Healthy fish dying... :(

[grey_fox]

Hi all,

I'm relatively new to this hobby and am dis-heartened for now. It's been about 1 month plus since this hobby.

Lately after my filter change wash. My fishes started dying off, one-by-one.

To elaborate further on what I did for the filter wash/change.

1. Did 30-40% water change.
2. Used aged water to wash filter media (ceramic rings/bio balls & activated carbon), threw away old filter wool (beyond washing capability)

After that, 3 days later, first casualty was a neon tetra, then slowly bit by bit my fishes started dying off.

Total casualties nows are as follows.

12 neon tetras
1 rummy nose (latest victim)
2 hill stream loaches
1 yamato
1 ram
2 oto
2 spotted danios
1 congo tetra

The weird thing is that the fishes are all healthy with no sign of disease. I am wondering if it could be the AC that is causing this? Also how long is the AC's 'expiry'?

Anyone can advise me on what else to do? I'm pretty much demoralised at the moment.

[bclee]

I usually stagger water change/re-scaping and washing filter. I will only do one at one time to prevent disruption to the N-cycle.

Try to use anti-chlorine/chloramine stuff as well.

Maybe now you should do a big water change. If your fishes are gasping, you can add an airstone.

BC

[grey_fox]

Hi BC,

Thanks for your input. None of my fishes are gasping for air though. Just the weird thing that they are dying for no apparent reason... worse thing is that there is no sign of disease

[Johnc]

Hi Grey Fox,

Don't be discouraged. It looks like a case of poisoning, and could indeed be due to the AC spewing out the unwanted chemicals.

I would replace the AC immediately, do a 50% water-change (taking care not to stir up the substrate), and then keep the new AC in one of the canisters for a week (to remove any trace chemical). After the week is up, I'll remove it altogether. If yours is a planted tank you do not need the AC.

Also, 1 month is too soon to wash your canisters (I am assuming that the specs in your signature is correct). I would wash once in 3-6 months depending on my bioload. Your bioload looks very low, and you have two canisters. I think they can go on for 6 months at least.

/John

[grey_fox]

Hey John,

Thanks for the feedback

So what I need to do now is to do a 50% water change and remove the current AC? Yup my tank is a planted tank, so basically when I do the 50% water change I can remove the AC totally and do away with that? However if I do away with that, what can I put to replace it? More filter wool?

[Johnc]

Put a new pack of AC into one of the canisters just for a week... just in case there are still anything poisonous in your water column even after the water change.

The filter trays should be filled thus (from top to bottom):
Tray 1: Bio sponge.
Tray 2: Sintered glass or ceremic rings
Tray 3: Sintered glass or ceremic rings (if you have only 3 trays ignore this)
Tray 4: Bio sponge
Below Tray 4: Sintered glass or ceremic rings.

Try not to use filter wool for canister filter... invest in two slabs of bio sponge. You can buy them from the LFS.

During your water change, keep at least two pails of water that you pump out. (Make sure your pails are clean). You will use these pails of water for ALL washing and for filling your canister.

DO NOT wash your media or fill your canister with tap water. That will kill your BB culture.

Also make sure that you do not leave any of the media out of water for too long or you may have a BB crash. Wash all new media (sponge or ceremic rings with the water you sucked out).

Hope this helps

/John

[grey_fox]

Hi John,

Thanks for the help, I did the following.

1. Siphoned out 1 x LARGE bucket (about 20%) of aged water.
2. Dismantled filter, took out media to do a quick rinse in the aged water.
3. Threw away the AC.
4. Replaced AC with Sintered glass.
5. Filled up the entire canister with the collected aged water.

This is the filter's layout now.

first level is bio sponge
second level is sintered glass
third level is ceramic rings
fourth level is bio balls

Did not have enough sintered glass or ceramic rings to fill the bottom already.

I did not use a single drop of new/tap water at all.

Lastly filled up the tank with tap water. Also, the reason why I did not do a 50% water change was before CNY (29 Jan) I did a 20% water change already (weekly).

Now I guess what I will need to do is monitor.

When I came home (before the change) 1 x rummy nose died + my last neon rainbow + 2 more neon tetras

Damn sian to see my fishes die, I know it would be normal for some to die but at the rate, they're dropping like flies....

*crosses finger and prays that everything will be better now*

[Johnc]

OK, let's wait and see.

Usually for 20% water change, you don't really need to use anti-chlorine / anti-chloromine. But if you still get a lot of deaths, you will want to invest in a bottle (some parts of Singapore, I am told has more problem than in other parts).

Now, if the problem persist, you may also want to rule out contaminated food. Try feeding them with frozen blood worms for a couple of days until things stabilised.

Also... 8xT5 HO is probably too much for your tank. It can be stressful for the fish and can lead to algae bloom. You may want to reduce that to 5 or 6 tubes at the most.

Oh another thing: see if you can take a picture of your fishes alive and dead. Some of us maybe able to give a quick diagnosis.

/John

[grey_fox]

I have anti-chlorine / anti-chloromaine actually just that I have not used it yet.

I've yet to try feeding live foods actually. All along I'm feeding pellet food and I have checked and it has not expired yet.

I am currently using 6 X T5 HO actually, I switched off one of its lamps.

:P I am hoping not to have any more fishes die but in case any should die *touch wood*, I will take a picture of it and post it up here for your analysis and viewing.

Once again, really appreciate the help I've been given. Will update you guys tomorrow.

[PeterGwee]

Duh...go to the LFS that you buy things often to ask for some dirty bio-media (can be foam pad, wool and etc...as dirty as possible) and simply add the media to your filter. Instantly cycled tank and better than any bottled form of bacteria since its alive! (Make sure it is not dried up!..add some tank water with it.). Growing the plants well will take care of the remaining NH3 issues.

You do CO2 24/7?

Regards
Peter Gwee

[grey_fox]

Hi Peter.

Currently my plants are growing very well. Very little dead leaves, stems, etc. I suspect it was the AC as that media was old and passed down to me from a friend of mine.

I started adding fish bit-by-bit after running the tank for 2 weeks odd. However after 1 month and the change of the filter, I started running into this problem.

I will take note and get the LFS to provide me dirty media in future.

Currently I do not do CO2 24/7 at all. I always turn it off when I switch off the lights after 10 hours.

[PeterGwee]

Just get some dirty bio-media and you can rule out the NH3 issue with the critters. Other than that, its either chloramine/CO2 overdose that can do that. Adding a good chloramine remover like Seachem Prime will rule it out. For the CO2 part, do you have some good surface movement to go along with it? Do you rapid movement of gills or mouth from the fish especially towards the end of the photoperiod?

The AC shouldn't be a real problem if its clean before returning to service. It becomes a bio-media of some sort after a while.

Regards
Peter Gwee

[michael lai]

Hi grey Fox,
Sorry to hear about the fishes, maybe you would like to try out this product which I'm currently trying out. It's a brand call Fritz. It neutralizes chlorine and other undesirable heavy metals which could be harmful to your fishes. I recently did some major 'rearrangement' to some of my tanks. The method I'm using is to add the Fritz product during addition of new water after which I add Nutrafin water conditioner which speeds up good bacterial colonisation, on the following day, continuos for about a week. I have not suffered any major setback so far( touch wood ) maybe this will help.

[jacquetlc]

Hi all, am new to this hobby too... about half a year. frozen blood worms? tried to feed them to my fish but the next morning/day, they'll drop dead one by one... otherwise, they'll have pop out eyes and bloated stomach. i bought the japan frozen cube ones... looks fat and delicious! but... they cause death to my fish!!! argh...

[grey_fox]

Hi michael,

Thanks for your consolation. Appreciate it.

This Fritz, is it easily available at LFS? Also would you happen to have a picture of the bottle?

So basically you add Fritz on a daily basis, after a water change + Nutrafin cycle?

[grey_fox]

Hi all, am new to this hobby too... about half a year. frozen blood worms? tried to feed them to my fish but the next morning/day, they'll drop dead one by one... otherwise, they'll have pop out eyes and bloated stomach. i bought the japan frozen cube ones... looks fat and delicious! but... they cause death to my fish!!! argh...

So sorry to hear about your loss as well. Previously what were you feeding them?

Bloated stomach = dropsy?
pop out eyes = eye parasites?

[michael lai]

Hi Grey Fox,
Yes, it quite readily available at most LFS. It's called Fritz(brand)Guard. It detoxifies heavy metals such as lead. Allow me to explain a little more on what I've said yesterday. Its something like a crash course to get the aquarium's biological system kick started. Fritz Guard is added only on the first day when new water is being used so as to remove any undesirable chemicals like chlorine, chloramine or heavy metals. The Nutrafin conditioner is to kick start the beneficial bacterial colonies in the water and filter, which will convert ammonia to nitrate to nitrite. This is added on a daily basis for about a week or so. Prior to this, I must stress the need for a efficient filter. Preferably a external cannister like Ehiem( with substrate pro as filter media or sintered glass ) for this 'crash course' to be truly effective...
From my personal experience, the cut in time for the beneficial bacterial to colonise is about 2 weeks. There about another 2-4 weeks for the colony to stabilise and 'Voila'. This balance must then be preserve, water change 25% weekly or fortnightly. Never 100% as it will kill everything that you try so hard for. Hope the info helps. Enjoy....

[grey_fox]

Hey Michael,

Glad to let you guys know that after the removal of the AC, no more casualties anymore Still will monitor the progress and conditions.

Anyways, after the removal of the AC, my male ram and 1 more neon died, after which no more deaths were recorded.

Couldn't take a picture as my dad was the one who removed the dead bodies and threw them away when I was at work.

I've been trying to find this Nutrafin bacteria at my LFS(s) but none carried it... Just ordered 1 x bottle from my LFS, the owner informed that she will help bring 1 bottle for me.

[PeterGwee]

Why would you want some dormant bacteria when you can just ask for some live ones from your LFS owner or maybe buy if they don't give for free?

Regards
Peter Gwee

[diki]

Hi all, am new to this hobby too... about half a year. frozen blood worms? tried to feed them to my fish but the next morning/day, they'll drop dead one by one... otherwise, they'll have pop out eyes and bloated stomach. i bought the japan frozen cube ones... looks fat and delicious! but... they cause death to my fish!!! argh...

Oh dear, how can that happen? Usually I defrost the blood worms in a small cup and then scoup the blood worms into my tank to feed the fishes. I do not usually put in the whole cube into the water. Since I have read before not good for fishes (too cold the food?!?) and also dirty the water easier.