ADA vs GEX soil

[scorpy]

What is the main difference between these two types of soil, anyone care to share?

[StanChung]

ADA is more soil than silica. GEX is 50% silica[according to the packaging].
I would say GEX soil is something in between ADA soil and holland sand.

For those who want something in between, GEX should be your choice. Some members here love it as it doesn't crumble easily and the water clears faster for new setups.

Some love Aquasoil just because it's a little more forgiving if you forget to dose.

[scorpy]

Meaning if I'm to get GEX, I need to inject fertilisers more frequently?

[Shadow]

meaning if you forgot to dose and you are using Gex then plants can't compensate it by taking from the soil via its root. did I make you even confuse?

[scorpy]

meaning if you forgot to dose and you are using Gex then plants can't compensate it by taking from the soil via its root. did I make you even confuse?

hmm, so as to say, ADA soil can retain more nutrients?

[StanChung]

ADA soil has more organic matter. As you know silica is inert. So if you are using the ADA system with the 'live substrate'- it would be producing nutrients for your plants constantly as the microorganisms from their line of 'power' stuff do their job converting organic matter into nutrients plants can use.

On the other hand, water column dosing also works for aquatic plants as they can absorb nutrients through their leaves/stem and 'water roots'.

However not all nutrients are found in the soil in sufficient quantity so you still need to dose NPK and trace elements when your tank is in full gear.

[Shadow]

ADA soil do contain more nutrients? The drawback is you need to cycle longer unless using mature filter media.

[scorpy]

I see! Thanks for the replies, think I'll get GEX as I'm intending to dose fertilisers, hence not depending much on nutrients in the soil i guess.

[StanChung]

ADA soil do contain more nutrients? The drawback is you need to cycle longer unless using mature filter media.

Cycle longer? I think it pretty fast. Fast is you use the powders ADA recommends.

Not to mention lighting. A lot of hobbyists think they are using a lot of light. Most are really not in my observations.

Scorpy, GEX would serve it's purpose well as a compromise/best of both soil and sand attributes and I'm happy to have helped you decide.

[scorpy]

hmmm hope my newer tank will turn out well since the plants in my old tank arent doing very well, probably because the gravel used are big and no co2 injection etc.

[illumnae]

CO2 isn't a requirement for plants to grow well. Actually, a non-CO2 system is alot more forgiving towards mistakes as everything grows more slowly, and a mistake won't crash your system as quickly as in a CO2 system. Growing a planted tank is really all about balance...more CO2 just means you have to have more light, more ferts and more trimming...in return, you get a very fast growing tank and can keep just about any species under the sun. However, one small mistake and you may find yourself combating algae for months.

Back to the topic at hand, Gex is the choice for you I disagree that it has less nutrients - I believe it's equal. However, it does have the benefit of having your water clear up really fast. You can dose or not dose with Gex, no issues either way - dosing makes the nutrients in the Gex last longer. Not dosing doesn't have any detriment in your mid to low tech tank. I have 1.5 year old gex in my tank where I don't fertilize via water column, and the plants are still growing crazily.

[StanChung]

Hi Illumnae,

I'm surprised you say it's equal. Silica to my knowledge is inert and it says 50% silica on the bag of GEX. Dosing makes the nutrients in the GEX last longer?
More likely the 50% silica is letting it hold it's shape/texture longer like holland sand perhaps. Water column dosing is what's giving your plants what it needs in the long run. Amano has tanks running longer than 5 years with PS/AS combo's. Holland sand would last forever of course.

Well it's just my opinion.

[illumnae]

I'm just curious, where can we get info that ADA soil is more soil than silica and isn't 50% silica as well? But I think you're right, the 50% silica content may just be what is giving Gex the advantage of holding it's shape/clearing up in water faster. I went to google silica content in soil once, and apparently the 50% silica makes the soil loamy soil or something like that, which is what is ideal for agriculture. Too little silica is bad, as is too much. I can't remember where I found it though, I posted it in that controversial Gex vs ADA thread that arose some time back

As for dosing making the nutrients last longer, it's applicable to any substrate If plants get a certain amount of their nutrients from the water column, they take less from the substrate. As growth/nutrient uptake is limited by your light, the nutrients in your substrate will last longer with water column dosing.

Edit: Here's the quote of my post on silica content Unfortunately, the first link (with a cool diagram showing the different compositions of silica, silt and clay making up different types of soil) is no longer valid.

using this link, http://web.ukonline.co.uk/fred.moor/...rmed/f0107.htm on soil compositions, it seems that having 48.2% of sand in Gex makes it loam or clay, depending on the percentage of clay and silt found in it.

Ideally, loam has 40% sand composition : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loam. Clay consists of a variety of phyllosilicate minerals rich in silicon and aluminium oxides and hydroxides, so given that aluminium oxide is at 23.9%, Gex soil should classify as medium loam (assumption based on limited numbers available)

From my limited knowledge, loam is ideal for plant growing. Going by Quixotic's breakdown of Gex soil, it seems so far that the relatively high percentage of sand in Gex is a good thing and makes it a good planting substrate

Edit2:

This is also just my opinion I've since moved on to use holland sand + base fert and I'm getting good results as well. While I do prefer Gex soil over ADA soil for its faster water clearing capabilities, this is also because I know that either way, the plants are going to get sufficient nutrients from me from the water column. Even if I'm wrong that Gex has the same amount of nutrients as ADA, it doesn't matter as I'm dosing EI via the water column. Hence, with the nutrient content out of the way, I'd choose Gex for it's other "value added" capability

[Shadow]

Another fight between ADA and Gex supporter

You can get ADA soil composistion from Tom Barr need to be a member though (not free)

[illumnae]

Not fight this time, just sharing our opinions and experiences

[StanChung]

I see it as sharing!

As for dosing making the nutrients last longer, it's applicable to any substrate If plants get a certain amount of their nutrients from the water column, they take less from the substrate. As growth/nutrient uptake is limited by your light, the nutrients in your substrate will last longer with water column dosing.

Actually if you use ADA's system of live substrate with the whole bunch of additives, it 'uses' the soil whether you have plants or not. It's especially good for thick bushy, hungry plants. IME the mass of the soil is less after time and you need to keep topping up. Some compacting and some becoming mud before totally dissolving.

EI is a very simple technique that is adaptable by every hobbyist. Tom did say it's not an original idea about the large weekly water change to reset. He just spelled it more clearly to us in forums! [if you bought Aquajournals or some of Amano's books from the 90's, you'd see that Amano has written a lot of detail about 20-30% WC weekly.] The key difference is that EI is based on the premise of a 'hydroponics' system where little thought is given to the beneficial microbes except borrow some mulm from an established tank! Simple. It's successful because it works. Amano's way works as well if not faster and based on an ecosystem. In a real world biotope, there's little nutrients in the water and where the plants grow, there's lots of mud! so one must think most of the nutrients are in the mud.[as simplistic as it sounds]

I think it's very hard for somebody to make something so complex easy to chew for new people and it doesn't help when there is so many variables and invisible/micro elements.

Now there are a lot of competitive products to grow nice lush plants. Aquasoil is no longer an expensive luxury for some like me, it's a necessity[till something much better comes along of course]!

I just like to use Aquasoil+PS over GEX for it's colour/texture. It's like comparing tea with coffee. Coffee has more 'oomph' of the wake up kind whereas tea also has oomph but it's a relaxing kind. I found that GEX exhausted itself a little quicker with my erratic/reactive style of dosing.

[genes]

Has anyone in this forum actually have success in propogating the tonina species in GEX? I have tried tonina belem and had no problem in propagating them in my ADA amazonia I with minimum dosing of liquid ferts. They propogated quickly with thick and bushy plantets until i had to trim and throw because it was overwhelming my tank. Tried to do the same on my GEX tank but the toninas just kept melting after afew weeks. That was my call to stop myself from buying GEX soil that time because it limits the number of plants i could grow with my laziness in sticking onto a fert regime. Previously, i either do not dose for days or had very irregular dosing regime. Dose when i feel like it.

But 1 think i dislike about ADA amazonia I is like what stan mentioned, it starts to disintergarate into mud over afew years. I heard amazonia II can hold their granules better. But i have not tried the new amzonia II personally. So can't comment on that. But think again, 30plus dollars for a 9kg pack that last say 2 years or more of fuss free (for me case) planting... I would say its rather worth it.

Just my encounter with both of the soil.

[StanChung]

Hi Genes,

I heard ASII disintegrates faster. LOL. In any case it becomes plant food.
IMHO, the main difference is the beginning stages between ASI [original] and ASII.
All of my tanks are using ASII at the moment, 6 months later and counting, so far no more worse than ASI.

[JadeIceGreen]

What about those who set up tanks that comprises purely of java ferns, moss and riccia? Is there a benefit for using Aquasoil soil then?

What I've heard from ADA stores is that using Aquasoil is still encouraged as they lend stability and nutrients to your tank. How true is this?

[beetroot]

Anyone can share the pH reading between GEX, ADA Amazonia I and ADA Amozonia II?