The Thousand Dollar Shrimp

[Lake Aquarium and Trading]

I have keep crs for a year and using IOS tank. All my crs are imported from hongkong, i handcarry them back when i was overseas in hongkong. I am importing 10 of those expensive hinomaru for my own breeding. Hope i can breed them and sell them at $10 a piece.

[Scott_sg]

I am in the category of finding it absurd... As they say a fool and his or her money... What is the actual (real) value of a $1000 dollar shrimp? Is the high price to breed more of them and make more money? Or do they bring you luck and help you get - hmmm a date? Or will they balance little balls and choose the world cup winners? Personally the only person they seem to bring luck to is the person selling them at those prices..
If I pay that sort of money I would hope it is a damn smart shrimp, maybe clean the house and fix my computer while I am out.. Otherwise I just don't get it, it is on a totally different wavelength to me... I see CRS and thought Cold Rolled Steel, so I am on a completely different page.

Scott.

PS. I think shrimps are nice for their biological interest, otherwise they go well with fried rice.

PSS. I am selling a N.rachovii nicuadala male $1500 US I think it has special markings that are guaranteed to get you l&^d. Contact me off list if you have the cash ready. I have graded it a AAA suckermakemerichkillie.

PSSS. When everyone has finished with the shrimp craze leave your tanks and gear under my block. Thanks. I will self collect.

[stormhawk]

Scott, that's a less than enthusiastic reply but hey, I kinda find the price absurd too.

[keehoe]

Mmmmmm looks like this tread attracted a lot of new comer. Care to introduce yourself?

Scotts, i don't deny that i had some idea of making some bucks from the breeding shrimp when they got pregnant. But the first thing that came to my mind is a picture of planted tank with big group of CRS of different size and colour. The cost of having so many does worry me and when i saw that they are carrying eggs. A big relief.

I even attempt to breed yamato knowing that they are difficult and don't demand good price.

Besides, i am also breeding ramshorn. Nothing fantastic. But something useful for hatching killie. Besides, it is also Crystal Red in colour. Looks good together with CRS. (Crystal Red Snail?)

We all do things with different goal in mind from project to project.

I am still keeping AUS (Aquarium strain) for only one purpose and i think it is important enough that i researve much of my tanks space for it.

Just to pour some cold water over the burning issue. The lifespan of CRS is short. About 12 to 15months and i don't think they breed before the age of 6months of below. So for those who spend 4000 for a shrimp. You 4000 is paid for enjoying its beauty for a duration of a year or less. Unless your intension is to breed them.

[Scott_sg]

Actually I have nothing against shrimps, I do like them. But I don't like the whole trend thing. I think it is bad for the hobby in general, I think it also takes away from the whole reason for keeping aquariums.

How many people that bought Louhan are still keeping fish or went on to keep other cichlids even. If anything most I think felt cheated. I know one of my neighbours - just average singaporeans spent a fortune of borrowed money at the end of the Louhan craze in an effort to make some money.. He was out of work two young kids and basically got conned, I doubt he will ever buy fish again.

I saw the same thing with fighting fish before that, suddenly a $5 fish was $45 and every shop was selling them and they had special names. How many of those people are keeping fish now..

Just recently it was the marine craze, I used to be able to get common clowns at $2 suddenly they were $10+ and all the shops had a marine section. I don't think many of those people are keeping any fish now, but at least it put lots of good second hand chillers on the market.

So I really don't think it helps the hobby in the long wrong and I doubt it really helps any appreciation of nature. Most people will just end up feeling ripped off and cheated, and some will make a lot of money selling a $2 shrimp at $2000. Since we all know if you wait 18 months the price will be back to normal.

And anyway if the prices are that high already it is too late to get in now, better to buy fighting fish or something now for $2 and sell them next year at $20 if you have the patience to wait.

I also find it amusing, like who decides that one is better than another? Who actually decides what grades and so on. It all really seems like another scam to me.

So I think it is good to keep shrimps or anything, but I think too many people will just get suckered and it will put more people off any aquarium keeping. That is why I am negative about it.

Scott.

[Green Baron]

Scott,
I think many of us find the price absurd but it is a free market and the price is determined by demand, supply and fad

Remember those time when Riccia, Taiwan Moss and Mini Riccia cost more than $50 for a small patch ? Now people are dumping Riccia, giving away Taiwan moss and LFS selling Mini Riccia on drift wood for <$20 !

Wait for another year and we may see CRS selling at $2 piece !

[timebomb]

The price is absurd, of course and the owner of the shrimp knows that too. It's clever marketing. He knows no one will pay a thousand dollars for that shrimp but by putting it up for sale at such a ridiculous price, he knows many will be convinced to pay $50 or even a hundred for his other shrimps. He also knows that a thousand dollar shrimp will generate market interest and people will talk about it. They say there's no such thing as bad publicity. Any publicity is good publicity. The fact that we're talking about this thousand dollar shrimp serves him well.

I have no problems with anyone who wants to sell his shrimp for a thousand dollars or his Killie for USD $1500. Hey, it's a free market after all. Like Scott said, " A fool and his money are soon parted". There's little point in trying to protect the fool because one way or another, he's going to throw away his money.

Loh K L

[keehoe]

Just to express my opinion on a few things that Scott brought up.

1) Those who spend a fortune on it and hoping to earn money for it can wait for the new casino to open. It they choose to gamble their money away, it is hard to stop them from doing in. Singapore government had done so much but there is only that much that "outsider" can do. It really depends on the individual themself. All of us are outsider as far as his decision is concern.

2) If you neighbour had not spend the money on LouHan. He would have dump that onto casino. Keeping/ Breeding live creature is high risk busisness.
What interested him as to keep louhan as busisness investment. Not as hoppy. They are those who wouldn't be hobbiest in the first place.

3) Who decide which shrimp worth more than others: The market or the one with deepest pocket who willing to spend on it. In this case, the japanese.

4) It really doesn't affect the hobbiest population except those who love the shrimp will have to spend more to get it.

For me, i prefer class C or class B for their evenly spread marking. Thats if i am able to breed them.

If i am selling 20 dollars for a confirm pair? Would anyone be interested? Maybe not for others but for those that are able to breed them, it would be a gateway to have big colony of them running around your planted tank. Isn't that wonderful?

[timebomb]

If i am selling 20 dollars for a confirm pair? Would anyone be interested?

Only $20 for a confirmed pair? That's too cheap, Kee Hoe. How are you going to get rich by selling at such low prices

Let's try a bit of LuoHan styled marketing.

First, give me the pair for free. But I will tell everyone on the forum that I bought them from you for $2000 a pair. And then, I will go on to say that the shrimps are worth every cent I paid for it because I've already done a lot of research on the prices and even gone to Japan itself to look for cheaper Crystal Reds but couldn't find any.

After that, we get someone, maybe Scott to say that he noticed there were some numbers on the bodies of the Crystal Reds. He tried his luck betting on the numbers and struck first prize. And then we get Selena to say that ever since her Crystal Reds died, she had been getting nightmares. She consulted a fortune teller who told her that the only way to cure her nightmares was to get herself more Crystal Reds. Selena did that and ever since then, all her dreams were "wet and juicy ones"

Later, we get another forum user, maybe Ronnie, to say that he managed to sell off his Crystal Reds which be bought for $200 a piece for $1000 each.

To further ram up the market, we also tell the forum that some people actually broke into our houses to steal our shrimps. There were gold and diamonds lying around our houses but the thieves chose to take only the shrimps and nothing else. There were so many burglaries, in fact, that all of us who were keeping Crystal Reds installed burglar alarms in our houses.

And we are not going to use boring names like Grade A or B for our shrimps. We will give them names like Golden Monkey Shrimps or Starry Starry Night Shrimps.

That's how you sell a shrimp, LuoHan style

Loh K L

[silane]

Hi everyone,

okok, I need to intro myself.

As you can see, I have signed up long time ago and didn't participate in killies as I dont keep them, but once in a while come in to look for moss info.

I was alerted by Robert that there is $1000 CRS picture to see, I was anxious to see the $1000 CRS, but was disappointed upon seeing it.

I am keeping CRS and crazy about them and have been playing with expensive high grade Japan CRS, can't get good quality ones here, or the price is toooo high as this thread says. However, local price of C, B, A and low S, is cheaper than anywhere else on earth.

I agree with some of you guys had said, it is merely a marketing tactics, to label a $400 as $1000, and to sell a hinomaru at $3000, saw the picture of the hinomaru in another forum, my estimation, it worth at most $1000, moreover it is a 3 band whites type, maybe a ricj newbies will be willing to pay that shrimp at $1000, I know, with all these marking and bands, it wont rouse interest of killies keepers here. I guess the shop does not intend to sell these shrimps but using it as marketing tools.

CRS is like koi, you can find feeder carp fish at a couple dollars per pack and can find that cost a few thousand dollars per koi.

CRS will not be going to be a craze like LH, apparently, the marketing stragey appears to be the same. It is not a shrimps for everyone, definately not a hobby for every uncles or aunties to pick up, nor they will multiple in dirty drains.

The price of low grade CRS will come down and has come down, look at those indo bred CRS, they price is like $5 and grade C CRS among hobbyists, they are selling at $4, oppose to 1.5 years ago, today's C grade was marked at grade B 1.5 years ago and was selling at $12 !! However, on the other end the price for extremely high grade and there is no trend of slowing down for newly developed partterns, but that is in Japan. In Singapore, and perpahs else where beside Japan, HK and Taiwan, a $100 (with justifiable pattern, not rip off over priced) will be very difficult to be sold off.

And we are not going to use boring names like Grade A or B for our shrimps. We will give them names like Golden Monkey Shrimps or Starry Starry Night Shrimps.

You are quite right, CRS has gone beyond grading as A, B C, S, SS, SSS ... can no longer represent them, their patten has gone beyond bars on the body. In Japan, you can wordings like White tail, moustache, sun flag, no entry, double sun flag, white body, eyes, V bands, tiger tooths ..... to represent patterns on various part of the body. And each of the marking/pattern, depending in scarcity can cost quite a bit of $$.


Ken

[Lim]

Nice crs..

Love the pattern..

[Lim]

First of all, one has to recognise that not all shrimps are the same, just like fishes, they are different, the primary difference is requirement is temperature and water quality, not so much on PH and other water parameters. Robust species can do well at around 29C or lower.


Common Species
Sensitive = Bee, Tiger, CRS, Diamond
More Robust = Red nose, yamato, cherry

Tank Size
A larger tank of 2 feet is more desirable for sensitive species, especially when you are using cooling fans. Cooling fans evaporates water, adding of raw water will alert water parameters and may cause problem to sensitive species. A larger tank evaporate less water, unless you use an over sized fan. For less sensitive species, a 1 feet tank will work.

Water Parameters
The only water parameter you have to take note is PH beside themperature, keep them between 6.5 to 7.2, it should all shrimps mentioned above. For sensitive speices, keep the temperature low, best around 25C, in a better conditioned tank, 27C may be ok. Robust species can do well at around 29C.

Tank Mates
Best tank mate is snails. They dont chase shrimplets, they eat algaes. Ramhorn snail is my favorite, they are alway hunger for brown alage. Fishes as tankmate is more suitable for larger tanks and thick plant and hideout. Not all fishes are suitable, check the forum for what fishes goes well with shrimps.

Filteration
Filter is a need for a shrimp tank. Personally, I prefer canister filter, with a fine prefilter added to work as mechnical filter, the canister filter just need to maintain once in a while. A good filter is one that can provide large biomedium for benificial bacteria to grow. Disturbance to the filter biomedium should be avoided in all cases.

Gravel
Gravel is not a must, however, a shrimp tank cannot be bare tank. It can be either bare bottom, goes with soil based substrate (adasoil) or neutral gravel (lapis, ....). Gravel that increase PH should not be used, if one do not want to spent extra time and acessories to lower the PH.

Plant, Moss, diftwood, rock
Shrimps need hiding place after molting, a good shrimp tank provides some hiding space from diftwood. Rock is good to have in a shrimp tank, check out how it affect water parameters before using them. Tying moss on driftwood is the easiest way to to start a shrimp tank. However, moss is not a must for shrimp tank, using plants will work as well. Remember to soak newly bought plant a few days before putting into tank, there are cases where newly bought plant causes shrimps to die, supposely, the residual pesticide is the cause.

food
These shrimps have very little demand for type of food, can feed them with sinking fish food, boiled vegetable and specialised shrimp food. Feed sparely

Hope you successfully breed this CRS. And you can own a private house, HDB, fish shop.

Don't have to work for the rest of your life, also no need to work in the mid-night to sell thing..

I have keep crs for a year and using IOS tank. All my crs are imported from hongkong, i handcarry them back when i was overseas in hongkong. I am importing 10 of those expensive hinomaru for my own breeding. Hope i can breed them and sell them at $10 a piece.

[Lake Aquarium and Trading]

Wait for another year and we may see CRS selling at $2 piece !

You don't have to wait a year, some of the hobbyists are selling them for $2. I intend to breed them and give them away free so to crush the craze. Hope to make the shrimps more affordable for the normal hobbyist. Those fellow thinking of breeding crs can make a quick buck to buy landed property is wishful thinking. One word to describe "SIOW" means crazy!!

[cwtan12]

Actually I have nothing against shrimps, I do like them. But I don't like the whole trend thing. I think it is bad for the hobby in general, I think it also takes away from the whole reason for keeping aquariums.

How many people that bought Louhan are still keeping fish or went on to keep other cichlids even. If anything most I think felt cheated. I know one of my neighbours - just average singaporeans spent a fortune of borrowed money at the end of the Louhan craze in an effort to make some money.. He was out of work two young kids and basically got conned, I doubt he will ever buy fish again.

I saw the same thing with fighting fish before that, suddenly a $5 fish was $45 and every shop was selling them and they had special names. How many of those people are keeping fish now..

Just recently it was the marine craze, I used to be able to get common clowns at $2 suddenly they were $10+ and all the shops had a marine section. I don't think many of those people are keeping any fish now, but at least it put lots of good second hand chillers on the market.

So I really don't think it helps the hobby in the long wrong and I doubt it really helps any appreciation of nature. Most people will just end up feeling ripped off and cheated, and some will make a lot of money selling a $2 shrimp at $2000. Since we all know if you wait 18 months the price will be back to normal.

And anyway if the prices are that high already it is too late to get in now, better to buy fighting fish or something now for $2 and sell them next year at $20 if you have the patience to wait.

I also find it amusing, like who decides that one is better than another? Who actually decides what grades and so on. It all really seems like another scam to me.

So I think it is good to keep shrimps or anything, but I think too many people will just get suckered and it will put more people off any aquarium keeping. That is why I am negative about it.

Scott.

I dont think anything wrong with the trend thing at all.. If you think it's too expensive to part with your money when the trend is at it's peak, then wait till the trend is gone and keep. If not, then find other interests. I believe most hobbyists buy willingly without being forced.

LH? I never like LH... so whether before, craze time and now, I've never bought 1. Aro? I like red and xback a lot but I prefer to keep many at a time. Cant afford... So never kept. You neighbour need to treat it as a lesson learnt. If he didnt learn this lesson, who know he might be conned more in the future that will make him jump from his flat. PPl get cheated or lose unneccessary $ because they are greedy.

Fighting fish? Should be called betta splendens or betta. Those show bettas need tens of years of dedication and hardwork to create and breed true from you so called fighting fish. To reply your question of how many of us are still keeping it now, in Singapore, should be more than killies hobbyists. Whether still in the trend or not, I am still keeping..and in terms of thousands. $45? I dont think you can get any top quality HMs or CTs at this kind of price even though the craze is over. I am still buying bettas that cost 3 digits each. Not that I am rich.. it' just the amount of $$ I am willing to part for my hobby.

I am going to keep CRS soon, not because I can sell or it's in the trend but because I think their beauty is worth the amount of money I am going to pay for.

Killies? I don't want to say anything. I don't know how to appreciate them at all but I believe you all have a reason to keep it and I respect that.

If you are into a hobby, it doesnt mean others' hobbies are not good. Most ppl who doesn't keep fish at all will think fish keeping is a waste of time. Since you are into fish hobby, I dont understand why there are so many hobbyists in this forum still dont respect others' hobbies

[cwtan12]

Who's selling 1 high grade CRS for $2 each? I will buy all!!

[keehoe]

If i am selling 20 dollars for a confirm pair? Would anyone be interested?

Only $20 for a confirmed pair? That's too cheap, Kee Hoe. How are you going to get rich by selling at such low prices

Let's try a bit of LuoHan styled marketing.

First, give me the pair for free. But I will tell everyone on the forum that I bought them from you for $2000 a pair. And then, I will go on to say that the shrimps are worth every cent I paid for it because I've already done a lot of research on the prices and even gone to Japan itself to look for cheaper Crystal Reds but couldn't find any.

After that, we get someone, maybe Scott to say that he noticed there were some numbers on the bodies of the Crystal Reds. He tried his luck betting on the numbers and struck first prize. And then we get Selena to say that ever since her Crystal Reds died, she had been getting nightmares. She consulted a fortune teller who told her that the only way to cure her nightmares was to get herself more Crystal Reds. Selena did that and ever since then, all her dreams were "wet and juicy ones"

Later, we get another forum user, maybe Ronnie, to say that he managed to sell off his Crystal Reds which be bought for $200 a piece for $1000 each.

To further ram up the market, we also tell the forum that some people actually broke into our houses to steal our shrimps. There were gold and diamonds lying around our houses but the thieves chose to take only the shrimps and nothing else. There were so many burglaries, in fact, that all of us who were keeping Crystal Reds installed burglar alarms in our houses.

And we are not going to use boring names like Grade A or B for our shrimps. We will give them names like Golden Monkey Shrimps or Starry Starry Night Shrimps.

That's how you sell a shrimp, LuoHan style

Loh K L

Loh, I think this is not a good place to discuss this kind of things.
We should talk about this over some coffee. Perhaps some beer.
Maybe if one of us had share in LFS. Because keeping these shrimp alive is not easier compare to Diapteron. So don't think many of our LFS is able to keep them in top form for longer than 2 weeks. Perhaps, keeping them alive is already a big challenge to them. The conversation should carryout in local HockKian language. etc .............. Whatever that strategy is, don't belongs to this part of the forum. Perhaps should move that part of conversation to "chillout conner"? But it is a entertaining reading.

Did some checking realise that those that i bought are lower A grade.
7 dollars for a lower "A" grade is consider very cheap internationally.

Didn't intend to make rich selling shrimp nor had the intension to trash the market price. Just to share some with my dearest friends and recover some cost of "investing" in that. When you have spare CRS, they make good companion to killie fish. I keeping my CRS together with Diapteron.
I think they looks good together.

[silane]

Did some checking realise that those that i bought are lower A grade.
7 dollars for a lower "A" grade is consider very cheap internationally..

hmm.. it is more like B to me. It only has 3 white bands. $7 for that standard of B is reasonable. But again, grades move, yestersdays' A maybe todays' B.

A noob killies question, what is the temperature requirement of Diapteron?

[Lake Aquarium and Trading]

bro, silane
Grading is subjective, it may B grade to you but it may look A grade to somebody. One man's meat is another's poison. As long as the person likes the shrimps, he may call it whatever grade he deem fits.

[Scott_sg]

Names? It's kinda funny since everyone is suddenly so passionate about shrimps.. By definition I doubt if you are following a trend that you are participating in a hobby, since that is something you would continue to do no matter what other people are doing or thinking, not just for 12 or 18 months.

I am going to keep CRS soon, not because I can sell or it's in the trend but because I think their beauty is worth the amount of money I am going to pay for.

If you think they are so beautiful why only now decide to keep them? As far as I know they have been around much longer than all of us.

I guess by putting a value on how good looking things are, it must mean I am quite expensive due to my natural good looks

I don't think Killifish keepers have anything against other hobbies, and it would be rare to find a killikeeper that has no other types of fish. I have a soft spot for labyrinth fish and have a few nice species around, and have been breeding most of them on and off for 20 years now. But then I like them for the natural beauty or biological interest - which is still a type of beauty.

I think that is where most Killifish keepers tend to differ in mindset from
the mainstream, in that they tend to appreciate the natural beauty of the animals rather than a subjectively judged beauty. Some of the fish I keep and have kept, most would think of as downright ugly, but to me they are still special for their own unique reasons. I think most Killikeepers are the sort that watch discovery channel and given the chance would probably have a net in hand hunting through jungle streams.

I am sure the shrimps in a couple of my tanks would rate a triple ZZZ, but that is fine with me as they are interesting no matter what name or grade it has. The big difference is I was keeping both marine and freshwater shrimps and crustaceans from the mid 80's on and off depending on work, study, family and other commitments. And wading through banks of ribbon grass as a teenager is not a great way to impress girls...That is the difference between a hobby and a trend.

Scott.

[stormhawk]

cwtan12, I understand your passion about shrimps but this forum is mainly for killifish keepers and planted tank enthusiasts, especially moss lovers. I hope you understand that. I have no issues with shrimps. I love them too, but I can't keep them alive for long. To me, I think I'll stick to keeping snails and leave the ones with deep pockets to buy the CRS.

silane, we've discussed the temperature requirements of Diapterons in the Killies Arena. I think there was a thread regarding it not too long ago. Use the search function with temperature and Diapteron as keywords. You should get some answers.

Another note, lets cut down on the debate and all. Like jojoecute has mentioned, one man's meat is another man's poison. I suppose we can all agree to disagree in a civil manner. Thanks.