Sorry for my long disappearance

[stormhawk]

Ron, try http://killi.wire-online.com

You should be able to view the whole page.

[timebomb]

Kwek Leong, which Saturday night are we referring to?

It's tomorrow (8th of October) night, Ronnie. You don't need an invitation to pop over my place, do you?

I just called them on the phone. Kee Hoe and Esther will be coming at 7 pm for dinner. You should come and look at my new aquascape for my big tank where I keep only the Austrolebias nigripinnis. I also have a real chiller for my cube tank. It's a used set. Someone gave it to me for free. I thought about asking you to pass me all your Chromaphyosemion splendopleure 'Moliwe' but was too shy to speak up But seriously, what these fish need is a tank all of their own. The best way to maintain this species is to let them breed naturally in a heavily planted tank. I'm keeping some aquarium strain Chromaphyosemion bitaeniatum in such a tank and they have been producing babies but I would gladly dump the whole lot for your C. splendopleure.

You think about it, okay?

Loh K L

[Kiccoro]

Okay, jokes aside, besides the causes Kenny and Wright mentioned, there's also inbreeding. Last week, almost all my Chocolate australes were decimated, not long after I put up the picture of the tank. I have no idea what killed them but it was swift and merciless. The few australes that survived the mass extermination were those I bred myself from an earlier batch. All those that came as eggs from Esther died within the day that I noticed they weren't coming for the tubifex worms.

KL, that sounds pretty similar to what happened to my fishes. Death was swift and a tankful can go in a single day. Whuntley, I don't think there is a problem with my water supply as I have other tanks (guppies/platys/betta etc) and they are all doing perfectly fine. Does inbreeding cause such swift deaths at almost the same time for all the fishes? So sad..... so traumatic...

[stormhawk]

It's not a matter of inbreeding actually.

Sometimes there's a particular nasty parasite in the water and it afflicts all of the australes at one shot. Mass die-offs do happen every now and then, and it still boggles me as to why it occurs. Perhaps others may not experience this but I believe several of the members here have had mass die-offs occur on them. So yeah, you're not alone.

Esther, mind telling me what you feed to your fish, in particular to the australes? The key might be in their diet. A diet that is rich in worm foods may not be too good for them in the long run. I supplement my fishes diet with adult BS or BBS every now and then. Helps to keep them healthier somewhat since a varied diet is the best diet.

And if you could, do a measurement of the water parameters. Certain values in the water quality might be detrimental to some fish and good for others.

[hobbit6003]

[quote="Kiccoro"]

KL, that sounds pretty similar to what happened to my fishes. Death was swift and a tankful can go in a single day. Whuntley, I don't think there is a problem with my water supply as I have other tanks (guppies/platys/betta etc) and they are all doing perfectly fine. Does inbreeding cause such swift deaths at almost the same time for all the fishes? So sad..... so traumatic... ]

Hi Esther,

With a whole group of fish that died en masse within a day, I'd say that it's got be chemical in nature, or that the pathogen is of a potent virulence and is highly contagious, which unfortunately, went undetected.

The possibility of inbreeding in such cases, is highly remote, unless the genetic defect somewhat program each and every fish of the same heritage to be born and die on the same day. Not even a chance in million would this have happened.

Inbreeding can affect the fishes in many ways. It may cause fish to have obvious physical defect, and in some instances, make them incapable of surviving beyond the initial moment upon hatching.

The other effects would have been to make them susceptible to certain diseases, as their natural immunity is weakened, or that they are incapable or insufficient in the department of acquired immunity.

KL,

About the australes being immuned to all parasites, now, that's a statement I'd not dare to make!

Parasites is a word that is being used to encompass many genera and even classes of organisms. Thus, the possibility to your australes being immuned to them all, would be be as good as the inbreeding causing the fishes to be born and die on the same day.

Yes, fishes can acquire immunity towards certain pathogens after being exposed to them once or twice and survived. However, a fish which may have acquired immunity to a certain strain of a pathogen, may not have immunity towards other starins of the same pathogen.

Furthermore, acquired immunity may also lose 'memory' over a period of time. This means that long after the fish has acquired certain immunity against a pathogen, and thereafter have not renewed its encounter with it, may lose this immunity after a while, such that it may succumb if it is once again exposed to the same pathogen.

Cheers,

Kenny

[timebomb]

You're right, Kenny but I didn't say australes are immune to parasites. I'll be a darned fool to make such a statement What I believe is that the australes are immune to the velvet parasite, the one we know as Oodinium. I have many experiences where I have A. australes and Nothos in the same tank and all of the latter is infected with velvet but nothing, not a single speck of gold dust, appears on the bodies of the former.

As far as I know, you can keep fish for years but if you don't keep Nothos or Bettas, you will never see Velvet in your tanks. All other fish seem to have a natural immunity towards this parasite.

I suspected inbreeding to be the cause because some of my australes managed to survive and they were those I bred on my own from an earlier batch. Those that were wiped out came as eggs from Esther. As you suggested, inbreeding could lead to a weakening of natural immunity and I think that's what killed our (Esther's and mine) australes. Inbreeding, by itself, can't kill but a lack of immunity against a particular pathogen can.

Loh K L