Is our English up to Standard?

[eddy planer]

Hi folks,

The authority has tried its best to revamp the English syllabus time after time, get better trained teachers, improve teaching methods and encourage reading of English story books, providing subtitles for Mandarin drama, etc. In short, it has done whatever it can do. But sad to say, many are still confused with these words:

1. advise and advice
2. practise and practice
3. lose and loss
4. lend and borrow
5. have and got
6. principle and principal
7. worse and worst

Adding a 's' or 'es' for plural of thses words:

1. equipments
2. furnitures
3. sheeps
4. syllabuses

and many more. We can see it in forum chatting, signboards or banners islandwide, now and then.

What has happened?

In my opinion, there is nothing much we can do to change the way we speak English as long as we are born and live in this country for a long time. Also, we cannot compare ourselves with the people in the west because English is their language.
I feel that Singlish is unique and I am not ashamed of it

Anyone agree?

[oblivion]

some of the spelling issues are to do with british or american spelling actually
i remember when we were kids, british english was taught as the correct spelling to be used

however, with us media being very mainstream nowadays plus the proliferation of the internet, many get confused over words with dual british and us spelling

even teachers can't really help in this sometimes as the newer generations of teachers are the same ones who grew up under mainstream us media influence!

however, for the 2nd set of examples you mentioned that have to do with proper singular & plural forms, i think that can and should be corrected

singlish imo is here to stay, but i see singlish as being more of a different unique singaporean way of sentence structuring plus some additional unique words like lah, loh, lor etc

the actual english words being used in singlish should still be fundamentally correct in spelling

[illumnae]

if you think the examples you mentioned are bad, try taking a look at the sms being sent out by youngsters these days. the English language is being mangled beyond recognition

[Shadow]

That sms linggo is beyond my brain can handle, generation gap

[eddy planer]

I find this problem where my children pick up from child care or kindergarten and then this carrys on till into Pr. and Sec. School. I had a hard time correcting them, but lost the battle instead as she has too much doeses in school.

broken English and singlish too... whatever.. When it becomes part of the habit, its very difficult. The environment we are in also makes lots of different I must say. When I went to UK to study, I make it a point to speak proper English and be understood. Whenever I spoke, I will think before I talk. However, I ended up coming back with some form of ANG MOH slang for some months before finally settling down with my lcoal accent. While in UK, I realised too that there are many locals who do not speak proper English too. Some are just too much of local slang and lingo. The only time when I heard Queen's English spoken was during their parliment debate.

agree?

[s1c1lee]

While I cannot claim to speak Queen's English, I find singlish very painful to listen to. I complained to my kids pre-school teacher as my son had picked up singlish, i.e. the teachers do not correct the singlish.

I make it a a point to correct any singlish in my home. While singlish is here to stay, I do not think its something to shout about. My opinion.

Regards,
SC

[genes]

Please pardon me but i tend to find Singaporeans who try to slang the "ang mo" ways a poser. I lived for a couple of years overseas too and find it especially irritating when one Singaporean talks to another fellow Singaporen with the ang mo slang. But i tend to agree when speaking to ang mos. We have to speak with a certain slang in order for them to understand us.

There is no way we can prevent the future generation from picking up Singlish. Singlish is our culture. Even our local television and radio programs are using it.

Unless you can follow the foot-steps of singer Madonna who does not possess any television or radio at home that may allow her kids to pick up any unwanted information. I think Singlish is here to stay. The most we can do is to correct broken English used.

[stormchild]

Please pardon me but i tend to find Singaporeans who try to slang the "ang mo" ways a poser. I lived for a couple of years overseas too and find it especially irritating when one Singaporean talks to another fellow Singaporen with the ang mo slang. But i tend to agree when speaking to ang mos. We have to speak with a certain slang in order for them to understand us.

That's like an ang moh dressing up as a ninja trying to do those kung fu moves.

[juggler]

Try this site at STOMP English As It Is Broken. A lot of good reading there. [The site stated "This section is made possible by the Speak Good English Movement and the Ministry of Education, which provides us with the expertise of its English language specialists".]

I bought one of the books they compiled and I really learnt something from it too!

BTW - I still prefer to spell in UK English:
"colour" instead of "color";
"analyse" instead of "analyze";
"favourite" instead of "favorite"
...

So much so that I changed the dictionary on my MS Office suite of programs to use U.K. dictionary so that they don't automatically change my words.

[zyblack]

Still most forums built in spellcheckers are using US English. Even AQ is no different. Testing..color...colour....

Positive...US English. Can this be changed in my settings?

[eddy planer]

In my opinion, neighborhood school is good for kids to mix with other children of different background. E.g. people who came from well-to-do family and admit to good school have very little understanding of those who are less fortunate than them. Usually, some of the highly educated people with good command of English are aloof and cannot mix well with people from all walks of life.
Sometimes, it is best to let the children settle in a less advantage environment so that they can grow and learn to become a better and humble person.

agree?

[|squee|]

Sometimes, it is best to let the children settle in a less advantage environment so that they can grow and learn to become a better and humble person.

My thoughts are alike. One good example is our government... their entire childhood is spent in schools like RI, RJC, NUS... how can they understand how the majority of Singaporeans' lives are like?

As for our English, I believe it's good enough. I find it disgusting that our government is asking us to ditch Singlish when talking to foreigners... it's OUR brand of the English language and they should be the one accommodating us instead of the other way round. But Singapore being the multi-racial society it is...

I cannot stand how some people my age warp English when typing it online. Some of you know what I mean

[koel9]

In my opinion, neighborhood school is good for kids to mix with other children of different background. E.g. people who came from well-to-do family and admit to good school have very little understanding of those who are less fortunate than them. Usually, some of the highly educated people with good command of English are aloof and cannot mix well with people from all walks of life.
Sometimes, it is best to let the children settle in a less advantage environment so that they can grow and learn to become a better and humble person.

agree?

brings to mind that elitist brat, what's her name? whose papa is a mp.

[bryan]

http://www.insanepoly.com/blog/?cat=7

This one?

Back to topic, other than the different social levels. How about the different nationalities? I couldn't book a tour at an agency because the mainland chinese girl could not understand my english and I couldn't understand her mandarin.

[eddy planer]

Hahaha that is the classice one..

.
Sometimes, it is best to let the children settle in a less advantage environment so that they can grow and learn to become a better and humble person.

What I would do if I were the Education Minister is insist that the 'top' newly-graduated teachers serve part of their bond in the less popular schools as role models of good English rather than in the 'top' schools. I am not convinced that the assignment of new teachers to schools is random!

I would also insist that the subsidies for the universities be mostly transferred to the pre-school sector to raise standards in English and Mother Tongue

[Shaihulud]

It is up to standard i think, Singlish is just another form of pidgin English, I am personally neutral towards it. I do rather dislike Singaporeans that smirch our English speaking qualities though, in fact there seems to be more of such people writing in to the public forums nowadays.

[ukplanter]

As you can see I am quite new here but felt I had to post to congratulate you all on your english. You make it very easy for me to enjoy your web site and forums. Sometimes Your English is better than mine!

Thankyou

[vinz]

Wah laoz! Ang moh say our England is more power than his. Win liao lah!

Hehehe... couldn't resist.

Personally, I'm fine with Singlish as long as it's not used at the wrong time or wrong place. It's part of the culture and character of this country. Just as other English speaking countries have their flavour of social English. Some countries even have different flavours of English in different regions.

It's not limited to English. Other languages have similar... err differences (this is where my 'England' failed me).

As for the quality of our formal English... well, one of the most effective ways of learning is practice... and for a subject like language, practice (or lack of it), is ongoing, when we interact (or fail to interact) with the people around us. Depending on the language ability of the people we speak to regularly, the good or bad are reinforced. Immerse a child from a Chinese speaking household in British society long enough (provided he mainly speaks to British people and seldom to other people with questionable English abilities) and it's a good chance he will come back speaking fairly decent English.

The schools can try many ways, and they should keep trying to find better methods, but the fact is there are only that many hours for lecturing (i.e. verbal delivery), reading, practising, demonstration in school. But I think we should be proud that most of our children graduate with decent enough formal English to speak to, be understood by, and understand native English speakers. Our students are very welcomed in foreign universities in English speaking countries because we write and speak well enough to understand and be understood by the lecturers and tutors. Most universities take in foreign students because they pay full fees, but often have to bare the extra effort in teaching because of the language barrier (there are still passing rates to be considered if the uni is to maintain it's reputation). Singaporean students pay full fees, but require very little extra effort to teach effectively.

Whether a Singaporean use proper English is not so much a matter of ability, but choice. Many of our forum members have demonstrated that they can write decent English although they initially wrote in SMS, IM lingo or Singlish. Actually, AQ does not police posts for Singlish sentence structure and grammar, but the spelling and punctuation.

The confusion over words with similar spelling, is not only a Singaporean problem. I believe there are native English speakers who commit the same errors. There are entire websites dedicated to this problem and they are not targetted at non-native English speakers.

[checkerboard]

Speaking as a Singaporean who is currently in a western country now for close to 1 year, I must say that actually, Singaporeans' English are pretty good. In fact, you will be surprise that not all native English speakers can speak or write very well, especially in terms of proper grammar usage or vocabulary range, or writing in a formal academic setting.

I find 2 things that has nothing to do with Singlish slightly irritating though:
1) many Westerners thinks Singapore is part of China, and assume we know little English. Many Chinese from China refuse to speak to us in Chinese as they think we do not know Chinese. I can safely say, I understand both languages and I think this is the beauty of Singapore's education. Most of us are effectively bilingual.

2) Singaporeans overseas faking an accent. I must say this irks me the most, especially if the accent is so fake it sounds really bad.

Lastly, my take on Singlish. I am perhaps someone who is guilty of it most of the time. But I believe one can control the usage of Singlish if the situation indeed calls for it.
Otherwise, there is really no harm LAR! And let's not get too upset over it LOR!

[RHX]

English has evolved locally to be Singlish. It’s not only happening here, it’s happening in all over the world. Other regions have their own local versions of English. No doubt about it, Singlish is here to stay.

I have no problem with singlish, but there are a few things that Singaporeans have gone too far to simply dismantled the whole English structure, which I really could not stand.

1) They like to shortened the English sentence & summaries it into just 3 or 4 words, & expected others to know what they mean!
2) Sometimes when I tried to communicate to others in a complete English sentence, I was being cut short to indicate that they understand me.
3) At times I have to translate the English into Chinese in order to understand them. Because they were originated from a Chinese sentence & was being translated word for word.

Have Singaporean really became so efficient that they don’t need to listen to the full sentence to understand you & expects you to understand his/her short sentences? Isn’t it part of a basic courtesy that you have to allow others to finish the sentence? Has Singapore really became so efficient that these basic courtesy have to be phased out?

When i came back from oversaea studies I could not get used to the singlish. Sometimes I felt like a retard in Singapore, asking others to repeat several times in order to understand them & to have my sentence cut short as if I have not make myself clear enough, when i have completely no problem communicating with others in overseas.

Singlish has became a problem not because of their accent, but the whole English structure have been changed & mixed with other languages which many times only the locals will understand it.