Reply With Quote
are you sure it is X'mass moss? does not look like it, look more like string moss. What is you tank temperature?
As above,having christmas moss in my tank and found out that it is not as beautiful as it is compared to some forummers here.
Tank:27cm(length)x16cm(breadth)x17cm(height)
Light:9w PL light
Flora:Spiky moss and marimo
Fauna:Cherry shrimps
CO2:Nil
Fertilisers:Nil
30032009.jpg
30032009(001).jpg
are you sure it is X'mass moss? does not look like it, look more like string moss. What is you tank temperature?
27-29degree celsius.
Moss won't have, "leaves" in the normal, macro-sized sense. Sure, get a magnifying glass or microscope and it'll show. It'll grow towards the light like any other plant; if it doesn't, it won't make it in nature around the plants that do. Natural selection is some neat, yet kind of brutal stuff.
You're starting with very little moss. From what I've been reading, good looking aquatic moss grows naturally where you live. Go for a trip out on the weekend looking for some of the non-endangered kind. I pay $5-$20 for a small bag of the moss that you can get for free.
The marimo balls look nice, but they can culture in undesirable parts of your aquarium. Unlike plants, algae doesn't need roots. If you want a nicer looking object with the same effect, try out various kinds of pellia/monoselenium tenerem/etc. It's supposed to be very forgiving. Careful to avoid using Flourish Excel around it though. You may also want to try topping up the aquarium.
There are two dichotomous rules that I have found in any new endeavor with flora and fauna in aquariums. The first is to read more than you'd ever want to, until you think you know everything. The next is to keep many, with the expectation of failure. High density planting off the start is easier, a properly sized group of fish right away is also easier. Doing high density in rare organisms is an expensive risk. Buy more of what you can replace twice or three times over.
By the time you're done keeping pets in an aquatic garden, you can find your self digging through research papers like a scientist.
-Philosophos
bro, those moss in your tank don't look like christmas at all, btw if you are at the east side or if you can come over to my place this sunday i can spare you 1 tau huay tub which is more then enough to cover your whole tank.( will be triming my moss wall this sunday)Originally Posted by specky7
check your pm for more detail
thks guys for all ur quick replies,will be changing to spiky moss as it will suit my tank temperature.do i nid to does ferts if i use spiky moss and if yes what fert to get.is seachem excel good?
Don't dose ANYTHING into a tank this size, if you are keeping shrimp in it. Also mosses do not need fertilization, so don't worry about it.
You might want to look at upgrading your lights. Any that looks like sparsely planted Java moss to me, do you know what it is?
Also you might want to consider getting rid of the driftwood and replacing it with Bamboo Charcoal tubes or ceramic tubes,
looks like your driftwood is still leaching tannins into your water, and you will want to give your shrimps more hiding places.
hmmm,my light is already 9w which calculate to 4.6WPG.how much watt should i need
I just wanted to chime in on this one. It's a common misconception that the Cladophora in Marimo balls can spread. It can't. (Actually, it's probably not even a clado - the Japanese moss balls are now [back to being] Aegagropila linnaei, and the Russian moss balls should follow suit soon, I would imagine) Most species of aquarium clado look alike, so it's a natural mistake to make. But the moss ball type does not attach, and would grow ERY slowly in an aquarium if one could get it reproduce sexually. What people are seeing are actually other species of nuisance clado.
Signed,
AQ's Biggest Marimo Ball Cheerleader
Knowing others, one is wise; knowing the self, one is enlightened. In conquering others, one is forceful; in conquering oneself, one is mighty.
So A. linnaei has no free floating, or epilithic stage? I have to disagree.
http://www.citeulike.org/article/3654828
It may behave its self better than other algaes, but this does not mean it is perfect. There are a number of sources stating that it will go flat if not turned regularly. Here's a case of some one doing it on purpose:
http://www.shrimpnow.com/forums/showthread.php?p=25051
And Wikipedia, for what it's worth:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marimo#Growth_forms
-Philosophos
Last edited by Philosophos; 3rd Apr 2009 at 03:25.
That A. linnaei grows attached in the lake is beyond dispute. That it can be free-floating is, well, obvious the second one sees a moss ball for the first time. But of course you were talking about aquarium growth, which is what I was adressing. If you re-read even the abstract of the article you cited, it states that the "balls" and the attached colonies are genetically distinct, and therefore enen further supports the fact that it won't spread in an aquarium.
As for Wikipedia...well, Wikipedia, as a source of scientific information is hardly authoritative.
Absolutely, one could (and people do, though the reasons are beyond me) open/flatten a moss ball, but it doesn't attach. In keeping with the spirit of the scientific method, I will be at least interested if shown to be wrong on this point. Any "flatteners" feel free to chime in! However, I maintain that cases of Aegagropila popping up in new locations, attached, in an aquarium will all be found to be cases of mistaken identity. And it certainly can't become a nuisance as such reports invariably suggest. Your second and thrird pics are clearly NOT A. linnaei (or whatever species the Russian marimos turn out to be).
Finally, let's not take any of this personally!
Knowing others, one is wise; knowing the self, one is enlightened. In conquering others, one is forceful; in conquering oneself, one is mighty.
I would think that the round shape of the balls would be due to high circulation in the water. This is what I've gotten from everything that I've read. The article also stated that transformation between growth types is unknown, and that they are genetically similar. I would have expected them to say more than, "Not evident" since at the same time they were saying things that indicated the possibility. It would be hard to say that there is no likely interaction, given that A. linnaei transitioned from salt to fresh water.
It depends on the article. Some of them are amazingly well sourced; check out their articles on specific neuroreceptors. For anything related to fish keeping, it's hit an miss IMO.As for Wikipedia...well, Wikipedia, as a source of scientific information is hardly authoritative.
So it can be free floating, it can reproduce asexually but having it appear in different locations is not possible? Why? For that matter, how would new balls be formed?
No, it isn't. I forgot to create a separate paragraph for it, since I typed the post in two separate sittings.
It's C. glomerata; commonly sold as marimo balls, since they can form 2-4in spheres. It will spread in an aquarium quite easily, and is found in more diverse locations. I originaly intended to ask what would differentiate the behavior in how the two spread, besides the former's diversity in location.
Of course not; I like a good debate. Learning, and even science, wouldn't happen if everybody just kept re-affirming homogenous ideas.
-Philosophos
I too am a big fan of Marimo balls! They are cute, grow slowly, and I've personally never had one spread into an aquarium.
In fact I think my main issue with Marimo balls is how slowly they grow
I want one the size of a bowling ball, but I reckon thats likely to take me another 10 or 20 years at the rate mine are growing...
There is an LFS locally which squishes them and ties them onto driftwood, and has about a dozen such tied squashed marimo balls on sale (Nature Aquarium aka NA if anyone is curious) but I've never seen on attach to driftwood to the point that the attached nylon fishing line could be removed.
Also I've been monitoring these squished balls for about half a year and they still haven't grown to the point of being able to mask or cover up the
fishing line used to tie them down.
I just wanted to chime in on this one. It's a common misconception that the Cladophora in Marimo balls can spread. It can't. (Actually, it's probably not even a clado - the Japanese moss balls are now [back to being] Aegagropila linnaei, and the Russian moss balls should follow suit soon, I would imagine) Most species of aquarium clado look alike, so it's a natural mistake to make. But the moss ball type does not attach, and would grow ERY slowly in an aquarium if one could get it reproduce sexually. What people are seeing are actually other species of nuisance clado.
Signed,
AQ's Biggest Marimo Ball Cheerleader
Try keeping one with slightly brackish water; it'll grow MUCH faster. Aegagropila linnaei used to be marine, and it still seems to thrive on some extra sodium. I wonder how often people are told it isn't actually A. linnaei when one spreads after a dose of salt from fish medication, or perhaps even buffering with NaHCO3.
-Philosophos
As far as marimo becoming a pest aquariums, there's no debate, friend. If you want to keep up the (pointless) debate, go to APC and debate with Bob H.,
http://www.aquariacentral.com/forums.../t-160176.html
or any of the people (besides me
Knowing others, one is wise; knowing the self, one is enlightened. In conquering others, one is forceful; in conquering oneself, one is mighty.
So are you telling me that you won't debate because you believe your opinion is infallible, without justifying it? After that you're linking me to what some one else says, but does not provide evidence for? I don't care about who said it, argumentum ad verecundium is not my friend. After that you're dismissing my statement on clado without even asking for sources?
If you're going to blow me off, please don't do it in a rather dogmatic way. Don't offer me half an argument and half a refutation as you leave; it isn't very polite, and more importantly it shows a lack of credibility. Just tell me that you don't care to continue the discussion, and leave it at that. I won't think less of you or your position for leaving a debate incomplete.
-Philosophos
Posting Permissions
Bookmarks