Reply With QuoteSome more dead clown loaches...
Dead Fish 2.jpg
Hi Anyone can advice?
My clown loaches keep dying. Mostly is bloated stomach. At times, some with have bloated stomach+ pop eyes. What happen? I've tried partial water change and add salt. There must be a way to help? Please advice...?
Attached some photos for your expert advices.
Thank you,
Melvin
Some more dead clown loaches...
Dead Fish 2.jpg
what do you feed your clowns?
looks like internal problem..
what other tank mates do they have?
What fireblade said^
I suspect bacterial infection and poor water quality. Clown loaches need to be maintained in pristine water quality and have to be treated as 'scaless' fish due to small scales that make them more sensetive to medications and disease. Not a good fish for beginners.
Just a heads up: Bloated stomachs and pop-eye disease is caused by bacteria.
Indeed.. Research "Epsom salt" on Google search, it might help..
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The entire tank main fish is clown loach and Blue Botia loach. I'm still learning thought but I not newbie. Feed fishes with (1) Small Live Molly, (2) Live Ghost Shrimp, (3) Chopped Market Prawn Meat, and occasionally (4) frozen blood worm &/or Tetra Bits dried food.
My tank run for over a year liao. Food as above still fish purchase. Just occasionally they will died 2-4 per day for 1week. When disaster strike, I usually lost around 20-30 pieces clown loach. But funny thing is that the blue loach also same tank and eat same food, same water. They are okay. Only clown loach affected. Why?
Is this 'Epsom salt' the salt aquarium use when they pack fishes. Sometimes, I buy feeder molly, the shop will throw abit inside with the molly.Originally Posted by zeus888
Feeder fishes and shrimp may contain all sorts of disease. Chopped flesh will rot whenever there are leftover bits(and there will be!) and cause bacteria growth in water, which then diminishes the water quality and kills your clown loaches. Blood worms are considered 'treats' due to its low nutrient content and also all live feeder(s) are 'useless' unless fed with nutrient supplements a few days prior to offering. Like I stated earlier, clown loaches are super sensetive to water quality and therefore need over-filtration, especially since you're feeding live/meaty foods. Botia loaches are slightly more hardier in my opinion... All loaches need highly oxygenated water and excellent filtration plus alot of other stuff to ensure their wellbeing. Here's a site for more information.
http://www.loaches.com/articles/an-i...-keeping-botia
What is your tank's size by the way?
Also, Epsom salt is used as a general 'prevention medication', but may not be suitable for sensetive fishes like loaches or scaless fish. They dump it in with the feeder fish in hopes of preventing a disease outbreak... which does not work every time.
Okay this is what I did yesterday. I change a lot of water. Maybe change 50%. Usually I dun change so much. After water change, I put in anti-chlorine powder and salt. I have heater in my tank but if no white spot, usually I will off it. Yesterday I on the heater to 30 degree for about 24hrs. Yesterday I have 1 last bloated loach. I hope she can survived but she died today around 5-7pm.
Today bought $10 feeders prawns and again fed prawn meat. Up to now seems fine. They are all full today. After they are full then I clean my entire sump tank filteration (running for >1year without cleaning). I change another 10-15% of water. Add anti-chlorine powder and salt too.
My tank water is 320liters(70gallon) + my slump tank is 110liters(29gallon) so total my tank is 430liters(99gallons).
Clown Loach.jpg
Can our Clown Loach grow till this size in girth? I have try pumping my loaches. None grow of my loaches girth comparable to the above. Had feed them :
1) Dice Market Prawn Meat
2) Feed Fish (Molly, Ang He, or long kang he)
3) Ghost Shrimp
4) Frozen Blood Worms
5) Tetra Bits
6) Hakira Sinking Pellet
7) Tetra Ray Waffer
Any one have luck to grow the loaches in girth? I think I have better luck keeping "Blue Botia Loaches". Occassional die 1. Super hardly compare to clown loach.
The water change may have played part of the factor. For loaches, its better to change the water at LEAST two times a week and at most 25%. I see that your temperature is fluctuating, which stresses the fish and lowers their immunity system. Loaches can be very greedy, so feed sparingly- three times a day in small amounts.
It also seems you change the water too quickly and the loaches will get more stressed, plus the fact that you did not clean the filter is probably one of the reasons why you can't keep the loaches alive for long. How many fish do you stock in your tank? 99G is a little overcrowded for a group of clown & botia loaches... Not to mention including the deco, size gets smaller. Have you ever tested the tank to check the water quality?
Also, clown loaches can get up to 12-14 inches just like in the above picture. These loaches are the results of excellent filtration, large tank space and high quality feed. Go online on other sites and you can see pictures on them. By the way, do you supplement your feeders before offering to the loaches?
Griffith DreamWalker, thanks for your reply. Yes clown loach can get to 30cm or more in tank but this seldom happens in tank maybe ponds yes. Even if I keep 5 in a 6fts tank, do you think they will reach 15cm in 5years time? Maybe can, but unlikely from my experience. If clown loach can grow 1" in your tank, VERY good liao. U try. My Blue Botia loach grow better. Even them hardly grow this size. Maybe from 3" (time of purchase) they have grow to now 5-6" bah.(That is every day feed prawn meet for >5years)
Anyway, updates as of today. My loaches all fine(no dead) visible. I still have bloated stomach loaches but they seems bloated(bcos eat very full) and not bcos of sickness. My $10 of feeder ghost shrimp almost all hamtam finished. LOL
Last edited by melvin1976; 10th Nov 2015 at 14:38.
Hm, maybe I'll consider them once I get a bigger space.
Never overfeed your fish, no matter the temptation. Constant overfeeding causes obesity and whole slew of problems. My old fishes died due to me overfeeding = Dirty Water = Bacteria growth = disease+parasite etc. I've learnt my lesson and since then, unless my fish is a 'specialized' fish like a seahorse or pipefish then I'll make sure there's only small amounts given.
You have yet to answer my question- do you gut-load your feeder fish/shrimp with nutrient supplements before feeding to loaches? If not, your pets may not be receving enough nutrients for them to thrive and grow.
Do you offer snails? Loaches love eating snails.
No, I do not gut-load your feeder fish/shrimp with nutrient supplements. I dun buy snails for them, neither seen any tiny snails for sale before except the Apple Snails which is too big for them. As for over feeding or not. I cannot control. I just pour feeders inside. They finished 1day or they take 1month to finished, I cannot control. As for the prawn meet. I will feed "just enough". If I feed 4prawns a session and they finished all, then I may feed 5prawns next session. If I feed 4prawn 1 session and they have leftover, next session I will feed 3prawns.
Snails can be found at c328, or on AQ forums. Just ask around. Without gut loading your feeders, your fish are generally eating excess fats and gain nothing, which is why they won't grow big.
'Just pouring the feeders' in is already overfeeding- so is offering food till they can't consume the rest. You can control the amount, its just whether you bother to or not. Clown loaches are very greedy creatures, so YOU are the one that has to keep them in good health as your responsiblity as a pet owner. :/
How many times do you feed your fish everyday? Offering 4 pieces of chopped prawn at one feeding period is overfeeding, and who knows what things uncooked prawn flesh contains... Not to mention that shellfish(prawn especially) contains a ton of mecury... posionous stuff and in no way good for your fish- or for your consumption in that matter.
To sum things up:
1) Stop overfeeding your fish, feed them in small amounts. Fishes can't control themselves, so don't expect them to stop when they're SUPPOSED to stop.
2) Frequent SMALL water changes, at least twice a week, at most 25%.
3) Wash filter every 2-3 weeks. Being lazy with this causes many problems, especially since you offer meaty foods to your fish.
4) If you want BIG FISH, feed feeder fish high quality feed few days prior to offering, then gut load nutrient supplement before offering to fish.
5) Culture your own feeders as its cheaper and more nutritious. LFS stock are prone to carrying disease, parasites and bacteria into your tank.
6) Quarantine all livestock for a few weeks with detailed care to prevent disease outbreaks.
'Just pouring the feeders' in is already overfeeding- so is offering food till they can't consume the rest. You can control the amount, its just whether you bother to or not. Clown loaches are very greedy creatures, so YOU are the one that has to keep them in good health as your responsiblity as a pet owner. :/
Yes bro. Next time I buy $10 of ghost shrimp feeder. I catch the prawns 1 by 1 and feed the fish until full. The I stop the feeding. Also I will throw away my wardrobe and go loan shark borrow money and build 1more tank to keep the balance feeder prawns. Or I can everyday take bus go fish shop by $1-$2 ghost shrimp to feed my fish. Also I know I am not responsible owner as my fish sick and still post online asking for help. I also know I not responsible owner when I take time and trouble to go buy feeder for my fish. Should just feed pellet better.
How many times do you feed your fish everyday? Offering 4 pieces of chopped prawn at one feeding period is overfeeding, and who knows what things uncooked prawn flesh contains... Not to mention that shellfish(prawn especially) contains a ton of mecury... posionous stuff and in no way good for your fish- or for your consumption in that matter.
Overfeeding??? Yes expert. 4prawns to feed my fishes is over feeding. But I have 1000 fishes in my tank leh(for example), how U know I overfeed huh? U foresee or already know I have 1000 fishes in my tank? And among my 1000 fishes, how U know I dun have catfishes huh? And how U know my catfish different from the rest, on-diet type and dun eat much prawn meat huh? So U can conclude I overfed! Prawns meat got mecury, pallet got pesticide pollution, water also got tons of chemical, eat air better. Wait air got haze and these small harmful particles. Better kill the fishes early to avoid them suffering.
Wash filter every 2-3 weeks. Being lazy with this causes many problems, especially since you offer meaty foods to your fish.
How many hobbies here do that huh? May I ask? Clean your canister filter every 2-3weeks. Clean your slump tank every 2-3weeks. Clean your overhead filter every 2-3weeks? If many hobbies do that then I think all the company selling the good bacterial cultivation solution can close down liao. Good bacterial that have cultivated will all kenna wipe till kosong. haha. If clean filter every 2-3weeks is responsible owner. Then I have to admit I am not the responsible owner in your book.
4) If you want BIG FISH, feed feeder fish high quality feed few days prior to offering, then gut load nutrient supplement before offering to fish.
To eat chicken, I have to raise a chick. To raise a chick, I have to buy egg. To have egg, I have to by a hen and a plot of land. In theory Yes. U do that? I go buy feeder to fish my fish still I need to take care of the feeder huh? Need buy ginseng for the feeder before the feeder can feed my fish?
5) Culture your own feeders as its cheaper and more nutritious. LFS stock are prone to carrying disease, parasites and bacteria into your tank.
Yes, I need to knock down a room and hack away my kitchen to spare rooms for my new tank and YES, new tank is just to keep feeder that eat ginseng.
6) Quarantine all livestock for a few weeks with detailed care to prevent disease outbreaks.[/QUOTE]
Yes, build a feeder housing tank. Build another Quarantine tank. Build a hospital tank for sick fishes. I will keep in mind when I moved to landed property.
Seriously I would like to thank you Mr/ Ms Giffith DreamWalker for your time writing to my enquiry. U mentioned "...maybe I'll consider them once I get a bigger space...". May I ask if you have kept clown loach before? And your reply statement is too 1sided. Everything have 2sides. My fishes (clown loach + catfish + angels + other fishes do finished my 4pcs - 5pcs market prawns in 5mins) If can consume in 5mins, is it still overfeed? Thank you so much for your time.
Best Regards,
Melvin
Last edited by melvin1976; 11th Nov 2015 at 03:04.
Melvin1976,
I don't know why you get so offended(oh I am assuming you are offended, maybe you are not) to Giffith DreamWalker's reply, although he is quite frank and straight to the point and assume, I think some of his points are quite valid.
We are all here to help and not fight. Without checking what other fishes you have and assume you have overfeed might be a bit too early to say but looking at what you typed, I guessed you have overfeed your fish too just with this sentence below.
Lets assume that 1x$2 packet of shrimp that LFS sells contains 20 -30 shrimps(I don't know how many as I don't feed live feeders to my fishes)? $10 got how many shrimps? think about it (at least 150 shrimps?)..Anyway, updates as of today. My loaches all fine(no dead) visible. I still have bloated stomach loaches but they seems bloated(bcos eat very full) and not bcos of sickness. My $10 of feeder ghost shrimp almost all hamtam finished. LOL
How many fishes you have inside your 430liters(99gallons) tank? If there is 1000 fish, confirmed that your tank is overcrowded and thats the reason why your fishes are not growing well, also your sump need to clean more often if you have 1000 fish inside..means that your water is super dirty too ao your fishes get sick...
You only need a 2 feet tank to keep your feeders, don't think you need to sell your wardrobe and borrow money from loan shark to do that.
Actually I was quite surprised that you feed many kinds of live feeds to your clown loach and also market prawns. As I only feed them pellets and they grow well too.
What I think is, the live feed contains bacterial and sickness which causes the death of your clown loaches as to why it did not affect your other fishes, I think different fishes have different immunity levels, just like human beings, when someone in a class is sick , not all students will be sick, only the weaker ones will, and not always the strongest ones won't get sick, sometimes they do.
just my 2 cents worth. hope this brings some light to you.
Hi fireblade, first of all, thanks for your time replying. Let me address why my response towards Giffith DreamWalker's. This statement "Just pouring the feeders' in is already overfeeding. Is this statement true? Example: If I buy $1 of feeder fish and pour all in, overfeeding is it? btw, just to highlight ghost shrimp needs to pour all in else the fatality rate is super high.
You can control the amount, its just whether you bother to or not. Clown loaches are very greedy creatures, so YOU are the one that has to keep them in good health as your responsiblity as a pet owner. :/ I pour all my feeder into the tank. So am I being accused of NOT bothering for my fishes and IRRESPONSIBLE hobbies?
3) Wash filter every 2-3 weeks. Being lazy with this causes many problems, especially since you offer meaty foods to your fish. I didn't wash my filter every 2-3weeks. Am again I am being called LAZY! Come on, U guys really wash slump tank/ canister/ overhead filters every 2-3weeks huh? For over the years so-bo ? Serious?
And of course many many more things lah. Need to set up feeder tank, need to feed feeder nutrients. Need quarantine tank etc. I keep 1tank to see fish needs to buy another 2-3tanks huh for the fish food huh? I think I'm out of trend liao, lol
Feeder I would prefer feed ghost shrimp only but they dun last for long. Within a week all gone. Last purchase, $10 finished in 2days. So at times I buy small molly. Fishes last much more longer, maybe 1-2weeks. Why fish feeder purchased is at times, shop dun have ghost shrimp too. So buy replacement feeder fish. I know feed pallet, water more clean, I'll try revert the loaches back to pallet. Any recommendation? I used to feed them Hakira sinking pallet can I know what pallet U feed your loaches?
Hi,
just some advice lar... Now I am assuming that when you say pour whole packet of shrimps in, you included the water as well, my advice is try not to pour the water in as it might contaminate your tank water, as in how, I will think that the water will carry disease of course you can argue that the fishes and shrimps in it also have.. well theat is just my believe.
actually you can keep a few molly in your tank, then every now and then your clowns will have just born babies to eat provided you do not have any other thank mates that can eat adult molly.
asking you to cultivate you own feeders is to minimise disease outbreak, there is also a chance that fishes in your tank with poor quality water might still give you another set of problem.
think of what works well for you is the best. actually keeping some molly in the sump workable?
because you mentioned you bought $10 shrimps, thats why we all thought that everytime you will buy $10 worth and dump them in.
Although Giffith DreamWalker's reply is harsh I think his intention is good and wanted to help you find out the problem... only problem with us nowadays is we cannot see the face behind and red it in our own imagine tone and jump to conclusion too fast..
As I've kept clown loaches as scavengers, they eat what ever food that I feed to my other fishes.. one that I can think of now is carnivorous pellets, algea waffle and other food with high protein, even hikari lionhead pellet should be good.
maybe some of the replies will trigger you to think about what went wrong and do a remedy both more lives are being wasted..
Posting Permissions
Bookmarks