Help needed, shrimps wipe out when i intro new plants

[NDC]

Hi,

Yesterday after i introduced a pot of crypt and some clover look alike plant into my tank. All was well.
But this morning i discover that almost 60% of my shrimps were dead(low grade CRS, green and malayan mixed and cherries). But my mosquitoe and spotted rasbora seems fine.
I did a 50% water change immediately, will it help?
Do i have to take the new plants out?
Will the remaining shrimps survive?
Very sad and feeling down after this disaster. My shrimp population has just started to thrive.

Please help.

Cheers,
Andy

[vinz]

Shrimps and newly planted Cryptocoryne or damaged, dying or dead Cryptocoryne do not go together. Cryptocoryne seems to be the common denominator for the "introduce new plant, mass shrimp die off" syndrome.

Cryptocoryne sap (I suppose it can be called sap) is toxic. Take a Cryptocoryne leaf crush it and rub it on the sensitive skin on the inside of your fore arm. Chances are you'll get a rash and itching within half an hour. Washing with water usually stops it.

I can't really tell you how to save your remaining shrimp, but in my experience, usually those who survive the first day or two will survive. A water change will help. Personally, I'll leave the plants there.

I'm going to take a leap and say never introduce new Cryptocoryne to a tank with shrimps.

[Quixotic]

With all due respect, I don't quite agree to just say Crypts will cause deaths. It is quite possible but in all probability, there could just be something that we aren't doing right.

HC is quite a common denominator as well. ADA aquasoil too.

Anyway, posted my thoughts on Crypts and shrimps on an much earlier thread before. Here it is, post #9,
http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...ghlight=shrimp

[PeterGwee]

Andy, do you have any moderate surface movement going in that tank all day and night long or is it a still surface? It is always wise to do large water changes after planting or whenever you disturb the substrate since it's a highly reductive environment and O2 demand will increase when disturbed.

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[NDC]

Thanks Vinz for your reply. Really appreciate your help will remember your advise dearly.

No offence to you Quixotic, really appreciate your help on this issue too. But i try the clover like plant in another tank just now and nothing happens to the tank mates inside.

So does that mean that i can only pray and hope that they will survive??
I think i am going to give the crypt away or throw it away, they contain sad memories...

[NDC]

It is a still surface Peter, no disturbance the whole day.

But a word of advise for all in AQ from a source from one of the plant farm in Singapore, he told me that plants from Malaysia must be dealt with carefully. He told me that plants from Malaysia are grown with alot of pesticide unlike local plant farm. His boss ever suffer a huge loss when the plants he exported to somewhere else from Malaysia got rejected because everything time those plants hit the tank, all the fishes inside died! And when they traced the problem, it was because of the amount of pesticide on the plants.

[PeterGwee]

Andy, from what you have said, my guess is that your O2 drop way below limits of comfort for your shrimps or the NH3 got to them. The NH3 and low O2 is what tends to kill shrimps fast. Your shrimps did not die instantly once you put the crypt in and that indicates nothing toxic is on that plant. Have some surface movement on any planted tank you have to support some gas exchange so that the O2 never goes down below the safe level for fish or shrimps. (moderate movement such that a flake food moves around rapidly but no splashing.). Some CO2 loss with the surface movement is acceptable since CO2 is cheap.

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[NDC]

Hi Peter,

Thank you for the advise, but how come it only happens with the crypts?
Not doubting your expertise, but when i did a more major replanting recently. Nothing happens except now when crypt is introduced? Feel so hopeless..

[PeterGwee]

I'm not ruling that out but there might be other potential causes to rule out as well. Crypts tend to rot in a new environment and rotting stuff means more O2 drain on the system. If the plants are doing very well and producing loads of O2 during the day, it might just tide over the night with no issue even with little or no surface movement. That is not always the case since we might forget to dose or get lazy and that slows plant growth down which in turn means less O2. Having moderate surface movement means less dependent on the plant health to support the tank's O2 level.

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[vinz]

NDC, the clover like plant is probably Marsilea.

I think we can't really conclude anything unless someone conducts some experiments.

[PeterGwee]

Perharps you can do it on a small test tank with fresh crypt from LFS and grind it using a food grinder and add it to the tank with ghost shrimps. The tank needs an established filter and good aeration to rule other out other possible causes. Anyone willing?

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[NDC]

Oh yah... The uncle who sold me the crypts told me they will rot first but not to worry as they will grow again.

As for the experiment, i do not think i am capable of doing it. Just do not want to kill my interest when i just started. hahaha .

[|squee|]

Crypts almost always rot when introduced. They will grow back with a vengeance in good conditions.

BTW, I deleted your crypt post, because rules are rules after all. It's up to the senior mods to decide if your post can be moved to the Marketplace (Esp if you're giving FOC).

[NDC]

Good Morning!

Hi Squee, sorry for the wrong posting. Not trying to test the system, just wanted to give that plant a new home to those who likes it. Don't want to see it die away. So sorry again

Thanks again for all the help

yesterday evening i change about 20% water again. The remaining shrimps look kind of ok, but once a while i see some struggling to swim upright but keeps flipping over. Sad to see them in this scenerio.. Let's hope everything goes back to normal today and i can intro some more cherries, bees etc into my tank

[vinz]

...

BTW, I deleted your crypt post, because rules are rules after all. It's up to the senior mods to decide if your post can be moved to the Marketplace (Esp if you're giving FOC).

Undeleted and moved. NDC reached his 10th post not long after.

[NDC]

Thank you vinz

[eddyq]

I prefer to switch on an air pump at night to provide O2 for shrimp tank. As Peter mentioned, at night NH3 used up O2 when plants are not doing well.

[NDC]

Thanks eddyq,

Will try to on air pump at night from now on. But now my shrimps are like dying at a rate of 1 to 2 shrimps a day. Although recovering, but still sad as do not know what is happening to caused this. They look fine, they still wander around looking for food slowly.

Cheers,
Andy

[freezze]

sometime when intro new plants , shrimp will be affect due to the fertilizer thy used at the place u bought it.. therefore it best to leave the newly bought plant in a pail for a day to drain out the excessive chemical..

[skysky]

wow... i just went to gallery to search for the plant call "Cryptocoryne"...oh my there are so many different types..so which is the one you guys refering to?