Undergravel filter questions for planted shrimp tank

[leghair]

Hi all,

I am thinking of creating a planted cherry shrimp tank with mainly moss, ferns & anubias (nothing with root system in the soil) using under gravel system connected to a hang on back filter.
Reason for this system is to prevent baby shrimps from getting sucked into hang on filter.


1. Is there any possible problem with this system that will haunt me next time?

2. Can i use ada or planta soil for this system? Will the substrate get sucked into my hang on filter connected or i need to put netting on top of the under gravel system?

3. Any recommendation for the soil? I am cool with using inert soil but i don't want to dose n check for pH. That's why wanted to use ada or planta soil which is about 6.5 pH for cherry shrimps

Thank you!

[Berny]

1. yes, shrimps might be hiding below the ugf


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[bennyc]

Hi leghair,

(funny to say hi to leg hair)

just for your information, ferns & anubias do have root system.

Anyway, you do know Undergravel filter is already a form of filtration right? so to add a hang on filter to it seems "extra". if the goal is just to prevent shrimplets from been suck in, Fine SS mesh will do. In the market, the sponge inlets does not seems to work. If not, try using sponge filters, as the sponge becomes a hotbed for microscopic lifeforms which shrimps and shrimplets can feed on.

Ungravel filter seems old school and not a popular choice for current hobbists. hahaha. maintenance becomes difficult as the whole substrate have to be remove. Soil will also break down faster due to the constant pressure. in short i will not recommend it.

[qngwn]

Unlikely that the shrimps will be able to get through the many layers of soil to reach beneath the UGF.

You can put a netting over your UGF mesh as over time, soil breaks down and debri would accumulate, or that the broken down soil will go into your filter.

[Berny]

his first introduction paragraph didn't mention that he will broke using any form of soil. it's only mentioned at question 2 and 3

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[bennyc]

Hi berny, it is understandable the soil will break down overtime and quicken with the use of UGF.
i think it is a point to highlight to newbie to look for, to better measure their options.

[leghair]

Hello people, sorry for the late reply.

Thanks for the replies.

I think i shall find a fine netting to cover the UGF n attach the piping of the UGF to a hang on filter rather than using air pump. it's more like a DIY thingy. air pump very noisy compared to hang on filter.

What do you guys think?

[vara1000cc]

I think u shld go hob rather UGF.

[felix_fx2]

I think u shld go hob rather UGF.

Just a note, please refrain from using SMS long inside of AQ.

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[bennyc]

Newbie, clocking post count. No time to read rules.

[qngwn]

Newbie, clocking post count. Haha. You see the list of post.

Time to see him active in the marketplace

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[bennyc]

Time to see him active in the marketplace

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Hopefully he sell something good so i can buy.

[qngwn]

Hello people, sorry for the late reply.

Thanks for the replies.

I think i shall find a fine netting to cover the UGF n attach the piping of the UGF to a hang on filter rather than using air pump. it's more like a DIY thingy. air pump very noisy compared to hang on filter.

What do you guys think?

Leghair,

Air pump not only helps to aerate the water column, it also promotes gentle flow through the gravel.

Having and HOB filter instead forces water through the gravel at certain speed, speeding up the breaking down of the soil at the bottom most layer.

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[leghair]

I am keeping the tank in my room. The vibrating sound of the air pump is one of my main concern.

[qngwn]

I am keeping the tank in my room. The vibrating sound of the air pump is one of my main concern.

There are many silent air pumps in the market. They might be a little pricier, but definitely worth it for the silence they provide.

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[bennyc]

From my experience, it is very difficult not to notice any sound coming from a fish tank. HOB filter has the water trickling/gushing sound, air pump has a humming sound. I have use cheap china made air pump and gex. GEX air pump are quite silent relative to the others (they have rubber stubs for legs and compact wool at the air diaphragm). So far, only canister filter are silent provided the inlet and outlet are under water, but air exchange might be a problem.

I suggest you think proper before deciding. More haste might become more "work" in the future.

[thebaldingaquarist]

For a planted tank, i would recommend against UGF for the following reasons
1. soil breakdown will cause it to be extracted and brought to the water column. your water will always be sightly cloudy
2. for UGF to be effective, the gravel should be evenly spread out. if not the water intake would be uneven. this point is LFS uncle say one... don't quote me.. but it makes sense.. thicker gravel means water will not pass through that easily.. given a slope like what we normally do in planted tanks, this will mean water will be circulated mainly through the thinner sides of the gravel.
3. planted tanks, the soil carries a good amount of nutrients. the nutrients when released are meant for the root system of the plants. if sucked away, the nutrients will be circulated to the water column. excess nutrients will cause other issues.
4. Higher circulation will mean higher rate of nutrient depletion for soils with higher CEC. soils like ADA have higher CEC. this means that the you will need to change or "renew" the soil earlier than expected.
4.

[bennyc]

I think i shall help summarise everyone's view. UGF is not suitable for soil based planted tank.

[qngwn]

For a planted tank, i would recommend against UGF for the following reasons
1. soil breakdown will cause it to be extracted and brought to the water column. your water will always be sightly cloudy
2. for UGF to be effective, the gravel should be evenly spread out. if not the water intake would be uneven. this point is LFS uncle say one... don't quote me.. but it makes sense.. thicker gravel means water will not pass through that easily.. given a slope like what we normally do in planted tanks, this will mean water will be circulated mainly through the thinner sides of the gravel.
3. planted tanks, the soil carries a good amount of nutrients. the nutrients when released are meant for the root system of the plants. if sucked away, the nutrients will be circulated to the water column. excess nutrients will cause other issues.
4. Higher circulation will mean higher rate of nutrient depletion for soils with higher CEC. soils like ADA have higher CEC. this means that the you will need to change or "renew" the soil earlier than expected.
4.

Eric hit the nail on its head regarding the use of UGF for planted tanks.

As for shrimp keepers, their soil is generally level throughout, else the shrimps will flatten it over time.

Soil properties introduced into the water column generally help to buffer water parameters. So as water is being passed through the soil, it constantly helps to buffer the water parameters.

It's difficult to get the best of both worlds, it's good to decide if you want more of a planted tank, or more of a shrimp tank to help you decide your type of filter, as well as the type of soil that you will use.

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[Urban Aquaria]

I guess there is a reason why its called "under gravel filter"... its for use with gravel.