Aphanius mento

[mummymonkey]

I have some eggs from my pair of A. mento.
What is the best method of hatching these eggs please? I did not have great success with the original batch of eggs I bought, hence I only have a single pair of fish.

Many thanks.

[stoker]

Hi

Name here is Mike and am in Perth.
Firstly your fish have spawned so the water conditions are ok
it takes about 14 - 21 days for them to hatch

If you have spawned them in a mop you should pick the eggs and hatch them in a separate container as the parents are avid egg and fry eaters, once you have a hatch feed them on brine shrimp, make sure that the water condition are the same as the parents tank and do not overfeed, little and often. do a 10 -20 percent water change daily with the same water parameters that they have hatched in.

If you want e-mail me for further info and can pop round to sort out any problems.

Mike

[RonWill]

Welcome to the forum, Mike. Nice of you to start sharing experience with your first post and that's what an online community should be; to exchange information.

It's always interesting to hear how other killie-keepers find this forum and keen to hear about the species you've handled, both past and present.

[mummymonkey]

Hi Mike, thanks for posting.
It's the hatching I'm having problems with, if I can get fry I'll be fine.
At the minute the eggs are clouding over within a day and don't look fertile. I'm picking out a handful every 2 or 3 days from sunken mops.

I have the fish in a 2ft tank well filled with mops & plants. The male is pretty hard on the female and I think the female needs to escape from him or she will be killed.

I use a floating container with anti-fungal (alder cones) and an air stone. This is the method I use for corydoras eggs and I have good results with those.

[stoker]

Hi Graham,

Been there,
Make sure the ph is correct if I remember should be just over 7 as they come from canals that are flooded by the tide. Check the biotope information, that will give you the relevant data.
Don`t pick the eggs leave them in the mops in your hatcher for a few days and see what happens, just put the whole mop in the hatcher,sometimes the contamination on your hands is enough to kill the egg.
Yes the males are hard on females may be an idea to give her a break for a few days.


Mike

[RonWill]

I use a floating container with anti-fungal (alder cones) and an air stone. This is the method I use for corydoras eggs

Graham, I'll be breeding me some pygmy corys soon and am curious what alder cone is. Does it, by any chance, able to drive pH down? More details please.

I also noticed that you and Mike are from Perth Scotland. Pray tell, is it Perth in Australia or the Scotland as I know it.

BTW, like Mike, I also refrain from picking eggs and seem to kill more eggs that way than if I were to leave them alone.

[stoker]

Hi Ronnie

It`s the Perth in Scotland the other one is named after this one.


Mike

[stoker]

Hi Graham

If I have got this right try this
Aphanius Mento pic. on page 7 on the forum


Mike

[RonWill]

Mike, you're close and yes, the search button actually works!!
Here's the thread;
http://www.killies.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1756

Graham, keep us posted whether the aerated method works equally well in improving the hatch rate.

[stoker]

Thanks Ronnie

Didn`t know how to do it ,maybe give me an idiots guide on how. Can breed killies but the rest ***** or words to that effect.

Mike

[stoker]

Hi Ronnie,

Figured it out just took a few guesses and cracked it.

Many thanks if I have put you to any trouble.

Mike

[mummymonkey]

Graham, I'll be breeding me some pygmy corys soon and am curious what alder cone is. Does it, by any chance, able to drive pH down? More details please.

Alder cones are the seed-bearing parts of the alder tree. I collect them from local trees and dry them out. One or two cones per litre of water is enough to stain the water a brown colour (like tea) and this works pretty well at preventing fungus. Of course it can do nothing if the egg isn't fertile in the first place! I use it in preference to methylene blue; it seems to be as effective without the other issues of staining etc that comes with meth blue.
A similar result is obtained with the use of those Indian almond leaves that you get for transporting bettas.

[RonWill]

Hi Graham, I've stopped using almond leaves because they tend to decompose quite fast, breaking up into a godzillion bits. The ginger leaf I'm experimenting with, holds it's form very well over a longer period and provide plenty of hiding spaces for pygmy fry beneath the leaf-litter.

How do you prepare the alder cones before use (besides drying) and do you break these apart or dump it in whole? After being submerged, do they rot easily? If it tans the water like peat, have you tried taking a pH reading? I'm hoping to achieve pH5 without resorting to chemicals, if possible, should I get hold of another B. macrostoma pair again.

Bear with me for being like a kid in a toy store but I'm a very curious creature (heh, I think that's how the cat died!)

And Mike, no trouble at all. Groping around is part of the learning curve and just holler if you need help.

[mummymonkey]

Put the cones in whole and remove them after a day. I haven't measured pH before/after but I will do this weekend.

[retro_gk]

Ron, I've found the water you put ketapang leaves into affects the rate at which they decompose. In a tank with tap water (liquid rock here), the leaves will disintegrate within a week. In a tank that is 95% RO, the leaves still look the same as the day they were added, 2 months on.

Also, I use a ketapang tea in some tanks, much like peat tea. 6 leaves boiled in 1 liter of RO water gives a very potent extract. A capful in 5 gallons of RO is more than enough.

[whuntley]

Measuring pH without knowing KH is a big waste of time. Reporting results will just spread confusion.

Hard alkaline water, with a KH of 20 degrees will show very little change in pH.

A tiny bit of weak acid can make the pH of softer water crash.

Decomposition of coco peat or leaves that have not been adequately composted can be quite rapid, depending on the water.

I have routinely used real sphagnum peat or oak leaves to lower pH of aquarium water to 5 or lower. To do this, I often had to replace most of my tap water with RO water. If I didn't the natural buffering of the tap water would hold the pH well above 7.

pH is controlled by the buffers present. Simple chemistry. Ignore at your fishes peril.

Wright

[stoker]

Hi All
What`s ketapang leaves, is this the new in thing or a dark secret.

Mike

[retro_gk]

Ketapang leaves = Indian Almond leaves = leaves of the Terminalia catappa tree. No dark secret.

[Scott_sg]

I have given up on Ketapang leaves for the same reason as mentioned. They really break down to fast and make a big mess. Banana Leaves last forever, but go slimey and anaerobic underneath.

Now I just have an old small bucket with a mix of leaves sitting in it, to make my tea...

Oh I also heard that Ketapang leaves are medicinal for humans. Has anyone ever tried them? Drinking the tea that is... not smoking them

Mike, Ketapang/Indian Almond is apparently (so I'm told) a traditional medicine in this part of the world. They are all the rage with the betta people, see aquabid - breeding supplies to see what I mean. If you want to try some, your best bet would be to harass someone on the forum here.

I doubt there is much real difference to using Alder cones though.

Since this has come up, and dredging up some botany. Do people pick the leaves/cones of plants? or take the fallen ones?

The guys in North America seem to use oaks and similar.

I figure if you use fallen materials then they will all be roughly the same in content, since plants before they drop leaves etc, tend to retrieve the useful things. If you use picked materials and then let them dry then the contents could be very different.

(Well I roughly think I know what I mean..)

Scott

[stoker]

Hi Scott

Thats as clear as mud i think Ah Indian almond leaves a bit like hens teeth over here seems to be oak leaves used but am in the process of confirming that as there seems to be red oak (american) and english oak but not sure if both do the same thing.
I don`t know about alder cones may just pick them off the tree at the end of the season after the leaves fall might be an idea to ask Graham about that will save me from doing it ha ha.
Don`t know about the medicinal properties of leaves or at least those ones . But the other ones make you see funnnnnyyyy things

see you later


Mike