Base fert and substrate

[hoppinghippo]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html"]Krib article[/url]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html

Hi I"m deciding to redo my tank and add base fert. anyone tried DIY? (as in article above)I am wondering how good is commercial aquatic fert? and what's the average price like for 2ft tank? Am tempted to try the vermiculite and loam and pong lily tabs as in the article, should be much cheaper rite? and where's the cheapest place to buy fert and substrate?

[hoppinghippo]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html"]Krib article[/url]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html

Hi I"m deciding to redo my tank and add base fert. anyone tried DIY? (as in article above)I am wondering how good is commercial aquatic fert? and what's the average price like for 2ft tank? Am tempted to try the vermiculite and loam and pong lily tabs as in the article, should be much cheaper rite? and where's the cheapest place to buy fert and substrate?

[hoppinghippo]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html"]Krib article[/url]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html

Hi I"m deciding to redo my tank and add base fert. anyone tried DIY? (as in article above)I am wondering how good is commercial aquatic fert? and what's the average price like for 2ft tank? Am tempted to try the vermiculite and loam and pong lily tabs as in the article, should be much cheaper rite? and where's the cheapest place to buy fert and substrate?

[hoppinghippo]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html"]Krib article[/url]

http://www.thekrib.com/Plants/kelly-intro.html

Hi I"m deciding to redo my tank and add base fert. anyone tried DIY? (as in article above)I am wondering how good is commercial aquatic fert? and what's the average price like for 2ft tank? Am tempted to try the vermiculite and loam and pong lily tabs as in the article, should be much cheaper rite? and where's the cheapest place to buy fert and substrate?

[vinz]

Don't use vermiculite... I've tried it. After a few uprooting and replanting, you'll find bits of it floating in your tank or sitting above your substrate. Have not noticed any advantages.

Some of us are using Horti brand soil, cocopeat or aquatic compost by themselves. That should be enough. They can be found in terrestiral plant nurseries. Just make sure that whatever you get, it does not contain any chems like anti-fungus. Aquatic compost is good as it's specifically for pond plants and is safe for aquatic life.

Yes, these are cheaper than specialise base fert. But they must be supplemented by root ferts.

[FC]

Hi,

I am new to the hobby. However, I wish to share my bad experienec with you. My humble opinion is JBL, 1 can at $11 enough for 2 ft tank. If you can afford a little more, Dupla at about $20+. Use per instruction, place the fert on top of 0.5 inch thick quartz sand and have at least another 3 inch thick quartz sand above it. I beleive this will prevent the fert from leaking out into the water while serving only the roots. Do not put more than necessary, less is fine. I knew this because I had a bad encounters where I added too much fert, thinking that they would serve me longer. I end up having cloudy water and then green water for months. At this point, to re-do everything would be very painful. I cleared the problem finally with much water change and addition of UV light.

I hope this help.

[vinz]

Interesting method FC. Most of us put about an average of 2 inches of base fert and covered with 1 inch of gravel. Works quite well for me, no problems with algae from that.

A thick base fert is mainly to provide a better rooting medium. It'll probably last longer but it's not the point of it.

[sherchoo]

FC,

More base fert is ok, IMO. What we have to worry about is liquid fert where algae get's their nutricient from. Rich base fert is a plus esp with fert hungry plants like Echinodorus sp. However, we have to be cautious as these base fert will leech into the water column when uprooting is performed. That's why we should get fert that are fish safe.

BTW, how did it affect you when you added too much (base?) fert?

[elmike]

Hey FC

Thanks for sharing your bad experience... I always thought it better to err on the low side when it comes to adding base fertilisers. Your experience only served to confirm this. Looks like when I finally get to setting up my dream tank, I would have a pocket full of hindsights of those who'd blundered in some way or another[]

cheers!
mike

[hoppinghippo]

FC: no need humble lah, everyone here all the same, know a bit here and there only! If I"m not wrong, the reason for your cloudy water and subsequent green water for months is prob cuz your fert leaked to the water column? but 3inch of quartz shouldn't let that happen, so my guess is in setting up your tank, maybe bits of fert was left above the substrate level? like maybe during pouring in? and I think 3 inch (I am just guessing here) of substrate seems like quite high for plant roots to penetrate to reach fert? thanx for your advice and sharing your experience! glad your tank's fine now! post pics?

vinz: acc. to the krib article, compost creates problems as it decomposes I think? as from the article:

"Don't use bagged potting soil, peat moss, or compost (They will decay under water and prevent good root growth. See the recent article by Diane Walstad in the Sept. 1994 issue of TAG."

And where to get cheap substrate? I am looking for the dennerle brown one, or any looking like that. thanx!

And how is aquatic base fert like JBL or dennerle different in nutrients from normal soil/peat/compost/fert bought from nurseries?

[FC]

How can I post pics? I cannot find the "attach" function. BTW, I am 1 day old here.

[hoppinghippo]

see
http://www.aquaticquotient.com/phpbb2/viewtopic.php?t=2635&sessionID={AFC90C79-FAFB-4F2E-9215-0C3B998888E9}

or alternatively just use yahoophotos and just put the link here!

[vinz]

HH,

This is the second time I'm using Aquatic compost. No problem faced from the first time. What I've noticed this time round is that it takes longer for some of the plants to establish themselves (two weeks or more, while my tanks with JBL took about a week or two only). As I was new to planted tanks when I first used it, I did not note any of the initial developments but it sure took a long time for the tank to stabilise.

I suspect it's due to the soil stablising in a aquatic environment. The other possibility is the relatively lower levels of fert in the soil compared to aquatic base fert like JBL. Did experience root rot in some plants, but they quickly grew new roots. Once establish they were quite ok. The only plants that failed completely were Echinodorus parviflorus and a some Criniums. I have a Echinodorus "Indian Flame" or something like that in there and its stayed short (though growing new leaves) until last week when the new leaves seem bigger then before.

The diff between aquatic base fert and soils are the levels of fert. That's why you must supplement soil with root ferts right from day 1.

[jacian]

----------------
On 11/15/2002 12:13:13 AM

Don't use bagged potting soil, peat moss, or compost (They will decay under water and prevent good root growth. See the recent article by Diane Walstad in the Sept. 1994 issue of TAG.

I am using peat moss in my substrate for 1 tank. It is more like an experiment, I wanted to try out red plants and need the Fe to be available in the substrate. So far, the result is good.

I mixed 1 part of peat moss to 5 parts of JBL base fert (by volumn). Yes, peat moss would decay and it will cause the substrate becoming anaerobic. But I am thinking that anaerobic is actually beneficial as it allows the reduction of iron. The humic acid released by the peat moss can act as chelator for the Fe++ and make it available in the water. [] []

Of course, on the bad side, sulphates might be reduced to the toxic sulphides. []

Also, as plants carry oxygen through their roots, it should not pose a problem for the plants when there is a lack of oxygen in the substrate.

Well, any comments??

[hoppinghippo]

Vinz: how much is aquatic compost for 2 ft tank? maybe I will try that plus pond lily tabs like the krib article suggested to boost the fert level. I"m just wondering fert is fert is fert, its all nutrients, so I really don't see how specialized aquatic fert like dennerle or others have an advantage over normal fert? I would imagine ponds and streams in nature have silty bottoms which are essentially none of your "specialized" fert but they work fine. so trying not to buy into the commercial aquatic fert unless bo bian.

Jacian: ***stunned**** *blink blink* eerrrr I would like to comment but a bit too cheem for me! [] but just wonder does acid reduce iron to rust? so plants can't use them like that?