spot algae on glosso: how to prevent that?

[bclee]

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On 3/26/2003 1:49:08 PM


Hi Bro,
read about keeping Fe at 0.1ppm. However, my Sera Fe test kit gave a table on Fe concentration & action... say Fe at 0.5-1mg/L is safe.
TMG that I'm using contains 0.07% Fe... so dosing at recommended dose will add 0.35ppm Fe already. Slight confused over this.
Am I right to say that the 0.1ppm is the daily concentration, so at 0.5-10mg/L with weekly to fortnightly water change, the equilibrium of 0.1ppm is established?
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0.1ppm is a bit on the low side. There are many articles out there recommending different levels. 0.5~1.0ppm is fine.

What is the recommended dose for TMG?

BC

[FC]

Puffer,

"Water parameters: ph6-6.5, KH3-4, CO2 indicator OK, NH3: nil, NO2 Nil, NO3: 5ppm (slight). Fe 0.5-1, PO4: trace.
Lights: 12 hours, 2 15W PL."

IMO, your PH swings too much. If you have KH4, keep it between 6.6~6.8. If you do not use solenoid to control CO2 and inject CO2 24hrs, then increasing the KH might help to moedrate the swing.

TMG has relatively higher copper content than most liquid fert. I am not sure if it is your cause of shrimp mishap, other than the PH swing. In my view, when using TMG, keeping Fe level at about 0.2 ppm should be observed.

I had been increasing the PO4 level in my water column for the past 2 weeks, keeping it between 1~1.5 ppm. The plants are doing fine though no detectable improvement in plant quality but there is no visible increase in algae. Green dust on the glass wall is my only algae, I hardly have spot algae, detectable only once a month. Having said that, my other parameters are higher too, in term of NO3, K+, Traces, Ca, etc. You may want to consider this.

[bclee]

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On 3/26/2003 3:08:06 PM

IMO, your PH swings too much. If you have KH4, keep it between 6.6~6.8. If you do not use solenoid to control CO2 and inject CO2 24hrs, then increasing the KH might help to moedrate the swing.
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FC, what's your concern about the pH swing?
IMO, if the fishes are not having problem and sufficient CO2 is maintained, there should not be too much concern.
BTW, some pH kits have only resolution of pH 0.5.
If you do some CO2/pH/KH calculations, increasing KH do not moderate the pH swing. It will have about the same fluctuation be it KH 1 or KH 10.(Of course, barring KH 0.)

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TMG has relatively higher copper content than most liquid fert. I am not sure if it is your cause of shrimp mishap, other than the PH swing. In my view, when using TMG, keeping Fe level at about 0.2 ppm should be observed.
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I believe quite a number of hobbyist are using TMG with the recommended dose without problem to their shrimps. I would think that the shrimp problem comes from else where.
If the dose gave 0.35ppm of Fe, then it will give 0.03ppm Cu which is not exactly high.

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I had been increasing the PO4 level in my water column for the past 2 weeks, keeping it between 1~1.5 ppm. The plants are doing fine though no detectable improvement in plant quality but there is no visible increase in algae. Green dust on the glass wall is my only algae, I hardly have spot algae, detectable only once a month. Having said that, my other parameters are higher too, in term of NO3, K+, Traces, Ca, etc. You may want to consider this.
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Yes, I have had even higher P with no algae problem. In fact, the spot algae on my rock receded a bit.

BC

[puffers]

I had been increasing the PO4 level in my water column for the past 2 weeks, keeping it between 1~1.5 ppm. The plants are doing fine though no detectable improvement in plant quality but there is no visible increase in algae. Green dust on the glass wall is my only algae, I hardly have spot algae, detectable only once a month. Having said that, my other parameters are higher too, in term of NO3, K+, Traces, Ca, etc. You may want to consider this.
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Read in the krib thst N:P ratio is more important than absolute N & P value by themselves. Keeping N:P ratio at 16:1 will keep algae at bay.

TMG dosing at 5ml per 50L, contains 0.07% Fe... so that will work out to how much Fe in theory? Any one has the formula?

[bclee]

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Read in the krib thst N:P ratio is more important than absolute N & P value by themselves. Keeping N:P ratio at 16:1 will keep algae at bay.

TMG dosing at 5ml per 50L, contains 0.07% Fe... so that will work out to how much Fe in theory? Any one has the formula?
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The N:P ratio is not absolutely true in my experience. But, rather, having either one of them limiting will cause algae. In my recent experience, my tank ran low on NO3(close to 0) without my notice and now I have lots of BBA and hair algae. After dosing KNO3, the plants now looks more healthy. I should expect the algae to recede soon.

OTOH, I used to run my tank high on P about 3NO3:2PO4 ratio... no algae problem.

0.07%Fe means that 1ml will contain 0.0007g Fe or 0.7mg Fe.

5ml will contain 3.5mg Fe.

When dosed into 50L, you will get 3.5mg/50L which gives you 0.07mg/L(or ppm) Fe.

BC

[Plantbrain]

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On 3/25/2003 12:51:55 AM

Hi Tom,
Checked again. NO3: 10mg/L, PO4: 0.1mg/L.
So is the NO3 sufficient? Looks like low PO4 may be the reason here heh? Shall I dose some PO4? Which commercially available solution should I use? Florish PO4?
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Yes, your tank sounds like the classic PO4 deficent tank. Add some and watch the NO3 drop and the plants pearl.
You will see a reduction in most algae. The
PO4 is deficient if you assume an average tank uses .1ppm of PO4 in afew hours and the rate of fish waste comes nowhere near this amount.

Organically bound PO4 is not usable by plants or algae. Often test kits measure total PO4 rather than orthophosphate which is the usable form of PO4.
That's why you get a reading but no growth.

Test kits do not always tell you what you need to know about bioavaiable nutrients............

Regards,
Tom Barr

[cheeboonyong]

Hi,

finally got around to buying a kit. Using Sera test kits for NO3 and PO4. My results are quite astonishing...

NO3: >40 mg/l
PO4: >2 mg/l

I dun know the exact concentrations cos they are way out of the charts. So is this good or bad? Seems like huge excess nutrients to me, but surprisingly[:0], no algae except for spot algae. my plants are all doing very well too.

one observation I made recently, my glosso seemed to have perked up (literally standing up) after I started to dose 1 mg/l of Seachem Potassium. Is there some way for us to test for potassium? I couldn't find any kits for potassium.

[bclee]

Not surprising. I've got 30ppm NO3 and 20ppm PO4 without algae problem.

Keeping up with about 20ppm of K will help to bring down the NO3 and PO4.

BC

[cheeboonyong]

how do i convert from mg/l to ppm? pardon me for asking this seemingly simple questions which I do not know the answer to...

in any case, i shall take BC's advice to increase my P dosage.

[PeterGwee]

BC...how long does it take for your nitrate level to drop? I presume you are using Sera Nitrate test kit? Can the drop be measurable?

[bclee]

My NO3 has dropped to undetected level in the past few weeks. Then I started to have BBA problem. I have just started dosing KNO3. The BBA has stopped spreading and is under control.

BC

[bclee]

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On 3/31/2003 11:25:07 PM

how do i convert from mg/l to ppm? pardon me for asking this seemingly simple questions which I do not know the answer to...

in any case, i shall take BC's advice to increase my P dosage.
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Boon Yong, mg/L = ppm.

You don't need to add anymore P. 2ppm is ok. Just make sure it does not fall below 0.5ppm.

Just maintain about 20ppm K.

Test kit for K is rare. Just base on calculations for dosing K. Slight excess is ok. You can refer to Chuck Gadd's site on the dosing of K.

BC

[PeterGwee]

Ermmmm...sorry to ask again...past few weeks huh? You mean no water change in between? If there is a water change..wouldn't that remove the excess NO3 and the drop would not be totally from plants consumption?

One more thing...can you tell me what fert are you using? The way of dosing? I seem to have problem bringing down the NO3 no matter what I try although I can see bubbling of plants plus the fact my PO4 seems to drop to 0.5ppm after I dose 1ppm of it..

[SuperRaY]

i got the reverse of most people's setup i need to dose N,P (low bio load for me 27 cardinal, 10 yamatos, 6 oto, 6 1-2inch sae and flying fox). i used (chicken ****) to make the water more fertile (haha). the plants is doing okay. i onli have a ph test kit. so far the plants is glowing healthy after i dosed the (chicken ****). my bylxa japonica use to have rotting leafs and algae (staghorns, spot) now i have BBA on older leaves especially on e.tennelus. will try to add more chicken **** and see how it goes. too much chicken **** will cause bacteria bloom causing the water to be cloudy (happen to me once). i will see how the suituation goes. time for PMDD.

[bclee]

The high NO3 and PO4 was mainly contributed by adding too many Horti tabs. The level remained high even after a number of water change. Probably due to the continual leeching of the nutrients into the water.

After about 2 months, the NO3 is finally exhausted. Now I am dosing NO3 by KNO3.

BC