Hi everybody. My female orange australe has since stopped eating anything (dry or live food). I think she is dying. It got me worry as she has stopped eating anything for like more than a week.
Now, my female killie is nonchalent even when the brine shrimp swim right across her (she use to really enjoy them - gopple every single one even when her belly look like a balloon). She do not even look at the direction of the wriggling larvae or the tubifex stucking out of my tank's gravel.
Can anyone please tell me why? I don't think she suffer any external injury, she look fine, no white spots or rotting fins. If it is internal infection, does anybody know what kind of infection is this and if there is a kind of medication to treat such infection, where can I buy, what brand is the best?
What frighten me is that even my male orange australe seems to have a loss of appetite. He only take a few brine shrimp and like one or two blood worm. As for the flake foods, he just bite and then spit it out. Btw, is there such a thing as mouth or throat ucler or infection in killifish?
It is really making me so frustrated having to clear away all those 'LOTS' of uneaten food. I think I could have also stressed my killies by adding quite a lot of corydora to clear all those tubifex stucking out of the gravel and flake foods.
Think I am going mad.
I used to still be able to see killie eggs every time I change the water of my tank when I only have a pair of corys (panda).
I think it is in my "Singapore Kiasuness gene" ( "Kiasuness" = afraid to lose - afraid that a few corys will not complete the job) I am just too tired clearing the uneaten foods and too lazy to dig out tubifex from the gravel. I think if I has tried digging, it will stress my killies even more.
The female orange australe was a gift from one of the more experienced killie hobbyist. It took me some time to train her and the male to accept commercially prepared foods andeach others.
Does anybody know why? My killies become like this ?Is it because of tubifex or the blood worm? If it really is, I will go and buy more of them and boil them as a revenge for my killie!
I think I have spend quite a lot of money and time on this new found hobby and just when I think everything is going fine and waiting for frys to appear in my tank, I have this 'all-hell-break-loose' thingie. Perhaps I am just a loser at killie.
Sorry that I might have sound more complaining than asking for advices in my message. Actually, yes, I am complaining, angry and frustrated but also need helps from anyone experience who had the fishy misfortune of experiencing something similar, if not, worst situation than me. Thanks.
*phew* I'll go check on my killies. *sigh* dunno what to try feeding them now.
Gary
Gary,
It's just a wild guess but could it have something to do with the warm weather we're having recently? It's been real hot lately and as far as I know, the australes don't like it hot. Some do but not the fish
Don't worry if your fish aren't eating. Loss of appetite isn't a disease. It's a symptom that something's not right.
Loh K L
Gary, its alright I was in your shoes some time ago. Yes the unimaginable happens when your fish happen to lose their appetite. Here's a list of reasons that might explain why your fish is behaving this way.
1) Old age
2) Internal infection
3) Lack of space.
4) Bad water quality
Reason 1 can be the best possible answer since most killies waste away when they are very old. Thats when death creeps up on them and simply kills them. They lose appetite, get discoloured and their belly simply sinks in, scales start to lose the shine and look pale, and the worst of all they slowly start to lose their balance in the water.
Reason 2 can also be a probable answer. They may have gotten infected by eating dirty food. Tubifex worms are not always 100% clean. Depending on the source, if they were brown when fed to the fish, I would not use them. They should be blood red in colour and vigorously wriggling. Frozen bloodworm can be a killer as well. Frozen foods do not keep well for long periods. If the cubes look blackish, throw them away. Those are probably infested with bacteria and mould spores that are slowly growing even in the freezer. This happens when we accidentally break the foil around each cube. Trust me it happens easily.
Reason 3 is the least probable answer but space is a crucial element in ensuring that the fish are able to grow to their full potential. How big is your tank? It is not mentioned in the post. If it was a 1 foot tank, with all those corys it would be very crammed indeed.
Reason 4 is also a probable answer and occasionally important. If the water quality deteriorates without you knowing it, ammonia spikes can occur from the rotting uneaten food and dying tubifex in the gravel, that such conditions may and will kill your fish and others. It would be best to cut down on such foods, cut down on the number of feedings per day, do a good water change, clean the filter and reduce the number of corys if possible. That is, if the tank is a small one. A smaller tank has a smaller margin of error when water quality is concerned. Without regular water changes and adequate filtration, the fish will slowly succumb to ammonia poisoning.
Fish.. Simply Irresistable
Back to Killies... slowly.
Yup I forgot, as KL has mentioned, at warmer temperatures the fish seem to get stressed easily. If your tank is pretty warm (temp around 28 to 29 degC), please rig up a cooling fan for the tank. DIY fans work well for this purpose.
They usually get less active when the weather gets warm.
Fish.. Simply Irresistable
Back to Killies... slowly.
My advice...
Do more water changes! And move the AUS to tank about 24-25°C if you can. Put the them in a tub on the cold floor if you have to (keep it coverred).
Now, to deal with the internal infection. You have 2 choices: flubendazole (damn near impossible to get to disolve in water) or metronidazole (also called Flagyl or Protostat... ask your pharmacist for the cheapest generic, tell him or her that it is for you fish).
The dose for the Flagyl is 5 mg/L. You add 5 mg/L each day for three days after doing a 30-50% water change. On the 4th day you just do the water change and keep doing the water changes. Do not feed during this time.
After treatment begin feeding.
Your fish are currently stressed out and so they have most likely picked up an infection. If you can get hold of it, forzen cyclops or daphnia would make for a better diet than brine shrimps during the hot days.
Best of luck!
Gary,
Since Kwek Leong and Jian Yang have pretty much covered the possiblilities, I won't provide any answers but only more questions, just so we better understand what else may have gone wrong.
I am a heavy-handed feeder and sometimes do have excess live food on the tank's bare bottom but when there's substrate, I'd use a floating worm-feeder and feed less. What's the point of feeding as much as you're doing now? Adding more corys isn't the solution but reviewing your fish-husbandry will help avoid similar problems later.Originally Posted by gary35111
Sudden increase in bioload isn't a good thing as it'll stress both established fishes as well as the new additions. For those new corys, you didn't mention anything about quarantine either. Next time, do remember that parasite, pests and diseases can be carelessly introduced into an established tank. Starting medication treatments, without understanding the cause, can lead to more problems.
For now, I suggest 30% water change and put the fishes on fasting for 2 days.
I'm back & keeping 'em fingers wet,
Ronnie Lee
My tank is 40 cm by 30 cm maybe slightly bigger. Too tired to measure. It is spacious with plants. I think there was far too much space during the good-old-days when there were just only four fishes inside (a pair of orange australe and two panda corys).
The panda corys used to just swim together and mind their own business resting at far corner of the tank while my killies smooched at the other end where there was more lavish plant.
It is weird for I never overfeed them and the water is always clear. I have filter and add JBJ bio nitrifier.Well, it's label says 'safe for fishes and aquatic weeds and plants'
Actually, it used to be just twice per week initially when I got my female killie (actually it was from Mr Low). I was trying to train them to eat flake foods and tablets then. Like starve then feed them. It actually work. They took the flake and tablets. Occasionally, I do treat them to brine shrimp and blood worm and *sigh* tubifex worm
I think it is the tubifex. They hide inside my gravel. It is all my fault. I thought killie breed better when fed live foods, that they "relish" live foods and especially blood worm or something like that can't remember which web-site I read from. Think I threw half the 30 cent worms into my tank, thinking that the killies, if not corys, will clear them up.
It is scary just now when I changed 70 % of my aquarium water. The plant which my killies usually hide (make love or something) had tubifex!!!
It is too much work manually removing the tubifex. I only removed those in the plants. Quite a few are still in the gravel. I don't know what happen to my panda corys. Usually, I only change 25% or 40% of my aquarium water without molesting the plants. I think I just raped the plants in my aquarium. My panda corys are like in automatism, they are like floating in limbo and can't seems to lie flat still. The albinos are doing fine though and are now helping me clear more tubifex.
Think there should be less chlorine in my tank now. I'll put my pair of killies back.
It is 1:50 AM Singapore time. My hair's dry now. *yawn* So tired. Nite' nite and sweetdream to all.
Gary
30 cents worth of tubifex worms is alot. Throwing in half only exacerbates the problem. The fish usually gorge themselves silly but not to the extent that they try to gobble up every single worm there is.
Killies do relish and actually do better on live foods. When they're clean that is. A fouling ball of tubifex worm can send your fish straight to fishy heaven, as will a rapidly blackening cube of frozen bloodworm. In short, live foods are good but not foolproof. Everyone takes a risk when they feed their fishes with live foods, but thats a risk people should be willing to take, especially if they want the best nutrition for their fish.
As for the bio-nutrifier thing, I'm not sure what its made of but I don't think I'd use it in the future if I was you. Most of these products cannot take the place of efficient and adequate filtration.
I'm not sure why but your post is lacking in many other details such as pH and other water parameters. For all you might know the fish might not like the current water conditions.
With regards to the tank size you mentioned, that's roughly a 1.5 foot tank. That's pretty small if you have 6 albino corys + 2 panda corys and the pair of AUS. Corydoras are natural egg predators therefore you can't quite blame them for eating any eggs if they do come across any. You should have collected the eggs and raised the fry if any back when you had the chance to.
Nevertheless, good luck on getting your AUS back in health.
Fish.. Simply Irresistable
Back to Killies... slowly.
Gary, Just in case anything happen. You want to try breeding some annual Notho Orthonotus? As it is annual, collecting egg and breeding them is a must. As they grow fast and die fast.
Thanks for all the infos. I took off today to just thoroughly clean my 1.5 ft tank, bought new plants, fish medication burn a hole in my pocket and have just "euthanasiaed" my albino corys with sub-zero water (my other bigger tank is already full of other ornamental fishes, will be too crowded if I add them). Hope they did not feel too much pain.
Perhaps it is time I be serious in taking care and breeding killie and not just take them as purely ornamental fish. Will be more conscientious, stay with them the next time in feeding life-foods - that is, if my only female orange australe survive. Now she is like just floating and gasping around the tank. My male is okay though.
I do not usually measure the PH of my tank. It is the same thing with my other 3 ft tank - change water, add the flora plus and bio nitrifier once a week. Btw, my other female killies in the bigger tank with other fishes are doing fine. I never feed any live food to my fishes in that tank.
Gary
The albino corys should not have been subjected to euthanasia. They are by far one of the best scavengers out there. You would have been much better off giving them away to people who need them.
Stop using the bio-nutrifier thingy and look more into the water chemistry. Wrong water values like high nitrates or an ammonia spike can send your fish into major stress, and probably death.
Killies are by far one of the least toughest ornamental fishes around. They occasionally need special care and dedication to ensure that they live well and hopefully spawn and have fertile offspring.
All this sacrifice is pretty worth it since the fishes usually reward you with splendid mating dances, nice finnage and pretty colours.
Fish.. Simply Irresistable
Back to Killies... slowly.
I agree with YangYang, you could have given that to me. I have a very dirty tank needed cleaning service from your albino cory. I do not want to do complete clean up for the tank as the Riv. seems quite happy with it.
Hi Jianyang and keehoe! I have been too busy this few days to check out the forum. Had I known that keehoe you are from Clementi, I would have meet you up and given you the Corys! I had a few more in my bigger tank but have all sold or given away to my relative and friends.
To think of it, I have spend too much on this hobby. Having to maintain two tanks with so many different fishes is too much - at least for me. It used to be still okay before I got myself into killies.
I decided to really just concentrate on killies and cleared away all the other tetras, guppies, badis badis and shrimps together with my 3 feets tank. Now, I only have a trio of killies, a pair of corys and small otto in my 2 feets tank.
Btw, I just purchased a male "nssuka" from LFS at Bukit Merah for my two nssuka females. Decided to try with them as they are known to be less discriminating to flakes and tablets. The females even eat spirulina algae tablets when they were in the community tank! They can be vegetarians too!
Well, the shopkeeper said it is a "nssuka" when I asked him. Now, I have my doubt whether it is really a nssuka for its body is blue with lots of beautiful red lines and spots. Look more like a Lokaja to me.
Anybody experience with nssuka? Is 'blue' body normal for a male nssuka?
Thanks
Gary
First of all, Gary, the correct latin name is Fundulopanchax gardneri N'sukka. Always take what fish shop owners say with a pinch of salt
The N'sukka's don't have red on their bodies. So yours aren't them. But from your description alone, it would be impossible for us to identify them.
Loh K L
N'sukka Mmmmm the species that i have phobia with, even since i saw the one that Ron keep. I estimated it is 3.5 inches. Is all Gardneri capable of growing to this size? Are they fierce?
Gary, good to know that you have so many relative that are willing to accept fish. I still remember few weeks ago i was begging my friend to keep my over spawning albino guppy. One solution for breeding killie without live food is to use frozen food. Frozen bloodworm seems universally accepted by all fishes that i have. Even the SAE. So far, tubiflex and frozen bloodworm is easiest. But for fry, you have no choice.
In future, try to buy killie from reputable LFS. Else better off buying from breeder/ hobbist. I don't mind giving you some Notho. Orthonotus MZM 04-3 egg to start off. Just that recently my pair was not productive at all. Should still have some egg though. The fish is coded, meaning a lot of people have spend tons of their time trying to NOT crossing the species. You should do the same. Believe me the fish is not ugly at all. Just that photo can't capture the blue shinny coating of the fish. You have to know how to keep them to make them beautiful. (Which i just learned recently from Ron/ Kho)
Regarding the Albino cory, thanks anyway. I just bought something better...... 2 1-inch size apple snail
Try safeup money, get a Nikon digital camera. (or any other with good macro feature). So that you can post it to the forum for us to understand your problem better. If you refer to my Hydra posting sometime back. I would have lost even more fish if i have not post the photo and identify my issue.
Regarding the number of species that you have at home. I suggest you choose two species and keep them well. The rest just put all in a community tank and enjoy their beauty. Well, that should serve its purpose until you got really crazy about killie.
I for one have about 30 species in my wish list now. Will try to cut it down to 5.
Spirulina ALgae tablet.... Is that from Sera? Quite expensive right? $18?
KeeHoe.
Here's a pic of a pair of GAR N'Sukka at Ron's place.
While the N'sukka males should be either greenish or bluish on the flanks, the population from Lafia is rather similar as well. A little difficult to know the fish's population just be looking at it.
If possible take a picture of the fish you bought.
Fish.. Simply Irresistable
Back to Killies... slowly.
Hi all. The Spirulina Algae Tablets I bought is not that expensive. It is only $4.80. The brand is 'Nutrafin Max'. The tablets come in a small container.
Keehoe said," Gary, good to know that you have so many relative that are willing to accept fish."
Not really. They only accept the Corys, badis badis and a few of the more beautiful guppies and they are not accepting it for themselves. I don't think they are really going to keep them as pets per se. It is more like "why not, since it is free" and for their little family members to play with.
I think my friend's grandfather fed all of my tetras to his priced arowana. That is what she told me
Btw, do gardneri really have the potential to grow that big? 3.5 inches?That means I might have to buy a bigger tank in future should they lived and grow 'long' enough.oops! Oh! I just sold away my 3 fts tank to a relative for $25!
I have some problem with the network. I cannot view the picture of Nsukka which Jianyang posted.
And I have a question. When we talk about hybrid or crossing, are we only just refering to crossing between an australe with a gardneri? To the best of my knowledge, both Lokaja and Nsukka are gardneri. I think my male could be a Lokaja. And if it really is and mated with my Nsukka females, will their offsprings be considered as a hybrid?
Gary.
Early experiments by Col. Scheel and others proved that truly different species could produce viable offspring, but usually with poor fertility. Also some fish that looked identical and were identified as a single species, did not even have the same number of chromosomes, hence could only produce infertile "mules." They were from two different locations.
Fp. gardneri (GAR) from different collection locations have thus been kept pure, and genes not mixed. One former GAR is now known to be a different species, entirely (Fp. nigerianus). If you cross GAR from different collection locations, they may be perfectly viable and do no harm. Just keep the offspring as "aquarium strain" and never, ever, use one of the original locations to identify them after that. They may carry subtle tendencies to infertility, so we don't want to lose our N'sukkas and Akures, like we did some lovely species in the '70s.
Wright
01 760 872-3995
805 Valley West Circle
Bishop, CA 93514 USA
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