LFS
http://www.eastoceansg.com/odyssea-e...ant-p-820.html

The other light i would recommend is the UP Aqua Z series LED. But you might need to get 2 of these because the short width of the light (7cm)
THe Led is also less intense and it comes with only a single wavelength-8000k

http://www.eastoceansg.com/up-aqua-p...ant-p-987.html


Regarding the soil, From what i've read on the numerous online forums, the Amazonia Powder form makes it easier to plant Carpet plants such as HC etc.. also the smaller size of the soil would make your aquarium look alot larger. However this is not essential. HC can still grow on normal aquasoil.

But in my own experience I'm using the Power type and it works well. I guess its up to individual preference and budget since the powder type is alot more expensive.

[tcg170980]

Thanks bro.

looking to grow HC as carpet.

I can just overlay the powder form onto my aquasoil as i already purchase 2 *9l.

Odyssea Evo 48W Led -Is EastOcea the sole distributor or i can get cheaper from petmart etc?

[Urban Aquaria]

The height of your tank is only 24cm, so you'll need to either get lights that are less strong (if mounting over the tank), or suspend stronger lights much higher up to reduce the intensity.

1 bag of 9L aquasoil would be more than sufficient to fill up the substrate slope, remember that your tank is only around 43+ liters volume and low height so by the time you fill it with substrate, the effective amount of water and overall tank volume will be much less too. If you use 2 x 9L of aquasoil, its almost getting close to half of the tank's volume.

Aquasoil powder type is recommended (either as sole substrate or as top layer) to keep the sense of scale in your tank. Smaller soil granules help your smaller plants root in easier and enhance the perceived scale of low-profile tanks.

Eheim 2217 flow rate of 1,000 l/ph will be very strong for your tank volume and low height, so you'll definitely need to install a double tap on the output to adjust the flow, more filtration is always good, but the main issue i see is you may have to adjust it until so low that the motor might encounter problems. It could be a better idea to get a filter model that does 500-700 l/ph instead, more suitable for your tank size and you can still adjust it lower reasonably.

[fateddee]

The height of your tank is only 24cm, so you'll need to either get lights that are less strong (if mounting over the tank), or suspend stronger lights much higher up to reduce the intensity.

1 bag of 9L aquasoil would be more than sufficient to fill up the substrate slope, remember that your tank is only around 43+ liters volume and low height so by the time you fill it with substrate, the effective amount of water and overall tank volume will be much less too. If you use 2 x 9L of aquasoil, its almost getting close to half of the tank's volume.

Aquasoil powder type is recommended (either as sole substrate or as top layer) to keep the sense of scale in your tank. Smaller soil granules help your smaller plants root in easier and enhance the perceived scale of low-profile tanks.

Eheim 2217 flow rate of 1,000 l/ph will be very strong for your tank volume and low height, so you'll definitely need to install a double tap on the output to adjust the flow, more filtration is always good, but the main issue i see is you may have to adjust it until so low that the motor might encounter problems. It could be a better idea to get a filter model that does 500-700 l/ph instead, more suitable for your tank size and you can still adjust it lower reasonably.

Hey bro, Can i just ask what is the main concern with too high intensity for a shallower tank? algae? But what if I supply enough co2 n nutrients?
Still learning so i'm very interested to know.

[Urban Aquaria]

Hey bro, Can i just ask what is the main concern with too high intensity for a shallower tank? algae? But what if I supply enough co2 n nutrients?
Still learning so i'm very interested to know.

Well, its mainly about getting the right balance of light for your tank... for low-profile tank owners, they have to take into account that the light will be much closer to the plants so the relative intensity to substrate level would be greater (compared to a taller tank).

Most of the light recommendations for 2ft tanks are usually based on 30-36cm heights (the common heights for 2ft tanks), so the same lights which are found to work well in those tanks may end up too strong for your lower height tank.

If you can supply enough Co2 and nutrients to keep up with the higher light intensity, then no problems. But if it is too much and you already max out on Co2 and nutrients, but still encounter difficult algae issues, then have to raise it up until the intensity is just right for the tank (or switch to less powerful lights).

[fateddee]

Well, its mainly about getting the right balance of light for your tank... for low-profile tank owners, they have to take into account that the light will be much closer to the plants so the relative intensity to substrate level would be greater (compared to a taller tank).

Most of the light recommendations for 2ft tanks are usually based on 30-36cm heights (the common heights for 2ft tanks), so the same lights which are found to work well in those tanks may end up too strong for your lower height tank.

If you can supply enough Co2 and nutrients to keep up with the higher light intensity, then no problems. But if it is too much and you already max out on Co2 and nutrients, but still encounter difficult algae issues, then have to raise it up until the intensity is just right for the tank (or switch to less powerful lights).

Ahhh interesting! Always learning something new everyday! thanks bro

[wongce]

Need to strike a balance between light, co2, fertilizer regime.

There is no need to dump all your money into expensive stuff right away... start slow and steady. Once you get the hang of balancing the tank, rescape...or get a new tank to scape...lol

You can search this forum for more information in the newbies section. Alternatively, you should check out Urban or my blog... should be sufficient to get you started..

[thebaldingaquarist]

Hi,

I think you have a good set of substrate. In my opinion, you can do without the powder. I had done a HC carpet with non powder ADA before.
Filter.. too big. a 2215 should suffice.

You may also want to think about CO2 delivery system. I would advise a solenoid controlled Pressurize CO2 tank and a drop checker. Or if you have some extra money, get a PH controller with the solenoid.

Lights - LEDs are cost effective in the long run, but expensive up front. In that range, you have EVO (If i am not wrong) and UP to choose from.

Others -
Fertilizers, depends largely on what you want to plant. if all the plants you selected are root feeders, should not be a problem. If water changes are not a problem, then you may want to go up the EI track. If not, like what UA mentioned, you will need to find the balance.
Key thing here is the plant selection and the mass of plants. I recommend no more than 3 types of plants and plant heavily. If unsure of what plants to go for, you can see IAPLC tanks and check out what combinations they adopt with HC. also can try ADA tanks.


Wood/hardscape - Shop around for rocks and wood.. may take a while.

[tcg170980]

thanks guys,

I am getting a 2nd 5l co2 tank tonight saved my trouble of topping every now and then.

will the HC spread up the slope even if there is no base fertilizer like the below?
http://www.aquascapingworld.com/maga...er-Kirwan.html

[thebaldingaquarist]

thanks guys,

I am getting a 2nd 5l co2 tank tonight saved my trouble of topping every now and then.

will the HC spread up the slope even if there is no base fertilizer like the below?
http://www.aquascapingworld.com/maga...er-Kirwan.html

It will. provided the slope is not too steep. i have approximately 30 degrees slope and they creep up and down.

[tcg170980]

today i bought my hardscape,3L aqua powder, timer and T5 4tube light. as all greenelement led is out of stock.

going to try DSM. going for pure HC carpet first...
thats all i need right?

anyone have spare to sell or give me?

[erwinx]

Have a look at this article by George farmer on aquascaping a low tank. He talks about LED lighting for the tank:

http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.u...t.php?sid=5633

I also read with interest his claims that T5HO don't really degrade whereas a lot of LED manufacturers say T5 degrade...? :

"High-output T5 lamps with electronic starters will remain operational at near full strength for their entire life — and that can run into several years"

[tcg170980]

according to petmart, T5 is suppose to be stronger than Odyssea Evo 48W Led.

The T5 is half the price and led was out of stock. hence i purchase the T5.

[Urban Aquaria]

Have a look at this article by George farmer on aquascaping a low tank. He talks about LED lighting for the tank:

http://www.practicalfishkeeping.co.u...t.php?sid=5633

I also read with interest his claims that T5HO don't really degrade whereas a lot of LED manufacturers say T5 degrade...? :

"High-output T5 lamps with electronic starters will remain operational at near full strength for their entire life — and that can run into several years"

I like that article too... very informative.

I guess he is referring to the really high quality/expensive T5 light systems, not the cheaper ones most of us usually use.

according to petmart, T5 is suppose to be stronger than Odyssea Evo 48W Led.

The T5 is half the price and led was out of stock. hence i purchase the T5.

T5 is indeed "stronger" if looking at raw power consumption, output and visual perception (alot of light spread out, so it looks brighter), but the effective amount of light that the plants can actually use is a different matter altogether.

I'd usually take lighting advice from LFS staff (especially those with no aquascaped tanks on display, or those with tanks full of algae) with a pinch of salt... their salesmanship usually become top class when trying to clear stock.

[tcg170980]

T5 is indeed "stronger" if looking at raw power consumption, output and visual perception (alot of light spread out, so it looks brighter), but the effective amount of light that the plants can actually use is a different matter altogether.

I'd usually take lighting advice from LFS staff (especially those with no aquascaped tanks on display, or those with tanks full of algae) with a pinch of salt... their salesmanship usually become top class when trying to clear stock.

Hi UA,
So do you mean T5 is indeed inferior to beamworks?

[Urban Aquaria]

Hi UA,
So do you mean T5 is indeed inferior to beamworks?

Nope, not inferior... just different, both types of lights have the ability to grow plants well (if all the other plant growth requirements are balanced) and both have their pros and cons.

For your T5 light, just make sure it's not placed too close to the water surface as it tends to heat up a lot more, and make sure the tube spectrums are designed for plant growth. Also monitor the light intensity over time as the more economical ones sold at most LFS tend to have shorter lifespans.

Btw, what brand T5 lights and specs did you get?

[thebaldingaquarist]

debate between the types of lights, especially between LEDs, MH, T5ho, T8 has been ongoing as long as i remember..

I have no balls to start a debate here, but all i can say is, stay with 1 kind of light and choose the color temperature that's good for your tank.

[wongce]

I used t5, led evo.... from my observation

t5 is the winner if u have low budget high wattage lights e.q 4x 24w t5 is a lot brighter than led evo if you compare side by side

However, if you want to save power bills in the long run,led wins.

I have both evo and t5 4x24 setup. T5 brightness will drop after sometime. I do not have second set of led evo to test though.

Conclusion, both works and it depends on your budget and what you want....

[bennyc]

ERic, I also agree with you, when talking about lights. The thread will have no end. If the choice is not debatable, obviously, noone will buy T5 and noone will sell T5.

I assume you get Aquazonic T5 lightset so the tube by default should be the 10000k one. 6500k is more suitable for plants. You might find 10000k brighter, since it is more bluish, because our eyes are naturally more receptive to bluish lights.

other than brightness drop over time, and more power used. It is also hotter which during the light on period, increases your tank temperature.

If price is not a consideration, i think LED will be a better choice.