Problems with my altum angels

[Lam_wn]

Hi,
recently got a couple of altums from 328. They were in very good condition and settled into my 3x2x2 tank quickly. Started eating on first day and until now their behaviour reflects stable condition.
However, I have been noticing torn and tettered finnage on them - only have 3 presently and all 3 seem to have some fin tears here or there. 1 severe case is with deep gash on dorsal.
They dont seem to be picking on each other - hardly if at all.
And the tank mates are all rather peaceful creatures:
3x whiptails (not sure about the exact species)
1x large discus --> prime suspect, but he is very timid, and he hardly ever bothers the altums, if he does, it MUST be at night, though I would hardly expect him to be able to do much damage
1x platy (feeder - left over after cycling)
3x guppies (again left over after cycling)
1x indian dwarf puffer
some malayan shrimps

since these fauna dont seem to be the culprit, I am turning to the conditions in the tank:
Have an internal reactor for CO2 and its creating quite a strong current in the tank. Not sure why the altums like to swim around the outlet and get tossed about sometimes. But I dont understand how this may cause any significant damage to their finnage.

Lastly, want to ask how I may treat the injuries (eg melafix? prevent fungus on wounds?) without havign remove them from the planted setup - as I am afraid to make any drastic changes like catching them into a hospital tank.

thanks

[PeterGwee]

The puffer is one potential culprit for sure.

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[valice]

Might be platy too.
I have seen my T.candidi fighting with a platy.

[genes]

Remove the puffer, they'll nip the fins of the other fishes, especially the slow moving ones once he extinguishes his supply of snails/shrimps in your tank.

[illumnae]

it might very well be the discus, especially if you have only 1...discus tend to do better and be more peaceful when in groups...if you keep 1 on its own it might get aggressive on seeing another similar cichlid in the tank

but i agree that the puffer and platy are potential suspects as well

[fireblade]

I will say that it is the puffer!

[Biotopeshop]

Do also watch out for sunken stomaches..they may not be suffering from fish bullies. Do monitor for bacteria manifestations. Other symptoms such as cloudy eyes and lesions on their bodies, along with broken fins.

How big are they?

regards

[bossteck]

Another possibility is the angels fighting among themselves, establishing the hierarchy?

[Lam_wn]

Do also watch out for sunken stomaches..they may not be suffering from fish bullies. Do monitor for bacteria manifestations. Other symptoms such as cloudy eyes and lesions on their bodies, along with broken fins.

How big are they?

regards

Hi,
thanks all for the advice. I have removed the puffer, the platy AND (most painful, but temporarily) the discus. I actually doubt any of these did the damage, which is why I am very scared after reading the above quote.
No sunken stomachs now, but I do see something similar to slime disease in small patches on the body, but I thought that it was a wound/scar. I hope can get some pics of it by tonight. Can you tell us more about these sort of bacteria attacks?
Anyway, they are about $1 coin body size.
thanks

[luenny]

I think the discus may not be the culprit. If he is you can usually see it. Most likely the puffer or fighting among themselves. And about bacteria infestation, monitor their behavior also. Bacteria infestation usually comes with behavioural change also like stop eating or eating less and less active than normal.

[Lam_wn]

thanks for the reply,
fortunately I am not seeing any behavioural change, though 1 of them is looking quite bad shape
I got the pics, but they are quite poor quality



there are some whitish 'scars' which are not so visible, on t he head of one of them. I am so worried these may be like slime bacteria or fungus...
do give inputs
thanks

[PeterGwee]

Fin rot....

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[Lam_wn]

Fin rot....

Regards,
Peter Gwee

Hi,
thanks for this input, it seems, from the 5mins of internet research I did, that you are spot on, as these are the exact symptoms I am observing...guess the discus suffered for nothing again...
Anyway, whats more important now is treatment...I am not sure if should carry the discussion to the other sub-forum under fish care...
I read that CopperSafe and/or antibiotics are the recommended cures, but what I am concerned with now is whether or not I should remove the fish to 'hospital' tanks. 1 of the websites i visited also says stress is a common cause, which is why I am hesitant in moving the fish to an unfamilar environment again.
But at the same time the medication cannot be administered in the present planted set up right?
could anyone advise on this issue?

edit: some water specs:
ammonia: ~0
nitrite: - didnt test
nitrate: ~10ppm
I didnt really suspect it had anything to do with the water in the first place but just test in case

thanks

[PeterGwee]

Do more frequent large water changes and learn how to grow plants better. Healthy plants equals to healthy fishes...loads of O2, hiding space and low NH4. At the moment, you can consider adding some carbon or zeolite to the filter till things settle in better.

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[Lam_wn]

Do more frequent large water changes and learn how to grow plants better. Healthy plants equals to healthy fishes...loads of O2, hiding space and low NH4. At the moment, you can consider adding some carbon or zeolite to the filter till things settle in better.

Regards,
Peter Gwee

Hi Peter,
thanks for the response again, actually I didnt quite get this point. the water parameters seemed quite ok and the plants have been growing steadily for a while, do you mean that maintaining good water conditions without adding medication is sufficient? i.e. the fish would just recover slowly after a while?
thanks

[PeterGwee]

You would need to medicate them likely. The tank isn't likely that great if the fishes are doing that badly from the look of things. Altums ain't that easy of a fish I guess since they are septical to bacteria infection as they come from waters that have little of bacteria due to the very low pH (read somewhere...).

Regards,
Peter Gwee

[stoker]

Get rid of the puffer

Mike

[Interestor]

Hi Peter,
thanks for the response again, actually I didnt quite get this point. the water parameters seemed quite ok and the plants have been growing steadily for a while, do you mean that maintaining good water conditions without adding medication is sufficient? i.e. the fish would just recover slowly after a while?
thanks

put the 3 angel in hospital tank, do external medication first, follow by QT procedure. when they are more healthy than return them to your comm tank.

CHeers..