Dennerle Fertilization

[overdrive]

No, no, the 25% of tank volume only applies to V30 and E15, for the rest you would have to dose the whole water volume. For gold7 I dose 4 tablets weekly, I dose 2 tablets on the 1st day, then 1 tablet on the next day, then the last tablet the following day. i find that this is more effective and it doesn't cloud the water.

[arclaveus]

Today, i did a 25% water change n proceeded wif my first dosage of the Dennerle system. However, when i inspected my tank a while ago, i spotted a little bit of hair algae n BBA forming on the gravel!!! What shld i do?! Here r my dosing details n foto period info.

Tank : 3ft x 18" x 18"
Lighting : 2 x 55Watts + 2 x 36Watts = 184Watts
Lighting Period : 7hrs (Uped from 6hrs yesterday)
Co2 : 2 bps
Water change : 40L
Seachem Prime added due to water change to neutralize chloramine (1ml)

Dosing:
1) S7 - 1ml
2) TR7 - 8ml
3) PG7 - 1 capsule
4) V30 - 5ml

**All added at one go.
planning to dose E15 on the 15th of the month.

Pls advice! Thanks!

[ah^siao]

some people that i talked to said that just follow the normal regime and even during water change do not have to add in additional fert?

[sunnydaze]

Guys,

I have been using Dennerle since I switched from Lou han to planted 10 months ago.
I am a late comer in planted tank, already 38 liao. My tank is small, Juwel Rio125.

Like to share my dosing experience,

S7, PG7, TR7--- dose total volume of tank every 7 days, I do it every Sunday. S7-2.5ml, PG7 2 cap, TR7 5ml (for a total of 100l tank cap.)

E15 - dose volume of water changed (25%)on the 15th of each month. But I do it on every 4th sunday. 1 tab.
V30 - dose volume of water changed on the 30th of each month. But I do it every 4th sunday, 2 wks apart from E15. 2.5ml. Becareful with this one, don't overdose, will cause lotsa green algea on glass, at least for my case. But if you increase a little, your plants can hav BIG leaves,( for my case, trim at least 10 leaves off my Red Tiger Lotus every 4 weeks)
In short, E15 & V30 dose once a month, 2 wk apart from each other.

This is the first time I am posting, hope its not too long winded.

[overdrive]

Yup the beauty about Dennerle is that you just need to follow the instructions to the core. Which means you only dose alternately once in two weeks btw E15 and V30, eventhough you make water changes weekly. But make sure you dose S7, Gold7 or TR7 weekly for the whole tank volume regardless of water change. I find that S7 makes my fish much more active too. Arclaveus, the reason you're getting some hair algae is cuz you don't have enough CO2 in your water, increase as required till you reach a consistent 30-35mg/l of CO2 consistently in your water whenever your lights are on. Maintain this lvl and when your plants grow all the algae will be eradicated ;D And I agree that one should not overdose with V30 as it can invite algae but V30 is very effective for stagnated plants.

[wongteeliang]

No, no, the 25% of tank volume only applies to V30 and E15, for the rest you would have to dose the whole water volume. For gold7 I dose 4 tablets weekly, I dose 2 tablets on the 1st day, then 1 tablet on the next day, then the last tablet the following day. i find that this is more effective and it doesn't cloud the water.

Icic.... Thanks for the advice... actually E15 and V30 1 mth once. don't really save much. I'm more concern about the weekly once...

[overdrive]

I'm using E15, V30 and S7 in one tank only, these 3 will last you the same amount of time if used according to instructions, but one other tank I dose Gold7 and the effects are much better. I guess the bare minimum would be E15 and V30, while S7 is much recommended and Gold7 once awhile.

[augi_ow]

whats the average cost if i get the whole dennerle fert package.... just a rough cost, and how long does it last for a 3 feet tank....

[overdrive]

Well I'm not sure whats the price in Singapore, but I'm in malaysia and I find that the pricing when compared to other commercial ferts Dennerle has the cheapest cost per use because you only use a little as. So, my big 250ml V30, S7 and E15 will last me one year or more for my 4 feet tank if I follow instructions. This is the cheapest if you were to compare it with other brands according to instructions and the results are very good too. So I guess for a 3 feet it will last much longer.

[cookie]

Check out this web page for more info on the usage of dennerle products.

http://www.newleafaquarium.com/faq.html

[FLIM]

Hi,
Just want to check with all the Dennerle expert here on G7.
Normally I will open-up the yellow capsules and pour the G7 powder in a plastic cup which hold some tank water . After that, I will stir them and pour the mixture into the tank. I notice some G7 is not dissoved fully and settled on the sand substrate. I will just leave it as it is in the tank.
After a day or so, a clump of white thingy look like cotton will appear and cover the G7 residue. Is it normal ? Is my dosage method correct ?

Thanks in advance.

[overdrive]

Well according to Germany, one should just throw the whole Gold7 capsule in the water as the capsule is part of the ingredient. The capsule will float for awhile and then slowly melt and turn white thus slowly releasing its contents so as to not to cloud the water. Don't open it first.

[Plantbrain]

Cheap?
Why do you spend lots of $ for KNO3 and water?

If the stargrass and Ammannia improved, good chance you where limited on NO3 and adding the fert just added NO3, and perhaps K+.

These plants are sensitive to low NO3.

I suggest folks used the basic nutrient salts, they cost next to nothing and are standard and testable. How do you test the Dennerle components?

Is there an A-7 test kit?

Plants all use the same thing to grow, if you like paying a lot for cheap ferts in a bottle, it's your wallet.

That was the whole PMDD issue over here, back to late 1980's/90's when Dupla came to market and sold everything they could think of and many felt gouged here. So they added the ferts like KNO3, K2SO4, later KH2PO4, traces had been added for a long time already.

I spend perhaps 20-30$ and I have a lifetime's supply of most ferts.
I know precisely what I add and the form and can test it.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[StanChung]

Cheap?
Why do you spend lots of $ for KNO3 and water?

I suggest folks used the basic nutrient salts, they cost next to nothing and are standard and testable. How do you test the Dennerle components?

Plants all use the same thing to grow, if you like paying a lot for cheap ferts in a bottle, it's your wallet.

That was the whole PMDD issue over here, back to late 1980's/90's when Dupla came to market and sold everything they could think of and many felt gouged here. So they added the ferts like KNO3, K2SO4, later KH2PO4, traces had been added for a long time already.

I spend perhaps 20-30$ and I have a lifetime's supply of most ferts.
I know precisely what I add and the form and can test it.

Regards,
Tom Barr

at 20-30$[usd or sin?]per year? i think i probably spend more on test kits

love your comments. most of us here are brand victims-me included, because we are clueless. , that's not gonna change much because those bloody amano stuff are so attractive.[like buying Clinique or SK II!]

deja vu, used to buy branded clothing.[still do, only much much less] wear like protective armour, happy not many others can afford it, so have own style. now, it all boils down to carrying it well, looking healthy. [don't get me started on the vitamin /spirulina supplement thing]

analogy
buy that expensive leather jacket-the tank, cabinet, filter, lighting. it's gonna last you a looong time.
buy basic white tees and socks-the basic ferts, base fert, hose, bubble counter, co2 reactor, co2 tank, chiller/heater, test kits, etc. stuff nobody's gonna see except your lover or maid.
buy a fancy shirt or pants-fish and plant that make you happy...something you change every now and then when you are bored.
doesn't have to be expensive...eg hairgrass and rotala rotundifolia [green] or expensive...eg rare mosses and erioucaulon or downoi...[which sooner or later becomes cheap!]



i think here the the key is information and whatever works for you.
most of us are reactionary, we see a problem[algae] then only react. it's great we very xp ppl to guide us.

[stcyrwm]

Thanks simon, much as i expected.
However, it would be nice to have a way to guarantee minimum algae using a certain system. I am still fighting a losing battle but beginning to understand the process and balance.

Robin

Robin,

"Estimative Index" advocates claim they can clear out virtually all algae problems and they are not selling anything. You can use inexpensive macronutrients, potassium nitrate and mono potassium phosphate, and then buy micronutrient mix from Seachem or equivalent. I have been using this system for a couple months and it has almost completely cleared out my algae problems. I'm still battling a little hair algae in one tank and some green spot on my anubias in the other tank but I think I have the upper hand on the green spot algae.

Bill

Bill

[StanChung]

Robin,
I'm still battling a little hair algae in one tank and some green spot on my anubias in the other tank but I think I have the upper hand on the green spot algae.

Bill

Bill

hi bill,

if you can find amano aka ADA products near you, look for this product called-phyton-git. take the algae spotted plant out and brush some of this stuff on it. will take out the algae witrhout destroying the leaves... just discovered it myself...

[|squee|]

Robin,

"Estimative Index" advocates claim they can clear out virtually all algae problems and they are not selling anything. You can use inexpensive macronutrients, potassium nitrate and mono potassium phosphate, and then buy micronutrient mix from Seachem or equivalent...

Bill

Bill

I vouch for Bill too. It's one of the easiest fertilisation regimes to follow around.

[Plantbrain]

I am not suggestion there is no place for ADA or other brand name products, but if they tell you what's in them, they shoot themselves in the foot.

I know what's in their stuff or can figure it out rather quickly. Some folks prefer or like brand name stuff.

But tank "style" is not a public thing like clothing. It has much less meaning, the main meaning is a nice looking tank without algae.

They charge a fair rate to make money, they sell products that are in LFS's. They help the hobby as well.

More planted tanks is my goal. Lowering cost, solving issues easier, more consistent methods that are universal and testable in the world helps everyone.

There will always be a market for products, many are not interested in getting products and making your own, they are willing to spend the $, follow directions and have decent results.

Everything pre done for them.
ADA and Dennerle seek to fill that need for the market.

I am suggesting folks get the information they need to make the choice and isolate their problems in a very cost effective way.

It's not difficult and more successful, than product lines.
And I tell you why it works without marketing BS and it's dirt cheap.

There will always be folks willing to buy full lines, and from a maintenance perspective, it's much easier to get everything for a set up rather than ordering ferts, tanks, CO2 reg's from several different places.

I can tell anyone using the ferts anywhere on the planet how to fix something and grow something using the cheap stuff.

Plants use the same things to grow.
Don't forget that.

I revamped the EI article some lately. I'll add to it and organize it better later also.

Regards,
Tom Barr

[StanChung]

But tank "style" is not a public thing like clothing. It has much less meaning, the main meaning is a nice looking tank without algae.

More planted tanks is my goal. Lowering cost, solving issues easier, more consistent methods that are universal and testable in the world helps everyone.

There will always be a market for products, many are not interested in getting products and making your own, they are willing to spend the $, follow directions and have decent results.

Everything pre done for them.
ADA and Dennerle seek to fill that need for the market.

I am suggesting folks get the information they need to make the choice and isolate their problems in a very cost effective way.

Plants use the same things to grow.
Don't forget that.


Regards,
Tom Barr

i think like most of the general public, we want it all. cheap, fast and good.
in this case look great, low maintenance, something to be proud of.[my tank is not public but a lot of people come to my house and go ooh wah]

i agree totally where you're coming from with regard to not getting ripped off and would like to save some money to buy something else.

unfortunately most of us are fairly clueless and don't know much.
the big names fill that void.
for me i'd like to try them before i comment. work or don't work.

some considerations for us in this wonderful hobby are, not many of us have the time to look for the macro nutrients you mentioned[i can't even find potasium permanganate in pharmacies to disinfect stuff] let alone the no3's and other macro nutrients you mentioned [in this part of the world anyway],
some of us buy amano malayan soil when we live in malaysia![driving up to the jungle and shoveling riverbed soil is more expensive and nutty if you ask me]

most of us have gone the starbucks way...
we can make our own coffee but we choose to pay ten times more to sip on something in a nice packaging.

however this hobby is way more complicated than making coffee. so with help of experts like you and your generosity in sharing info, some of us will ultimately be making our own coffee [if we have the time!]

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For me the fish come first, plants second. if my downoi disintegrated i would feel 'oh no, what happened?' -try again next time, look for more info etc.
if my prized discus died, i would be depressed for a week. how am i gonna replace them. FYI, my discus knows me, i can touch them. any stranger trying to do the same will make them hide in the bushes!

so my personal considerations...
What will my homebrew do to the fish? is it carcinogenic/toxic to the fish? will they get organ failure etc? things i will never know. i won't even bother. i'm no scientist. only a fairly serious hobbyist. as it is i make my own food for the fish, hatch artemia, successfully bred some fine discus, take care of the sick ones... the list is fairly long.

quite a lot already and the plants are pretty deep end to get into. taking small bites...

the key is how far we all wanna go? jungle or your friendly pet store?
i'd say i'd do the jungle thing [just to see what's it really like-an adventure holiday] but i'd still be a pet store person.


the joy of seeing a beautifully landscaped underwater garden with healthy hungry fishes swarming for food is a mastercard moment...

for most of us it is art, not the science. if it's too hard, it's no longer a hobby, it becomes a chore...

kind regards

stan

[Plantbrain]

Well said.

It's not work, nor difficult.

I add 3 things:
KNO3
KH2PO4
Trace mix

I add them 3x a week, do a 50% weekly water change, the rest is pruning/cleaning the filter/feeding fish.
I make sure there is enough CO2.

That's far from tough or complicated.
Baking soda is a chemical, folks don't worry about adding that for KH.
Chemical names are not suppose to be intimidating, farmers add it without issue.

Learning Dennerle or ADA's system and ordering it etc, takes effort also.
It's not as simple as what I suggest nor as flexible or cheap.

New folks may feel better initially, folks in the know do well without either brand. I still use Flourish or TMG for my traces, but I like them for a specific but subtle reason, many of you may feel the same way about many brands.

There is a good market for Dennerle and ADA, a welcomed one.

If you see products in the LFS, it's a good thing and gets new folks interested in plants, which is everyone's plant goal really.
Regards,
Tom Barr