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Thread: Iron discussion

  1. #1
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    Iron discussion

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    I have a friend who keeps a planted tank for about 8 medium sized discus.

    It's a 4x1.5x2 with only 120W. He used some base fert and was set up probably about 1/2 year ago. His tank was not frequently maintained because of his travels. Can be without water change for a month or more.

    His plants included Star Grass, Rotala macandra and Red Tiger Lily.

    Amazing thing was that he did not do any liquid fertilisation, only CO2, and yet his red plants are really red. And the Star Grass grows very well. No algae problem too. I suspect the nutrients come from the meaty stuff like pig heart he feeds the discus.

    If reddish plants are said to be iron-loving, can I deduce that the blood in the meats provided the iron? So if I frequently feed blood worms to my fish, it helps in the iron supply for the plants?

    ???
    koah fong
    Juggler's tanks

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    heh... I don't know anything about the Fe content in blood worms but I think its not supposed to be taken literally either.

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    KF,

    NUS article that I posted before: Bloodworm as Fishfood. It states BW as a good source of iron for fishes.
    Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
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    yeah. but FE in fe3 or fe2 lol

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    No idea, but the article focuses on BW as fishfood and not plant food.
    Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
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    Koah Fong, I heard discus need very good water quality. If your friend can change water only once a month and yet his discus are healthy, he must have a secret formula.[] Ask him whats the filtration equipment(including filter media)/water conditioner used and how he managed to keep NO3 and PO4 level low?

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    There has been some controversy over red plants needing more Fe. There is some recent discussion on the APD that this is not true.

    Here are some of the tread in the discussion.
    http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plant.../msg00015.html
    http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plant.../msg00024.html

    Just some food for thoughts.

    BC

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    Fe2 = the iron we us and want to add to our tank

    Fe3 = rust

    Blood worms do add to the iron , but also is one hell of a algae contribution factor. So feed sparingly, and use iron additives early in the morning instead.
    The key to success is patience. If that fails, screw the guy in front of you!!

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    Why adding iron only in the morning?

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    The idea is that you dun want excess iron to remain in your water for too long as the algae may start using it...

    so as a rough guide, some people recommend dosing small quantities in the morning so that plant which (supposedly) are better are getting these nutrients will use them and make them unavailable for algae... This is probably more critical when dosing elements like iron and phosporus as these two elements are closely linked with algae.
    Allen

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    Allen,

    Perhaps better to say dose Fe when the light comes on (or close to it).
    Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
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    true... but that might not explain to him WHY we dose when lights are on... some newbies do not understand such things yet. So as such I try and tackle the issue from a more basic level.
    Allen

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    Nowadays, I only dose Fe once a week after water change. The Fe is added through Seachem Flourish and Seachem Equilibrium.

    I have stopped Flourish for 2 weeks. But there is still some Fe added when I add Equilibrium during water change. Still no sign of Fe deficiency. My guess now is that plants may not not need too much Fe or the Fe in the substrate is keeping the plants from Fe deficiency.

    Just another experiment...

    BC

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    Aparently, some Fe3+ can be used by the plants through the roots. Not too sure about that but I have read it somewhere.

    BC

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    ----------------
    On 11/27/2002 10:01:53 AM

    true... but that might not explain to him WHY we dose when lights are on... some newbies do not understand such things yet. So as such I try and tackle the issue from a more basic level.
    ----------------
    Allen,

    Understand where you're coming from, but in this case, your original statement to dose in the morning came with explanation and conversely, having read that, some ppl will dose in the morning even though their lights come on only at 5pm.
    Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
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    ----------------
    Understand where you're coming from, but in this case, your original statement to dose in the morning came with no explanation and conversely, having read that, some ppl will dose in the morning even though their lights come on only at 5pm.
    ----------------
    Actually I wasn't the one who posted to dose in the morning... it was zerocool... and I was simply responding to wks' question as to "why dose only in the morning?quot;... perhaps the only assumption I made is that people have their lights on from morning.

    Anyway, it good that this has been clarified, and even better to know out mods are hard at work
    Allen

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    ----------------
    On 11/26/2002 7:58:00 PM

    There has been some controversy over red plants needing more Fe. There is some recent discussion on the APD that this is not true.

    Here are some of the tread in the discussion.
    http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plant.../msg00015.html
    http://fins.actwin.com/aquatic-plant.../msg00024.html

    Just some food for thoughts.

    BC
    ----------------
    BC: Thanks for the helpful links.

    I have to be careful feeding BW. I find they increase the NO3 greatly.
    koah fong
    Juggler's tanks

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    Opps, sorry about that.
    Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
    Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:
    A woman, without her man, is nothing.
    A woman: without her, man is nothing.

  19. #19
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    Iron in human blood plasma is bound in the ferric state (Fe+++) to a specific protein called transferrin. Transferrin is the carrier of iron in the blood and is saturated normally only to 30-60% of it iron-binding capacity.

    So, if you are bleeding on your finger, don't waste, dip it into your tank but it's useless

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    Allen_1971: [The idea is that you dun want excess iron to remain in your
    water for too long as the algae may start using it...

    so as a rough guide, some people recommend dosing small
    quantities in the morning so that plant which (supposedly) are
    better are getting these nutrients will use them and make them
    unavailable for algae... This is probably more critical when
    dosing elements like iron and phosporus as these two elements
    are closely linked with algae]

    *** Think you better go check on where you got these info from, they are way off the scale. let me knoe the book or website tt says adding phosporus to planted tanks. Thanks. This is somthing really new, a new school of thought??

    Adding phosporus/phosphates WILL definately start an algae bloom

    =================================================
    My reply,

    Ok, regarding doing in the morning b4 lights on:

    >>>>> Reason is cos in the morning, the level of O2 is suppose to be lower..
    As iron supplements doesn't last very long ~4hr or so due to the highly
    saturation of 02 in planted tanks together with the birght lights, it
    get oxidised very quickly

    So instead of letting it go to waste, we dose b4 lights on to hopefully
    let the plants take in as much as possible. Of course we dose sparingly
    but often then.

    Abt doing phosphates:

    >>> WHO dose phosporus!!!! Planted tanks DEFINATELY dun need additional
    phosporus! Think you got it wrong, it is K [potassium] tt we dose.
    Dosing K [potassium] in a little excess is no problem at all.

    I think I can't be wrong here cos a few experts tell me one. Ask ard dun think anyone in the right mind adds phosporus. They have been doing planted tanks for more than 7yrs!! Gurus in this area

    ***[sorry for the harsh tone, your postings kinda misleading]
    The key to success is patience. If that fails, screw the guy in front of you!!

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