Help! Windelov and Java Ferns Browning and Dying

[Tony]

Hi All Bros,

Need your advice on the fertilisation and nutrients needed to recover my Java ferns and windelov. Have been changing them in the last 1 year because they will rot away in my 2ft goldfish tank. I've posted in the marketplace to look for simple ferts and it contain info on my setup. Kindly advice. Thanks.

http://www.aquaticquotient.com/forum...ad.php?t=53240

[barmby]

They need Trace. When tank has been running for long period of time. All traces depleted until you change water. But to overcome any shortage. Dose Seachem Equilibrium. It is difficult to address especially such plants. But let's try Equilibrium. It contains good amount of Calcium and Potassium

[Tony]

Hi Bro Barmby,

When is it appropriate to use Seachem Equilibrium vs Flourish? I had months fighting back BBA in my low tech tank previously when I introduced Oceanfree Iron liquid (drip on the surface of the water near the rainbar for distribution). What is a good way to introduce ferts into low tech, low light setup while keeping the BBA in checked?

[barmby]

I am not sure what is appropriate because I appreciate Estimative Index method, provided, have super light and good amount of CO2 to last during lumination period. Thus, we don't guess how much to dose for S.E or Flourish.

Conclusion, base fertilizer is a good way to introduce ferts into low tech tank. Also, as your plants grows and take over territory, increase the light period, 15 mins a month up to 8 hours or so, I am not sure, but you need to monitor..

My low tech tank runs from 6pm - 2 am for many years with water change every year or every time i scrub the front glass panel.

Leave the tank alone. Power pack your substrate. Plant generously. Cut lighting period. And stop doing anything. It may just work. Because low tech tank - things happened, but very slow (even for algae).

[barmby]

And sorry. with gold fish , it is not a low tech tank and my method will not work. Follow the dosing instruction of Seachem Equilibrium. See how ?

[sandeepraghuvanshi]

Java fern normally do not need fertlisation to survive, they are slow growing plants.
Their rizomes should not be buried under the substrate, also when placed directly under lights they tend to brown & wilt.
Can you post a photo, it will help in diagnosis.

[Shadow]

... when placed directly under lights they tend to brown & wilt.

I believe this is a myth, I have narrow/needle leave java fern directly under 150 MH light without problem. They grow very fast though

[k3nlim]

I agreed..they do grow faster under direct lightings. Have mine under 48watts T5ho lights in 2ft tank but never see any sign of been "burnt".

[beetroot]

I guess we have different views...

I'm also having some browing problem but no major though. Windelov tied to wood. Almost 3 months in my tank now.

Some sides / part of leaves that turned black (like dried off/burnt) will eventually 'rot away' and disappear, leaving the green part of the leaf like a vegetable leaf with worm's bite marks ... umm.. hope you can visualise what I mean...

I'm just leaving them alone now. Daytime - some sunlight but not direct. Night - 18W PL light when I'm home, for about 4 hours.

[Philosophos]

Is it the new growth or the old? Is the java fern still putting off new growth? I find old leaves deteriorate, and pruning helps. Might be trace elements, too. If you're using pure RO water, or you've just got a high plant load and clean tap water, then you'll need to add some in. Equilibrium has:

Soluble Potassium (K2O)
23.0%
Calcium (Ca)
8.06%
Magnesium (Mg)
2.41%
Soluble Iron (Fe)
0.11%
Soluble Manganese (Mn)
0.06%

It's missing a lot of micros. Note the lack of phosphate, boron and sodium. Flourish has a wider range of nutrients:

Total Nitrogen
0.07%
Available Phosphate ( P2O5)
0.01%
Soluble Potash
0.37%
Calcium (Ca)
0.14%
Magnesium (Mg)
0.11%
Sulfur (S)
0.2773%
Boron (B)
0.009%
Chlorine (Cl)
1.15%
Cobalt (Co)
0.0004%
Copper (Cu)
0.0001%
Iron (Fe)
0.32%
Manganese (Mn)
0.0118%
Molybdenum (Mo)
0.0009%
Sodium (Na)
0.13%
Zinc (Zn)
0.0007%

but obviously the macro concentrations aren't so good.

I got frustrated running around looking at product lines to get target levels of nutrients, so now I'm working at mixing my own from dry. I'm hoping it'll be cheaper and more flexible.

[Tony]

Hi All,

Attached is a photo of the java fern browning out. the plant was purchase from C328 about 2 months ago. It came tied on blocks of wood which I've removed and tied to my 1.5ft arc shape centre piece driftwood. At the moment still clueless if it is due to plant adapting from emersed form (never recovered from past attempts, which ened up having buy new plant to replace) or nutrients related.

[k3nlim]

Should be nutrients related.

[Shadow]

The problem with low tech tank, it slow grow , did you see any new leaf? Since it is only 2 month, I would guess it is due to emerse to submerse.

[Tony]

So far it has lots of roots of plantlets coming out from most of the tips of the leaves. I've manually plug them out as they look untidy. The huge centre piece of java fern is directly below the 2Ft 2x15W FL light and has a rainbar behind facing the wall to reduce the flow rate, so the plant is getting strong flow of water current circulating through it.

[Philosophos]

I'd bet it's potassium deficiency. All the symptoms seem to match, and a lack of potassium is a pretty common problem. If you don't have any ferts or a nutrient rich substrate, it's the lack of macros that usually causes problems first. If you're low tech and the GH from tap isn't too bad, flourish alone might solve the problem. If GH is low, boost it to 50ppm or more with equilibrium. If you can't get seachem, read up on other brands and ask here. Mixing your own ferts is an option, too.

[barmby]

hi philosophos (handful!!)

btw,

If you're low tech and the GH from tap isn't too bad, flourish alone might solve the problem.

I don't quite understand. Can you please elaborate ? I mean GH has an influence?

[Philosophos]

Ya, GH consists of elements that plants need. though usually potassium is pretty low in a common water supply. Go ask the water department in your area for the full yearly report on water quality. They may have it online. I'm not sure what the laws for your country are, in some they have to offer it for free and without question. After you know what's in the water you're putting in to your tank, it's easier to figure out where to go from there.

[Tony]

Hi All,

Thanks for all the advice. I just got hold of some seachem flourish generously given by bro Jason

Will try out and dose 1.5ml as recommended on the dosage instruction into my 2ft tank weekly to see if it will revive the ferns. Will update few weeks later.

[barmby]

Thanks Philosophos

[Philosophos]

No problem. Let me know if you want any other fert info; i've been working on EI from base compounds lately, so it's easy for me to look at stuff related to it right now.