ADA style stand and frameless tank

[ankank]

Where to begin. With the empty tank ofcourse

It looks very nice. The clear silicon really pays off.

Then the cork under the tank. Yup cork (the same stuff used in bulletin boards) 4~5mm thick. I tried looking for mats like the ADA mat and couldn't find it.

Cork should work fine. The main purpose of the mat is to distribute pressure from the water content and dampen vibration which could otherwise lead to microfractures. A foam mat would be better because it also eliminates the pressure grain particles (like sand) on the mat put on the bottom wall, but I guess cork will work, too. (Hint: Over here, people sometimes go with camping equipment sleeping mats. Figure. )

Bubbles in the silicon at the bottom side of the tanks. Unsightly, a little, but only when up really close and looking at the bottom side coner. The tank maker assured me this isn't a problem. Is it?

I can't imagine so. But it shows lack of craftmanship. Blame the tank maker.

All in all it turned out really really fine.

[tcampbell]

yeah, it was the tank maker. Oh well. The price wasn't really that bad. Total cost was 65 dollars for the tank in 10mm glass. Guess if I would have spend the 110dollars the other tank maker wanted I would have had a better tank (he has perfect seams and great silicon work, I just though this guy did too after seeing some of his tanks), though at a higher price. Maybe next time.. You get what you pay for.

I agree the clear silicon is much nicer. If I was going for a canopy and a stand the has a border around the tank I would probably get the black silicon. Or if a marine tank as it enclosed the tank and makes it like a picture frame, though the whole idea of this one was to be opened up!

[tcampbell]

Well the soil I am using is called Soil Pro Professional Grade Substrate. It is a Taiwan based company producing it, and should be on the market in the next couple of months. It is fantastic to use so far. "Soil Pro can buffer and maintain the PH at 6.8, providing a slightly acidic environment preferred by plants." is one of the quotes from the packaging.

Nice color and soft but firm texture. Soft enough it won't scratch glass, but firm enough it will hold together. Said to last well and maintain shape, not turning to powder.


Grain size is good and goes not look strange in tank, and is not uniform round balls like one brand, which looks very strange.


The slope

and the final result


Now the water test. Will it cloud the water like ADA? I hate adding water slowly and usually just dump it in by buckets. ADA I can't do that unless I want to spend a couple of days with a clouded tank and plants covered with a black/brown film of dust.
So how did it do?
Water in place

The greenish color is from the glass and the room lighting.

This picture was taken 10 seconds after I stirred the water and soil around with my hand. No cloudiness at all!! Nothing. Just clear water!! Fantastic!

Now this coming week will be the real test of the soil. Once it is planted and the plants start to grow.

Right now I am just running the tank and filter for a few day with just the soil to get things a little established in the filter and the soil to adjust and balance the PH of the water before I add plants. Some people suggest doing this with ADA as it realeases a lot of excessive nutrients at first and the PH is not stable for a few days. I will do it with this soil as well, doing 50% water changes every day for the first 3 days then begin planting.

Chosing the layout and the plants will be the hardest part now!! so many styles I love and only one tank to plant!!

[BFG]

The cork mat material you are using absorb water if I'm not wrong so better be careful with water dripping out of the tank. Bubble in silicone are not a good thing for a tank. It is bad because the silicone has a lesser area gripping on to the glass than a silicone without bubble does. I did not logged in for the past few days but when I saw the size of the air bubbles, it does concern me to inform you of this.

If you have a chance to customise another tank in the future, use foam underneath the tank and get a good tankmaker who will guarantee his work.

[tcampbell]

BFG - I guess I could always drain everything, remove the soil and put the foam underneath instead. That would tank time, but you are probably right that it would be better.

I agree that the bubbles in the tank silicon are not a good thing. The tank maker has guaranted to fix it if there is any problems, so that is a good thing. But the downside is if there is a problem it will probably be a big one.

Funny thing about the bubbles. THey are only on the bottom of the tank and only the first 2 inches near the corners, no where else, He claimed it was due to the movement of the glass and the use of a germany brand of silicon which is very good, and is not a problem since it is 10mm glass (over kill of a 60cm tank (110l / 29gallon)) Most of the bubbles are very fine 1mm bubbles and very few except the picture I posted which is one back side corner with a 3 inch span with all those bubbles.

[Aeon]

Really nice. Clear silicon makes me regret getting black for my 4ft tank.

[tcampbell]

Aeon - yeah, I understand. I feel the black looks great when it is empty and in the shop, but when you take it home it feels "boxed in" Only think I think useful thouhg is if black background, black stand and black silicon makes it book like the fishtank is a picture (which is rather cool) but clear silicon on an ada style stand makes it look like it is a floating world.

[tcampbell]

Ran a test today on the tank:

Ph 7.2
Ammonia (NH3/NH4+) = 0.5 mg/l
Nitrates: NO3- = 0.0 mg/l, NO2- = 0.0 ppm
Phosphate PO4 3- = 0.25mg/l
Kh = 3 degrees
Gh = 6 degrees

First time I ever used test kits on a tank so it it interesting to watch how it goes.

Plants quickly about 50% of tank and a piece of driftwood, no layout yet so no pictures. Just wanted to get something in the tank to go with the soil and help establish it as I was using everything new.

What I am considering now is how I will fertilize this tank. Just over the counter premixed stuff common in Taiwan as with a 110L tank the cost won't be that high. Follow the PPS-Pro method or EI Method.

EI for my tank would be:


KH2P04

20-40 Gallon Aquariums
+/- ¼ tsp KN03 3x a week Potassium Nitrate
+/- 1/16 tsp KH2P04 3x a week Monopotassium Phosphate
+/- 1/16 tsp (5ml) Trace Elements 3x a week Plantex CSM+B
50% weekly water change

(all time 1.5 for my 29 gallon tank as the info is for a 20 gallon tank and you double it for a 40gallon) though if I assume I am running a little lean on the light (I will have less then 3 watts per gallon), then I would start of with the above information and adjust it as growth inproves.

EI target ranges
CO2 range 25-30 ppm - Hardest to maintain with temperature raise
NO3 range 5-30 ppm
K+ range 10-30 ppm
PO4 range 1.0-2.0 ppm
Fe 0.2-0.5ppm or higher
GH range 3-5 degrees ~ 50ppm or higher
KH range 3-5

PPS-Pro is very simple

Need to dose 1 ml / 10 gallon daily before lights come on so I would need to dose approx 3ml daily

That would mean a 90ml bottle of solution would last me one month!!!
And to make that all I need is:
KN03 = 6g = have it
KH2P04 = 1g = have it
MgSo4 = 4g need to get it
K2SO4 = 5g need to get it
TE = 7grams

according to this Introducing the PPS-Pro Solutions Recipe http://ca.geocities.com/[email protected]

That sounds easy, cheap and not a lot of work, and uses a lot less chemicals then EI.

Great article on the changes in dosing methods and it makes sense to me:
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...c-pps-pro.html

[Aeon]

Hi tcampbel. I bought the same flo pipes from Aqmagic but they are small and does not fit into canister filter pipes. How did you set up yours?

[tcampbell]

I am running them on an eheim 2215. They connect perfectly to the pipes. I have conected them to the Tetra 120 with an adaptor and smaller hose as well to test them out.
Then I went out and bought some clear hose from a local hardware store. Not fish specs but works and although it is a little bigger then the Eheim 2215 hoses it fits fine as well.


what filter are you using?
They claim to have a larger version coming out soon but I am not sure.

[Aeon]

I'm using an Atman CF1000. The hoses are pretty large. I think I'll get an adapter and clear hoses as well.

[oblivion]

might be a little OT here but seems like the Flo pipes only come in 1 size?
i checked out the webbie and seems that way
and based on the measurements inn your pics of the pipe sizes, i gather they need at least a 1.5-2 footer

was considering getting a couple sets for my 1-footers but they are like kinda abit too big

[tcampbell]

Yes currently they only come in one lenght and in one pipe side. 12/16. My tank is 61X40X45cm high (so a 2 foot with extra width and heigth) so they fit fine with mine. I don't think they would look good on a 1 foot tank. The return might be fine, but the intake wouldn't. Once you add 1~3 " or soil to the tank and keeping the intake slightly off the soil, you would have it raised 3~4 inches up from the rim of the tank and the first suction cup starts just 2" below the curve so it wouldn't work.

[oblivion]

aww shucks
guess i have to look around for alternatives
was hoping they have suitably sized sets
very reasonably priced since they cost for 1 set only slightly more than half of what a single piece of ada would cost


i'm not generous enough with my wallet to spend that much on an ada set for 1 footers
besides, if i did, my domestic finance minister will have my head (or demand a diamond ring that will make the ada cost seem almost negligible in comparison)

[Aeon]

LOL @ domestic finance minister.

[tcampbell]

I have the same problem, thus the cheaper pipes! I just tell her half what I pay for the tanks!!

[oblivion]

I have the same problem, thus the cheaper pipes! I just tell her half what I pay for the tanks!!

haha i guess many more others apart from us do that
everything i buy i have to "discount" the price
and make sure i pay cash! no statements in the credit card bills as evidence!

but honestly, back to the topic, apart from ada, anyone knows where i can get replica pipes good for small tanks i.e. 1-footers?
i simply love 1-footers now

[vurbul]

Hi tcampbell,
From your experience of using the Mix Max and designing it. Would a Ehiem 2211 flowrate be enough to power them?

Thanks

[tcampbell]

I have not actually used an Eheim 2211 on it, however I can say for certain the Eden 501 or other similiar filters will not work with it. The flowrate though stated as fast is not fast enough. However I know the Eheim 2215 is more then powerful enough for the Mix Max M. That said, 360 LPH is the min recommended output for a filter since all small capacity filters tried below this were too small.
Eheim filters are always more efficient then other cheaper name brand filters like ZooMed, Eden and others, so it is quite possible it will be fine, but I can not say for certain.
With slower flowrates the gases simply gathered at the top of the Mix Max near the impeller and level of gas would continue to grow, thus stopping the impeller. The Mix max would have to be turned over for the gases to escape into the tank in a rush and it to start again (effectively being useless). If the bubble rate was very slow, less then 1 bubble per 2 second there was no problems however as the gas was able to be dissolved into the water and the build up of gas at the top did not occur.

[tcampbell]

Well it has been a while since I posted any pictures so I should post them now. I started everything off slow.

Lights = 48 watts T5 using a Fishline Light Fixture. Very bright. One tube is a Philips Master 865 and the other is the Philips Master 840. So I get a mixture of more reddish light with more white/blue light. So that is 1.65 watts per gallon, very similar to what Tom Barr suggests a tank should have and he give an example with the low light ADA tank. http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...ght=plantbrain

So

Filter is the Eheim 2215 of course with just the standard course green filter media and one layer of white filter floss.

Soil was a test version of soil I mentioned previously. One bag of 9l which really wasn't enough soil but I made due.

Problems or issues = only two, the glass pipes get dirty fast and need to be cleaned as you see in the picture. Two, the soil wasn't enough to easily plant so I made do.

The tank was setup from scratch, so no mature filter, etc.

Day one put in soil and ran filter, no lights no co2
Day two drained all water and refilled
Day three drained all water and refilled
Day four planted the tank
Day five drained half water and refilled
Day six drained half water and refilled
Day seven added shrimp (50 or more small ones)
Day eight drained half water and refilled
Day nine added 5 Rummy noses tetra, One oto
Day ten added fish, what are the called...... I forget orange color suck agea off glass and plants.
Day eleven drained half water and refilled
Day twelve added 5 more rummy nose tetras and two corys
Day thirteen watched fish
Day fourteen drained half water and refilled
Day sixteen watched fish
Now Day 21 drained half the water and refilled

Test results:
NH4 gradually rose for the first 6 days to 1.0mg/l then dropped by the 8th to 0.5mg/l and down to 0 by the 9th day and has been that way since.

Po4 has been a stable 0.25mg/l , the same as my tap water

NO2 stayed 0 until the 9th day, rose to 1.0 then 2.0 on the 13th day then dropped sown to 0 by the 18th day

No3 stayed 0 until the 9th day where is went to 5.0 and has stayed that way until I added ferts.

KH has been a stable 3
Gh was a 6 and in the last week rose to 7

Started ferts for the first time 3 days ago and now levels are

NH4 = 0.0
PO4 = 1.0
NO2 = 0.0
NO3 = 5.0
KH = 3
GH = 7

Dosing is 1.4tsp Kno3 X2 a week, 1/16 Tsp Kh2Po4 X 2 a week, 1/16 tsp Plantex CSM + B X 3 a week

These has been no issue and no algae. Tank is responding ok. I was not able to start CO2 until 3 days ago as I was running tests on the soil, natural buffering level and nutrient levels, and couldn't have the CO2 or ferts mess with that. OH well. Results have been fine.

Here is the picture:


The plants in the two front corners are just there as I haven't had time to do anything with them yet.

Please don't judge the layout to strongly as this setup wasn't really about a layout but rather comparing the soil to ADA soil and water cloudiness, easy of setup, buffering level, quality of soil, downsides, etc.

Good news is have a tank with no algae for 3 weeks and no problems. The soil is good, easy to use and will be a great product, with no water cloudiness.

Bad news is I am dismantling the tank tomorrow. I have been asked to test out another version of soil (this time I will have the proper amount for planting as I have 2 bags) and see how it compares.

Shouldn't be bad, take out all plants, and hardscape. Catch all the fish, remove the soil. Clean the tank. Clean the pipes, etc. Add new soil and start over.

Suggestions on layout welcomed.