Mother of all Planted Tanks (Stages 1 & 2)

[elmike]

Hey Mike,
Hopefully its some one who would invite us to his house for the tank-warming. It should be a sight to behold. I am sure I will see all you guys there.

Its things like these that debunks the myth "money cannot buy happiness" :wink:

On that happy day, I'm sure to bring my swimming trunk and scuba diving gears, just in case boss says can swim

[timebomb]

I hope they hire a professional like Deuce Bigelow to clean it!

Who's Deuce Bigelow, Bill?

Hey, folks, I'm not at liberties to disclose the location of the tank. Some of you who are my close friends already know and I hope you all won't reveal this information on the world wide web, at least not until we're sure it's okay to do so.

I have more pictures on my hard disk but we won't be releasing them so soon. The next batch of pictures will be uploaded 2 weeks later. We're going to make this one long topic so that everyone can participate in the discussions and speculate on the equipment and stuff needed to maintain a tank of such gigantic proportions. Actually the truth is, we're shameless. So we are going to use this topic to draw more members into this forum

James is too busy to participate in the discussions here but he's interested in your opinions. As far as I know, the filter system is almost ready but the lighting, CO2 system and fertilisation regime isn't fully completed yet. They have a rough idea what sort of plants will be used and the type of fish to be kept but nothing's confirmed yet. If you have any brilliant ideas, feel free to post them here.

The owner is obviously a person who does not go around looking for the cheapest stuff. Everything's going to be state of the art, I expect. It won't turn out to be 200 tons of green water, that's for sure .

Loh K L

[FC]

James,

If you are reading this thread, I wish to say you are damn gutsy. I thought the plan did not go through. Just my humble opinions (I am no expert and may not make any sense at all, I just hope these helps):
1) Beware of CO2 and O2 build up in the room (escape from the water surface). Ventilation:
a) The exhaust volume per hour should match the rate of CO2 injection. CO2 is heavier than the other 2 main atmospheric gas (Nitrogen and Oxygen), therfore the exhaust duct should be mounted on lower part of the room's wall, at hidden corner.
b) If the room is air-conditioned all day, just leave some gaps at the doors (base) should do the trick.
2) You do not want to fail on this. Above what you have in mind: If you use base fert (laid under fresh gravel),
a) soak them in the "pool" for 2 weeks (no light to tank during this time) with 3 ft deep water. Change 100 % water every week for this 2 weeks.
b) after that, fill back with 2 ft deep water, do the planting, like farmers do.
c) change 25% water twice a week for the next 3 weeks, keeping the water at 3 ft high. Light period 5 hrs - intensity according to water depth.
d) then add fresh water till full height gradually (continuous flow) at rate of 1 ft per week. Increase light period gradually to 7 hrs (increase 10 mintues a day).
e) add fishes, yeah. No large species gravel digger though. Young cories, shrimps (the smaller the species the better), ottos and small crew of SAE are good house keeper.
f) monitor for 2 weeks before increasing the light up to maximum of 8.5 hrs. Avoid the acrylic/wall.

All the best!

[timebomb]

Hi, everyone,

James sent an email which he wants to be forwarded to this forum. Here it is:

KL,

Deuce Bigelow is a famous porno-actor cum Gigalo, he licks everything clean. Please forward my email to thank Ronnie and all for their well wishes.

Jim

How was I supposed to know?

Loh K L

[RonWill]

How was I supposed to know?

Kwek Leong, don't feel so bad... I didn't know who 'Deuce' was either, but now that you do, don't go around licking everything you see, ya? :wink:

James, I'm very glad that you're with us even though your schedule doesn't permit active participation, but there're a couple of things I shake off my mind... (down-side of being overly curious, but don't feel obliged to reveal anything if the timing is not right)

Granted the size of "The Tank", I'm thinking that filtration is supported by pool sized diatomaceous-earth based system. Wet/dry trickle filtration could be optional since I'm sure it's a 'planted aqua-garden'.

Design-wise, I don't understand why it's 'L-shaped' design*, where even with multiple pond pumps, I can 'see' a couple of 'dead-spots'. How would these areas resolved?

There's a 'diver access' for maintenance but prior to that (if the tank is a basement with residential space above it), where is the loading area for substrate and (I foresee) huge pieces of driftwoods/rock-work etc? (Please consider me when you require volunteers for plant-pruning or maintenance work... it would be a privilege and I'll be more than happy to lug along my own scuba-gear)

For the non-viewing areas, besides steel-reinforcment, are the exposed material (cement?) treated with water-proofing epoxy? If other materials are used, it'd be enlightening to know.

If 10cm acrylic panels are utilized for the viewing area, what is used to seal/bond it to the other walls... silicon? Are these panels glazed with protective film to minimize haze, scratches, etc?

With multiple flood lights going, how would dissipated heat be discharged and omigosh ! I can't imagine the size of an appropriate chiller going 24/7 (thermostat-controlled, no less) and I won't ask about the utility bills...

Last, but not least, will the 'tank' be a biotope-replicate?

No doubt about this being a looooong thread and I'm sure it's tickling plenty of brains. More questions when I can't sleep counting gallons of water instead of sheeps

* Afterthought... I didn't consider structural support for built-up area above the tank (eg. residential/living/shop space)

[ruyle]

Guys, I was alluding to the Rob Schneider comedy: Deuce Bigelow: Male
Gigolo, 1999. He has this job where he cleans tanks at the public aquarium
and he gets the days mixed up as to when it is closed. He's scraping the
algae off this huge tank: has scuba gear, fins, mask, and no swim trunks thinking the aquarium is closed and he's the only one there so he's not
paying attention to the crowd that is growing opposite the front glass,
pointing at him! Funny movie, recommended for 17 and over.

Bill
farang9

[hwchoy]

He's scraping the
algae off this huge tank: has scuba gear, fins, mask, and no swim trunks thinking the aquarium is closed and he's the only one there so he's not
paying attention to the crowd that is growing opposite the front glass,
pointing at him!

In South-east Asia it is highly not recommended to swim without adequate protection for the masculine fishing lure as the soft-shelled turtle is very common in the murky water.

[ruyle]

Heng Wah wrote:

In South-east Asia it is highly not recommended to swim without adequate protection for the masculine fishing lure as the soft-shelled turtle is very common in the murky water.

eewww, note to self: no skinny-dipping when I move to Thailand!!!

Bill
farang9

[confusekid]

Hi,
Just to add on to Freddy comment. Beside ventilation for CO2, there should be general ventilation for O2 as well. High concentration of O2 is quite dangerous if you have a naked flame. You do not want a fire that cannot be put out or worst a explosion.

regards,
Heng

[shortman]

Back to technical question

- what kind/type/capacity pump
- what filter suitable for this size
- what are the lighing should be used
- what safetly measure should we take care of

regards

[wynx]

Wow. Mind boggling! That's bigger than 1000 4-6ft tanks. Imagine the amount of lighting needed for this. Probably floodlights and underwater lights. Very curious about the CO2 reactor and fert dosing.

You have to respect the sheer guts needed to embark on something like this. So many issues to get around. Waterchange, de-chlorine/chloramine, dosing, CO2...

I am more inclined to think that beyond a fix size of the tank, the need to add extra lightings and carbon dioxide reduces. Why I have this though, just look at nature, no co2 injection and just natural sunlight, yet the plants are thriving. Doesn't that tells us something?

[victri]

Thinking about maintenance for the tank, there would need to be some way to access all the overhead lighting fixtures. Maybe some form of platform on the top level? On the subject of lighting, how about a glass roof with light filters/panels where you can control the amount of sunlight and/or moonlight entering the tank?

Water flow will definitely be an issue here. I'm sure there'll be submerged powerheads or water inlets (edit: outlets, I mean) within the tank to move water around dead spots and improve the circulation. These could be utilised to introduce CO2 into the water as well, to improve overall uniformity of CO2 in different parts of the tank. Strategically placed water drainage openings at different heights would maybe be helpful too. They could be placed at 75%, 50%, 25% and just above the gravel line. That would make different volumes of water changing so much easier.

I'm curious about the walls too. Would they be painted or tiled? Instead of a chiller, maybe a cooling system could be built into the walls?

[elmike]

Actually the truth is, we're shameless. So we are going to use this topic to draw more members into this forum

KL, you're stealing my show by driving traffic away from my tank. Your "Mother of all tanks", juxtaposed against the earlier 2, is cannibalising our tanks - Ronnie's and mine!
Not fair! :P

[Green Baron]

I am more inclined to think that beyond a fix size of the tank, the need to add extra lightings and carbon dioxide reduces. Why I have this though, just look at nature, no co2 injection and just natural sunlight, yet the plants are thriving. Doesn't that tells us something?

The difference is, in nature the colourful plants are either growing emersed or in shallow water where they get sufficient light and CO2.
Where depth is more than 1 meter, the plants are mainly green or brown and usually with low species diversity.

If this "Mother of all tanks" were to be scaped with many colorful and delicate plants like our regular aquaria then CO2 injection and artifical light will be a pre-requisit.

[FC]

With multiple flood lights going, how would dissipated heat be discharged and omigosh ! I can't imagine the size of an appropriate chiller going 24/7 (thermostat-controlled, no less) and I won't ask about the utility bills...

Good Point! Part of the heat can be removed by:
1) building a false ceiling where the light will be monuted.
2) ventilate the enclosed space in this false ceiling.
3) the only media that the lamp would enter the room/pool is by radiation.

He's scraping the algae off this huge tank: has scuba gear, fins, mask, and no swim trunks thinking the aquarium is closed and he's the only one there so he's not paying attention to the crowd that is growing opposite the front glass, pointing at him! Funny movie, recommended for 17 and over.

Ronnie,
Beware that you are not alone when you have the chance to dive in.
If there is big fishes, wear bite-proof trunk or "safety trunk" with steel cap.

I am more inclined to think that beyond a fix size of the tank, the need to add extra lightings and carbon dioxide reduces. Why I have this though, just look at nature, no co2 injection and just natural sunlight, yet the plants are thriving.

This pool, though huge, is still far far away from being a mini duplica of nature. There are many reasons for CO2 injection. Some of the important ones are:
1) improve the health of the plants
2) control the size and colour of the plant
3) algae control
4) ensure CO2 level is not depleted
5) improve rate of success

[wynx]

If this "Mother of all tanks" were to be scaped with many colorful and delicate plants like our regular aquaria then CO2 injection and artifical light will be a pre-requisit.

Hi Gan

I do agree with you. I am quite interested how the tank will turn out. I think the filtration would be a headache! No doubt about plants growth beyond 3ft of water.. I seen the amazon in pictures quite often so I should know. But I like the idea that nature take care of itself. Would be a major headache to maintain a tank like that.

[timebomb]

You guys are good.

As far as I know, Vic guessed correctly when he wrote that the lighting fixtures will be on some sort of platform. As for chillers, I don't think they are going to do anything to cool the tank. I believe a good circulation and sufficient shade will be good enough to keep the water cool. After all, they probably won't be growing any plants that are sensitive to warm temperatures. Such plants would probably be grown emersed on the sides of the tank. I don't know all the details but there's going to be a rock face.

Loh K L

[TanVincent]

Hi,

I think Potamogeton species will be able to thrive in there.

Cheers
Vincent

[RonWill]

Moderator's Note - July 16th 2004:
Due to unexpected turn of events, I've been instructed to removed all the relevant images. Whether all the posts in this thread will be retained, or otherwise, is at Kwek Leong's discretion.


Dear all,
Although this thread has undoubtly captured the imaginations and well wishes from fellow forumers and site guests, kindly refrain from further postings till further notice.

Apologies for the inconvenience.

Best regards,
Ronnie F.M. LEE
Moderator

[timebomb]

Moderator's Note - July 16th 2004:
Due to unexpected turn of events, I've been instructed to removed all the relevant images. Whether all the posts in this thread will be retained, or otherwise, is at Kwek Leong's discretion.

Thanks, Ronnie.

Dear all,

My deepest apologies. I had hoped that we will be able to see the pictures of the tank's progress but due to an unexpected turn of events which I'm not at liberties to disclose, all pictures related to the "Mother of all Planted Tanks" topic have been removed from this forum. It has always been a source of pride for me that I never had to remove or lock any posts in this forum so it is with great sadness that I'm doing this. I'm afraid we won't be showing any more pictures but there's a slight chance we may get to see them when the tank is fully completed.

Please take note that James feels very bad about the sudden turn of events too. He asked that I convey his apologies to all of you.

Loh K L