Help with Iwagumi

[ukplanter]

I am in the process of setting up a new tank.
I was hoping someone might be able to offer me some advice with Iwagumi scapes. I can place rocks in a fashion that I find appealing to my eye but I would like to be able to understand the rules of Iwagumi. What Will an ADA judge look for in a good example of Iwagumi?

Is there a guide (book of literature) that explains the art of Iwagumi?

The following pictures show my initial experiments -









please feel free to offer any critiscism or advice

many thanks
UKplanter

[raglan]

I don't have any knowledge of this art.
Can I just offer my perception, instead ?
I like it, but I think the middle piece on the first few pics might be placed flatter down, so it doesn't "go againat the grain" of the others. Perhaps make it more neutral ?
I like the big piece in the last pic - it looks like an owl . : )
Dave

edit: i found this explanation. Your last pic , though more than 3 rocks, looked like an owl..I didn't add what I thought; that the other pieces look like they are leaning in to receive some wisdom from the large piece. That seems to exemplify what this post talks about.
http://www.petfrd.com/forum/showpost...63&postcount=7

later edit: here's another explanation that deals with the idea of only 3 rocks a bit more - seems for one particular school of the art..but an odd number, not even, seems the rule ...??

Dave

http://www.aquatic-eden.com/2007/02/...=1171354320000

[ukplanter]

Thanks raglan, the post you provided the link to describes sanzon Iwagumi which is what I tried to replicate in the last photograph. Although 4 rocks are used I imagined the smallest supporting rock would dissapear in time with planting resulting in a 3 rock formation.

I liked the first arrangement but decided to change it to comply with the rules of Iwagumi (as desccribed in link) does this make the last arrangement better ???

Im interested to learn about the other types of Iwagumi ....

[Jervis]

Yes the last layout is Sanzon indeed. However, I find them a bit too common nowadays. The guidelines for creating such a scape is quite simple to replicate (as long as you spend enough time looking for the stone).

How about letting your imagination runs free... to me the first scape looks more original

[raglan]

will it be having any plants added ?

[blue33]

You need to have either one rocks as focus point or two rocks together as one focus point, to give dramatic effect.

My 2 cents.

[Burnz]

hi, ukplanter, I used your photo to try a different method of posting comments, do tell me if you are unhappy with this, i'll remove it promptly.

I would prefer the first scape among the options and here's my rationale. I think the focal points of this scape are not so much of the rocks than the two voids which are spatially different - "A" being more calm while "B" is presents some tension by the seemingly falling rock. All these i think is helped by the slope you moulded which i think is a important move. Putting these elements together makes the scape visually interesting. One thing i might add is maybe the rocks need not be placed in such a linear manner?

I agree with Jervis that "sanzo iwagu" is common and rather than to emulate what the Japanese are good at, we should really try to experiment with something different since we can't really beat them at their own game.
cheers

[ukplanter]

Burnz, This is great thanks. I think I agree that I prefer the origional scape but you will notice I decided to remove a stone to give me an odd No of stones (gozon Iwagumi?). I think I will recreate pic 3. and try moving the leaning stone forward as suggested.

I do not place rocks with the 'intention' of creating spaces etc. as your diagram shows, I simply place them in a arrangement I find appealing. Perhaps this is the way to go rather than sticking to hard and fast rules?.

Raglan, I will be adding plants, Im thinking of a simple HC carpet perhaps dwarf hair grass?
I think its important to get the hardscape right form the start So I am in no rush to plant. One day I will wake up and look at the rock arrangement of the day before and be happy with it. Then I will plant

Any more comments on Iwagumi? please help ...
Thanks

[Quixotic]

Not sure what exactly that you are looking for, but I happen () to come across an intriguing website regarding Iwagumi, which may provide some ideas towards an Iwagumi aquascape.

It seems like there is actually a lot more to the concepts and principles of Iwagumi, than we thought, or at least I thought. However, can't confirm if the concepts and principles mentioned actually adhere to the real Iwagumi, but they do seem to make some sense (ignoring the idiosyncrasies of the translation tool).

The website is in Russia language, you can use the Google language tool or Babelfish to translate it.
http://amania.110mb.com/Chapters/Shi...omp-stone.html

Somewhere towards the end of the page, there is a link to a PDF document from ADA Australia which briefly outlines the production of an Iwagumi layout. Here is the link, Production of Iwagumi Layout, Takashi Amano (PDF 3.3Mb)

[ukplanter]

Quixotic, Thanks very much for this link. A real indepth look at iwagumi. heavy reading but very interesting. Thanks Again!

[Verminator]

Nice scape.

Forgive me if i just missed what i would like to know. But i don't think its been mentioned.

My question is what substrate are you using. It looks very similar to what i'm thinking of getting. Which is a form of Amazonia II.

[Verminator]

Where do you find such rocks in the UK, i've been unable to find anything similar anywhere. Always the boring slate, which 9 times out of 10 tends to be flat and elongated.

[ukplanter]

Nice scape.

Forgive me if i just missed what i would like to know. But i don't think its been mentioned.

My question is what substrate are you using. It looks very similar to what i'm thinking of getting. Which is a form of Amazonia II.

Hi, The substrate is Red Sea Flora base. Ive used it many times before and although I have tried others (not ADA) I have always gone back to Flora base. I have heard of problems with Amazonia II being difficult to plant into!! Apparantly depressions made to plant stems do not back fill due to compression? Dont know if anyone else could confirm this?

As for the Rocks, I buy them from Maidenhead aquatics @ Morden (Surrey) They have excellent selection of hard scape materials.

[Verminator]

I remember you telling me of Maidenhead Aquatics before. Its sounding more and more like i need to get myself down there one saturday morning. I'm yet to find a shop with a good range of hardscape. Every shop i go to is a real let down for hardscape. Woods are generally easy to come across, everywhere seems to stock it in its masses, but rocks are usually alot harder to come by (except slate *yawn*)

Ha, thanks. Do keep us updated on the tank too I'll be keeping an eye out for updates for sure.

[Jervis]

Time for an update?

[ukplanter]

Sorry for delay on update. The following sequence of pictures was taken 2 weeks ago.

Ive probobly moved those rock one to many times now and could have gone on playing rocks forever. After settling for the following scape -

I took the scissors to The HC in the existing scape and trimmed and replanted, and planted, and planted, and planted, and planted ........ .. .. . .
Never planted HC stem by stem before .... it was a long old process thats for sure. Started last night, filled the tank with enough water to cover the subatrate and went to bed. Started again first thing this morning planting more HC stems. Once I thouhgt Id planted enough stems I started to break down the other tank.
It was always going to be a long day -

The water that had sat in the tank whilst planting the HC was syphoned of and Once the tank was is position I filled it with 50% from the old tank and 50% Dechlorinated tap water.
It was quite amazing just how much hair grass had grown from the few stems I planted !!

There was loads Of HC too, the top of it looked great but underneath was brown and dead as it had never been trimmed.

Where did all that HM come from, I think I only bought one pot!

I knew the external and the Co2 bottle werent going to fit in the cabinet but at the last minute decided that the filter would go beside the tank with the gas bottle inside. This made piping the filter a lot simpler.

The tank looks sooooo empty..... I must admit im a little bit scared about the low plant biomass I usually plant heavy from the start. The whole base is dotted with HC stems and ive added a few blyxa stems. Dosed with 5 ml flourish excel (initial dose) and 1.5 ml TPN+ ( will dose both daily)

Aaaaaaaaand relax .....zzzzz zzzz zzz z


2 weeks on and the HC is growing (slowly) Today the tank is due its second water change. No sign of algae at the moment despite the low plant biomass Drop checker in the lime green and HC pearling. Its all good at the mo!

Regards UKplanter

[Verminator]

Is that an Arcadia light set? If so what and how many bulbs do you have in it?

I have a 3ft Arcadia light set with x2 30W T8 bulbs which do no good for a 3ft tank, currently going to upgrade mine.

Nice looking tank. Sad to see the other one decomissioned, it was soo nice

[ukplanter]

Is that an Arcadia light set? If so what and how many bulbs do you have in it?

I have a 3ft Arcadia light set with x2 30W T8 bulbs which do no good for a 3ft tank, currently going to upgrade mine.

Nice looking tank. Sad to see the other one decomissioned, it was soo nice

yep arcadia lumianire 4 x 24 watt t5 (only using 2 bulbs at the moment).
That old tank is one of my entries for the AGA got some shots of it a few weeks ago looking at at its best!

[Fei Miao]

The tank looks sooooo empty..... I must admit im a little bit scared about the low plant biomass I usually plant heavy from the start. The whole base is dotted with HC stems and ive added a few blyxa stems. Dosed with 5 ml flourish excel (initial dose) and 1.5 ml TPN+ ( will dose both daily)

Aaaaaaaaand relax .....zzzzz zzzz zzz z


2 weeks on and the HC is growing (slowly) Today the tank is due its second water change. No sign of algae at the moment despite the low plant biomass Drop checker in the lime green and HC pearling. Its all good at the mo!

Regards UKplanter

Like the layout,good space between the rocks for plants. Iwagumi scape always looks empty when the tanks starts out, especially when I see how it looks previously , relax and let the plants grow. Just keep an eye on any algae outbreak because of low plant mass.

[raglan]

yep arcadia lumianire 4 x 24 watt t5 (only using 2 bulbs at the moment).
That old tank is one of my entries for the AGA got some shots of it a few weeks ago looking at at its best!

I really like that old tank !
Where are other photos of it ?
Dave