Discus queries

[kalindab]

hi
I know I have posted in the wrong place my bad
I was wondering if anybody has any information on discus. My hubby likes this type of fish and we do not seem to be able to find any pertinent information i.e.
1)do they live communal
2)ph and temp requirments
3)nutrional requirments
4) tank prefrence i.e planted gravel ect
5)breeding
6)any specific thing when purchasing

thankyou for any information you may be able to give
kalinda &co

[celticfish]

mods you may want to move to cichilids sections.

1) generally, yes. certain times they are not. one, at juvenile age they stay together but get fiesty and do fight a bit. nothing lethal just establishing the pecking order. two, when they pair up to breed they will move away from the group. in the wild its still within the area of the colony.

2) wild fish from 4 to 6+PH, domestic strains can be kept higher. but i would recommend 7 PH max. at higher PH ammonia can become toxic easily. temperature 28 to 30 C. some planted tank keepers have acclimatized their discus to 26.5C. i pump the temperature up to 34 C when they fall sick. three days and bring down the temperature slowly.

3) they need a lot of protien in their diet. tetrabits with bloodworms is a good combo for the time challenged keepers. diet also depends on the basic setup you want for your fish.

4) ideal? bare tank. some with potted plants and the ultimate is a full planted setup. you have to watch the food you feed though. i reccommend getting full grown fish for planted setup. why? because it will save you heart ache when you have to choose between pumping your fish to full size and balancing the plants well being (actually its more algae prevention as your fertilization regime can go out of whack when you feed more and have left over food rotting).

5) breeding is quite easy when you take care of their water requirements - soft water. leave the fry with the parents to reduce your own time to care for them. they can be kept with them for up to a month. you might want to watch it at the third week. the little fellas can get vivious and tear the parents skin. thus affecting the ability to produce slime and consequently support smaller batches for a shorter duration.

6) get only those that are "bright eyed" and come forward to the tank glass when you look. fins should be fully opened and not always clamped. aviod dark looking (eyes too) discus.

btw check this australian forum for discus - http://www.discusforums.com/forum/

enough information?

[celticfish]

no enough? here's more!!


http://animal-world.com/encyclo/fres...lid/discus.php

http://www.tinkerfish.com/discus/dis.../07/index.html

http://www.aquariumfish.com/aquarium...d=3780&search=

http://aquariumhobbyist.com/discus/strains/index.html

http://www.discusnada.org/discus/history.html

http://www.wetwebmedia.com/FWSubWebIndex/discusfish.htm

why you should shun domestic bred discus
http://www.aquaworldnet.com/awmag/wilden.htm#u.meinert

how beautiful wild discus can be
http://www.amazon-exotic-import.de/G...4nge/INDEX.htm

more
http://www.freshwaterstingray.com/discus.html

lots more articles here
http://article.dphnet.com/

[Justikanz]

Well, Celtic covers basically all... But I still like to differ on certain areas...

1) Communal, yes. Discus can be kept with other fish. But do note that they are cichlids, afterall. So, they will hunt down and eat their smaller tank mates. Small discus are best not kept together with medium or bigger sized ones. Yes, legend has it that the hormones released by the biggest (most domiant) discus will inhibit the growth of the smaller ones. I have old discus that stay small because of it...

Oh, try not to keep angels with discus... Not because of the angel parasite that might be passed on to discus (that happens with wild angels), but if the angels breed, they will get agressive... Not good for your discus... I lost my discus because my breeding angels harrassed them too much...

2) Try to obtain tank bred discus. They can tolerate higher pHs and harder waters. However, try not to go beyond pH7 for discus, they are, afterall, amazon fishes built for soft acidic waters. Also, ammonia, which these fish are more sensitive to, is more deadly in pH higher than 7.0.

3) I would also recommend tetra bits. Bloodworms will also be well loved. Try and explore with different foods, but try to avoid teh popular beefheart... They are fatty and is of the wrong protein... Like the reason why marine fish keepers would say no to feeder goldfish and prefer feeder mollies.

4) Ah... This one I certainly think is personal... Unless you are breeding them, I would not recommend a bare glass tank... That would be extrememly stressful for the fish if they are kept inside there always. I prefer a planted tank and the discus will do well in a planted tank. Just take note of the water temperature. Try to keep it no lower than 26,7 celcius...

5) IMO, tank bred discus breed rather easily, once the water is kept soft and acidic (most planted tanks are)...

6) Avoid discus with the stomach area concaving in... Sick discus don't eat and is difficult to pull through and survive... Also avoid discus that are blackish and hiding...



And I hope you are not keeping them (if you get them) with your red devil-might-be-oscar-might-be-frontosa fish you are having now...

[kalindab]

hi
thankyou for the information you have been a great help. Also to alleviate your mind nothing would live with barney (the i have no idea what you are fish but i soo love you)or for that matter the very nasty piece of work red devil elmo. They are both now the proud owner occupiers of their own 3ft tanks which I am thankfull to say is of a much thicker glass as they both like to spit rocks

[kalindab]

I have just purchased a new tank. It is extremly pretty tank with angeled front glass also over normal height and was considering a community of cichlids.
I am just debating on what types. The discus I have seen in the lfs are very regal looking. So I have done a web search to see what their requirments might be and was taken aback. Most sites I visited recommended a 50% water change daily
As I now have seven soon to be nine tanks of diffrent fish (and some life if not much other than keeping fish) This seems way out of my ability and time available scheme.
Seriuosly if discus need this much attention I think I might buy goldfish
I would like time to at least watch my fishie friends

[celticfish]

you won't be far off for water change with goldfish.
the water change regime is for growing fish. once they are adults you won't have this issue.
the idea for such water change is to remove waste so the fish 'will grow faster.
if you have adult fish, no problem.
if don't need them to be super-sized, no problem.

btw i have adolescent discus and do 50% weekly now.

[kalindab]

ok
have you ever tried keeping discus with other fishies cichlids I mean was thinking electric blues and convicts?

[celticfish]

those may be better with your red devils...
btw these fishes also do a lot of digging.
not good for planted setup.

if you are looking at a planted setup, i'd suggest a small schooling fish species or two, depending on your tank size.
the discus are large fishes so a little contrast in size should do well.

[Justikanz]

I would also not recommend convicts or the 'electric blues' (whatever they are, they sound nasty) with discus...

Oh, try to identify the fish you have. Borrow a book from a library or refer to websites such as http://www.aquahobby.com/e_gallery.php

Common names are practically useless for identification purposes...

[kalindab]

actually electic blue refers to the colour rather than the temperment. By smaller fish do you mean tetras danios ect I dont wish to purchase expensive fish food for my soon to be new discus

[Justikanz]

I know... I just got a hunch the blues would have a bad temperament too...

Discus would do good with tetras with broad bodies. Try the black skirt tetras, diamond tetras, serpae tetras, bleeding hearts and their cousins... Try to avoid the slim bodied ones like neons, cardinals etc to avoid them being expensive fish food...

[celticfish]

discus are not as fast or aggressive as angel fish, and have a better tolerance level for small fish.
as long as they are larger than their mouth, no problem.
if the cardinals are adult size, no problem too.

larger tank size also give the smaller fish better survival rates.
if you cram them in a two footer then the small guys are gonna get it!

or if you have them young with the small fish they get use to them and don't think of them as food.
i remember someone putting yamatos with juvenile discus and they got along well into the discus'adulthood.

[Justikanz]

Oh, my discus were munching on my neons for breakfast as they wake up later than my discus...

But, I think it is true that discus would have less tendency to attack the fish they grow up with... But it is better not to... Remember, fish is not as cheap here in Australia...