ADA Powersand

[sonique]

Anyone using this substrate fert??

The price is relatively high, so is it a good investment..??
How good is this Powersand or Powersand Super compared to Dennerle or JBJ base/substrate fert..??

[AquaObsession]

I did use that before.

[sevo88]

I use Powersand Special (Powersand with more nutrients and nitrobacteria). But I regret this very much. Not just the cost. But because whenever I uproot any plants, the pumice gravel will also be pulled to the surface. The white and larger pumice gravel become eyesores as they contrast with the dark Vulcanite gravel. I know some people put stainless steel mesh between the gravel and the PowerSand to prevent this from happening.

I do not have any proof. But I doubt the benefits of PowerSand in providing nutrients. Basically, it is just pumice coated with peat. Use ADA Aquasoil by all means. Most people have very good results.

[AquaObsession]

JBL base fert with lapis sand is still good IMHO.
PS and aquasoil is better, but more expensive.
Aquasoil alone is also very good.

Now I am using only lapis sand alone, will supplement with iron balls if needed or some root fert.

[StanChung]

I use Powersand Special (Powersand with more nutrients and nitrobacteria). But I regret this very much. Not just the cost. But because whenever I uproot any plants, the pumice gravel will also be pulled to the surface. The white and larger pumice gravel become eyesores as they contrast with the dark Vulcanite gravel. I know some people put stainless steel mesh between the gravel and the PowerSand to prevent this from happening.

I do not have any proof. But I doubt the benefits of PowerSand in providing nutrients. Basically, it is just pumice coated with peat. Use ADA Aquasoil by all means. Most people have very good results.

I can relate to the pumice getting uprooted. Hate that.

However some swear by Powersand it as they showed their tank with crypt roots practically glued to the aquarium bottom.

IMHO, use it if you're going for the long term 1 yr plus esp crypt type setups, but just be aware of the pop corn effect when you uproot!

Don't go for it if you're tearing down tanks every 3-6 months.

[Jungle-mania]

I use biogravel with great success. Cheap and effective. IMHO, you cannot avoid planting slow releasing nutrient tablets like root monster and iron tablets, if you want less complications.

[cookie]

I used powersand w aquasoil for my 2ft. I use it because it was a small tank so wallet still can sustain.

In the past, I tried using other base fert but could not grow HC. But now, it is growing like mad.

[sevo88]

I used powersand w aquasoil for my 2ft. I use it because it was a small tank so wallet still can sustain.

In the past, I tried using other base fert but could not grow HC. But now, it is growing like mad.

Just out of interest. The time that you failed to grow HC, did you use aquasoil or other substrate? I am really interested in people who use Aquasoil as substrate to see if they think PowerSand makes any difference.

Thanks

[sevo88]

IMHO, use it if you're going for the long term 1 yr plus esp crypt type setups, but just be aware of the pop corn effect when you uproot!

Don't go for it if you're tearing down tanks every 3-6 months.

People who use Aquasoil with PowerSand also have problems with uprooting the ugly pumice to the surface. But they have to replace the substrate 1-2 years anyway. They throw everything away.
Don't go for PowerSand if you use dark color gravels (eg Fluorite or Vulcanite) which in theory should last for ever and not give the pain of replacement every 1-2 years.

[cookie]

Just out of interest. The time that you failed to grow HC, did you use aquasoil or other substrate? I am really interested in people who use Aquasoil as substrate to see if they think PowerSand makes any difference.

Thanks

FYI, I was using dennerle crystal quartz the last time I failed in the HC.

[puffer07]

Try Dennerle Crystal quartz gravel with Deponit. My friend's tank already 4yrs, still doing great.

[wasabi8888]

I am using denn gravel with deponit.. trying HC now.. not sure whether it will grow like mad...

[Plantbrain]

Just out of interest. The time that you failed to grow HC, did you use aquasoil or other substrate? I am really interested in people who use Aquasoil as substrate to see if they think PowerSand makes any difference.

Thanks

Exactly, you need to have a fair test to show that it's definitely the powersand and not just the ADA aqua soil.

Flourite is a better than plain sand, I know, I've seen the long term effects on multiple systems/sets and plant species vs plain 2-3 mm sand(w and w/o various amendments), something many newer folks have never even used
Likewise, flourite vs ADA AS is another step towards better growth.
Better= faster growth rates, something some may certainly not desire.

I fine it very interesting many folks do not try ADA AS alone, without the powersand.

Yet they then attribute their success to the combination of both.
Or is it due to the ADA AS alone?

They cannot say, so my question, is why do they persist in saying so and "it's part of the system"?

I could not say one way or the other either, so....... I tried it and found no difference in growth rates.

Initial high levels of NH4 and other issues told me right away I did not need more nutrients and certainly not in the substrate, the ADA AS is loaded.

Next I tried to see what influence water column ferts had on the set up with ADA AS and ADA AS + PS.
Again, no difference.

When I applied EI vs the ADA system, I had predictably higher growth rates with EI.


With Plain sand+EI I had less growth for some species, with Flouite+EI less species had slower growth rates than with ADA AS + EI, that had the highest growth rates of the various 3 combinations.
ADA PS had no influence on growth rates : EI + ADA AS versus EI+ ADA AS+ ADA PS.

Now if you maintain a limited water column and add nothing but ADA aqua soil vs ADA AS+ PS, then of course you will have more growth with PS.
There are more total nutrients. But that's due to the variation in the water column, not some inherent miracle that is "powersand".

When the total nutrients are added via the water column, we no longer see any differences in growth. Root growth and shoot growth of some larger forming root systems is not suggestive either of "preference". It can simply mean you have limiting conditions in the water column, so the plant allocates more resources to the sediment to try and get enough nutrients to make it, personally I like leaves, not a bunch of roots in my tank.
Roots are cute, but they are not what we like to see in our tanks.

Likewise, if you add ADA AS, which has macro nutrients in it, and compare it to flourite which does not have macronutrients, you are not comparing them on equal terms.
Anyone could predict better growth based on this single difference.
This becomes even more clear if you do not provide non limiting water column nutrients as well.

Adding Osmocoat vs PS to the ADA AS should produce similar effects based solely on nutrients, PS possesses osmocoat like material in it.
Adding some peat+osmocote ought to do the trick vs using ADA PS.

Osmocoat:
Osmocote® Azalea, Camellia, Rhododendron Smart Release® Plant Food

Soil and peat have long been used, so has kitter litter(a nice clay).
All quite successfully, but is it due to the substrate, or the water column, or both?

This can be traced to variations in the water column nutrient supplies, so a standard measure of water column ferts should be applied to standarize the effects of various substrates on plant growth.

This is painfully obvious but many aquarist chose to ignore this for some reason, I'm not sure why.

All these same consitutients are used in ADA AS(Clay/Soil/peat).
PS has what? Peat, osmocoat like material, and pumice, maybe some general terrestrial ferts soaked on the pumice, but that's about it.
If the longer term nutrient source in the sediment is really your goal, then simply adding osmocote to the base layer ougght take care of things, something that will eventually dissolve and not mix in the substrate ADA AS and look all tacky or when you redo a tank after uprooting etc.

Knowing this, gives you a good base line to make predictions, understand the source of various nutrients and account for differences in growth using various substrates and water column fert routines.
Osmocote is easy to add later if you are really into substrate fertilization over time.

A little research got folks away from using all Dupla stuff and developed PMDD and other advances in the hobby. If you believe something, try and prove it wrong. Otherwise most folks would still be buying heating cables/PO4 remover.


Regards,
Tom Barr

[StanChung]

I think I like more roots for the simple reason I get better anchor to the substrate.
I like to keep the water column lean. It's because I have hungry hair algae waiting to bloom into dark green tufts as soon as I try anything ala EI. It's stuck in between the roots of the fern and there's nothing i can do to clear it short of throwing it away.
That said, I do not use powersand as per manufacturer's recommendation but AS+iron inserts.
Is there a good hair algae remedy?

[brianclaw]

Is there a good hair algae remedy?

Hahah... Yes, Yamato shrimp . Seriously though, getting your ferts and CO2 right and combining that with Yamatos are a sure way of getting rid of Hair algae.

[Plantbrain]

I think I like more roots for the simple reason I get better anchor to the substrate.
I like to keep the water column lean. It's because I have hungry hair algae waiting to bloom into dark green tufts as soon as I try anything ala EI. It's stuck in between the roots of the fern and there's nothing i can do to clear it short of throwing it away.
That said, I do not use powersand as per manufacturer's recommendation but AS+iron inserts.
Is there a good hair algae remedy?

Yes, but it has nothing to do with keeping the water column lean..........
Nor as you have seen, will ADA products save you or anyone from algae.
I have very high water column ferts in some tanks, I have no algae issues.
Some roots are fine, but more is not better, more leaves means the plant can produce more sugar which means it has less draining it from growth, roots if you are not aware, do not help the plant photosynthesize, they function in growth only as a method to take up nutrients, just like all leaves do.
A plants with a lower root/shoot ratio is preferable, I'm not talkign about no roots of unhealthy roots, just not so much and not so intensive.

This can make more of mess when you do uproot, so making sure there's enough in the water column helps.

So it cannot be due solely to that treatment(lean water column).
Do you think that little alga that's pestering you is limited?
I can assure you it's not limiting it's growth in your tank.
No one has ever shown in the hobby that you can truly limit the algae and growth the plants well.
There's just too much transfer of nutrients from the substrate by the plants and along the undisturbed boundary layer on the gravel.
Few have ever even considered measuring the pore water in the top 1cm of their gravel, all algae growing on the bottom have access to those nutrients also.

I've always found a very strong correlation with mild CO2 deficiency/lack of dosing with Caldophora.

Often I will leave for a week and there's typically some waiting for me when I get back, I mow it out, then water change, add ferts and it does not become an issue.

This is another thread, the topica is ADA As and PS and their effects on plant growth, not algae management

If you have algae issues, you likely are not a good candidate to do testing, you need to induce the algae and be able to get rid of it.
Then repeat. Lacking such control, means there are many issues that could be causing the problem.

So it's not likely it's the lean water column, rather a wide range of parameters that may or may not be in good shape, if you have algae to begin with and still now..then you have parameter issues either way.

If your tank was pristine and growing well, then you upped the Water column ferts, then saw algae, and made sure the addition was balanced, CO2 was good etc, then you'd have a lot more reason to suspect water column leaness to be a cause vs another set of conditions.


Think about this.
Ask yourself why don't I or other folks have algae issues with rich water column nutrients, it's not because I or others are better than anyone, or can walk on water, I'm not any different than most folks growing plants. I tell folks the same stuff I do and what works and what I see.

Regards,
Tom Barr