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Thread: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very tired

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    My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very tired

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    NEW THREAD and UPDATES. NEW MISSION

    Before i explain everything, i'll provide the detail of my tank.
    Tank Dimensions (45x35x35, CM):

    Lighting Intensity(No of Watts) : 16x2 (32)
    Number and type of Lighting (FL/PL/MH) :T5
    Age of light bulbs : New
    No. of hours your lights are on : 10am- 8pm (10 or slightly less)

    Just updated the C02
    CO2 Injection Rate (bps) : about 3 Per second
    Type of CO2 (DIY/Cylinder) :Cylider)
    Method of Injection (e.g. Diffusor/Reactor) :Glass Diffusor

    Liquid fertilisers Used :Seachem Trace
    Fertilization regime :2-3day 1dose 1time according to what is needed

    Other fertilisers :multi bottom

    Other additives :Seachem Prime, Tetra Easy Balance 2time weekly

    Type of Filter : Internal Boyu
    When was the filter last washed : Weekly
    Filter media used : sponge
    When was the media last changed :None
    What was changed :3day ago

    Age of setup : 1month

    Water change frequency : hmmmm 2week change 1time, the rest only add water
    Amount changed : 30%

    Water surface movement : Normal
    Circulation : Gentle

    Tank Temperature : 29++

    Chemical Properties (Fill what you can)
    -------------------------------------
    All not sure

    Bioload (Number and type of fish and plants)
    ------------------------------------------
    3guppy
    2oto
    2yamato
    30++ tetra
    Describe your problem :
    ----------------------

    That time i opened a thread regarding algae growing on my HC(like cotton wool green colour, fine) so i got a cylinder C02 tank to provide a stable C02 for my HC and did a 50% water change. I manually removed the algae and Planted NEW Submersed HC too.

    Today, I notice the algae is starting to come out from my HC again even i just did a water change 2day again. I try to provide my HC with a high level of C02 for them to get use to my water condition and i still start to notice some of my HC start to melt! and algae growing on them! ARH!!!!!! Pain arh!

    I did so many changes Like:
    Change the light from 9W to 2 x 16w T5
    Then bcoz of high lighting cause Algae, I go get a tank C02 and hope it provide stable C02 for them,
    I get the ADA multi bottom bcoz i dun have base fertilisers.
    I get the seachem trace and dose them 1-2day 1times.
    I get Oto and Bumble bee snail and yamato to form anti algae team.
    I increase water change to weekly.
    I try to increase the C02 when i see them melting and algae and MY 1 Yamato just die bcoz of my C02 which i decided to lower abit now.

    What else i need to Do? Haiz... i'm feeling kind of down.....
    Picture below






    MY YAMATO!


    I did try to grow HC emersed in pot and it's doing well.

    Last edited by dna9179; 1st Oct 2009 at 11:23.

  2. #2
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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    The melting might als be that they ae changing from emerse to submerge form, this will usually take about 1week or so. But for your 1 month tank the changing of state might not be the case. Temperature might be the main problem, HC need temp of around 26 to grow better. Try getting a fan to lower your temp to 27 or 28 as 29 is a bit too high for the liking of HC.

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Several issues to address. Your tank is still in intial stage i presume. And is not yet fully cycled.

    Your bioload is too much for an initial setup. Usually fauna are introduced after tank has stabalised and plants have already adapted to the setup.

    Your boyu filter is undercapacitated for the tank and bioload. It is recommeded for canister filter, which can house essential BB . IMO the boyu works better as a wavemaker. Plus you stated you are washing the filter every weekly? How do you wash it? with tap wateR?
    There are 2 types of filtration biological and physical. You should strongly consider a external canister to allow for biological filtration if you want to venture into planted. If biological filtration is not present, you will be ever plagued with ammonia spikes--->algae boom

    You are dosing Micro nutrients(trace) to your plants. You should be dosing Macro (N,P,K) which are essential for high light plants Micro only in moderation to allow plants to absorb the macro. PLus given the inert lapis, the initial stage you should be banging on macro fertilization.

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    My tank is almost 2month, and all live stock is alive and no more death bodies, Still not fully cycle?
    i use the tank water to wash the filter.
    My tank is small, do i really need a canister filter?
    which product in seachem contain Macro (N,P,K) So the seachem trace is unless for my HC?

    Keep more coming, i need to know more.

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    hmm currently my hc is doing well despite the temperatures (able to hit 29 sometimes) so i guess it might not be the main cause.. try more lights n co2? im using 4x24 =p

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by dna9179 View Post
    My tank is almost 2month, and all live stock is alive and no more death bodies, Still not fully cycle?
    i use the tank water to wash the filter.
    My tank is small, do i really need a canister filter?
    which product in seachem contain Macro (N,P,K) So the seachem trace is unless for my HC?

    Keep more coming, i need to know more.
    Good to hear that you have been putting in great effort to combat algae. Just some pointers to address your problem

    For lapis sand, there is no ammonia to kick start cycling process unlike aquasoils. your ammonia is probably from fish waste. Presuming your filter is new, for a filter to be considered matured is when there is almost 0 ammonia 0nitrite and nitrate within healthy range.

    There are 2 common methods in tank cycling, fishless and with fauna. Even with fishless and using ammonia carbonate to kick start the cycling process of a filter, it can take 2 weeks or even up to a month in some cases, coming from own experience.

    There are accounts whereby for 1.5ft OHF have been used successfully, with biohomme. However, fauna is usually introduced at later stage, when the tank has 'taken off' Back to the issue of BB, the idea of a canister is to allow colonization of BB onto filter media such as biohomme or other filter substrate. There is a threshold as to how much waste a particular surface area of filter media can process.

    Seachem has flourish which is an all rounder fert that has NPK alternatively they also have N P K seperately. Other commercial brands have MICRO and MAcro sold seperately such as wondergro series.

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Seachem flourish is just trace with a bit of N and P (0.07%N and 0.01% P). If you like seachem you can get Seachem Nitrogen, Seachem Potassium and Seachem Phospate.

    for growing HC, you should use fertile substrate instead of lapis sand. Fertile substrate will really speed up the growth.
    -Robert
    Aquascaping is a marriage between Art and Farming
    My Blog: http://aquatic-art.blogspot.com/

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    you could use GEX soil for the substrate for a start. HC have small roots and will have trouble initially being uprooted almost daily after planting. maybe you could use wondergro micro and macro + for the fert regime.

    you stated that you changed water weekly? by how many percent? and is it aged water?


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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    The lapis sand might be too compact for roots growth. What diameter are the lapis?
    The role of master and servant begin to cloud in the water..

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Try to put your diffuser below the internal filter, let it suck into the inlet of the filter, it will crush the CO2 even more finer and thor out from there. It doesnt mean you release 3bps CO2 and is mixed well into the tank, lots of people misunderstand this. Is the CO2 thing you know. Another method is add some Seachem excel, although you are using canister CO2. HC likes excel very much, excel helps HC, but overdose it also wipeout your fauna anytime also.

    MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!!! TIME TO LAY BACK AND RELAX!
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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by Cross View Post
    Good to hear that you have been putting in great effort to combat algae. Just some pointers to address your problem

    For lapis sand, there is no ammonia to kick start cycling process unlike aquasoils. your ammonia is probably from fish waste. Presuming your filter is new, for a filter to be considered matured is when there is almost 0 ammonia 0nitrite and nitrate within healthy range.

    There are 2 common methods in tank cycling, fishless and with fauna. Even with fishless and using ammonia carbonate to kick start the cycling process of a filter, it can take 2 weeks or even up to a month in some cases, coming from own experience.

    There are accounts whereby for 1.5ft OHF have been used successfully, with biohomme. However, fauna is usually introduced at later stage, when the tank has 'taken off' Back to the issue of BB, the idea of a canister is to allow colonization of BB onto filter media such as biohomme or other filter substrate. There is a threshold as to how much waste a particular surface area of filter media can process.

    Seachem has flourish which is an all rounder fert that has NPK alternatively they also have N P K seperately. Other commercial brands have MICRO and MAcro sold seperately such as wondergro series.
    I see, i will take note of the fishless cycling if i have the chance to build a new tank next time. SO seachem flourish contain all N P and K? which of their specific product contain each N P and K on in own?

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
    Seachem flourish is just trace with a bit of N and P (0.07%N and 0.01% P). If you like seachem you can get Seachem Nitrogen, Seachem Potassium and Seachem Phospate.

    for growing HC, you should use fertile substrate instead of lapis sand. Fertile substrate will really speed up the growth.
    Oh so seachem Nitrogen(contain N) Seachem Potassium(contain P) and Seachem Phospate(contain K)? Am i right? So by getting 3of these and dose according will be the best fertilisers altogether?

    Too late le, i remember that time i saw a thread when a guy ask whether will HC grow on lapis sand and they reply him no problem sure can that why i use lapis sand. Now too late le, how am i going to change the sand to fertile substrate?

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by diazman View Post
    you could use GEX soil for the substrate for a start. HC have small roots and will have trouble initially being uprooted almost daily after planting. maybe you could use wondergro micro and macro + for the fert regime.

    you stated that you changed water weekly? by how many percent? and is it aged water?
    i dose the new water with seachem prime before i add to the tank. about 40%+

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by k3nlim View Post
    The lapis sand might be too compact for roots growth. What diameter are the lapis?
    Lol i seriously dun know how to reply you the diameter of the sand. lol

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by blue33 View Post
    Try to put your diffuser below the internal filter, let it suck into the inlet of the filter, it will crush the CO2 even more finer and thor out from there. It doesnt mean you release 3bps CO2 and is mixed well into the tank, lots of people misunderstand this. Is the CO2 thing you know. Another method is add some Seachem excel, although you are using canister CO2. HC likes excel very much, excel helps HC, but overdose it also wipeout your fauna anytime also.
    maybe i will try to move the diffuser under the filter but if i not wrong by doing this will cause the filter to create some kind of noise right?

    really headaches and confused
    I remember during my research in this forum, some posted in the thread that by dosing excel will never be better than having a cylinder C02 tank because it's harmful to fauna and the real cylinder will provide the real C02 which is best for the HC. That why i get the cylinder, are you suggesting me to provide HC with both cylinder and excel? I dun think there is a need for this. i felt it's kind of over doing

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Right now i have a song to sing to my dear Aquarium, fishes including oto and yamato, and finally the HC cuba. This song is to express my feeling right now..

    Bryan Adams - (Everything I Do) I Do It For You

    Youtube: YouTube - Bryan Adams - (Everything I Do) I Do It For You

    Look into my eyes - you will see
    What you mean to me
    Search your heart - search your soul
    And when you find me there you'll search no more

    Don't tell me it's not worth tryin' for
    You can't tell me it's not worth dyin' for
    You know it's true
    Everything I do - I do it for you

    Look into your heart - you will find
    There's nothin' there to hide
    Take me as I am - take my life
    I would give it all - I would sacrifice

    Don't tell me it's not worth fightin' for
    I can't help it - there's nothin' I want more
    Ya know it's true
    Everything I do - I do it for you

    There's no love - like your love
    And no other - could give more love
    There's nowhere - unless you're there
    All the time - all the way

    Oh - you can't tell me it's not worth tryin' for
    I can't help it - there's nothin' I want more
    I would fight for you - I'd lie for you
    Walk the wire for you - ya I'd die for you

    Ya know it's true
    Everything I do - I do it for you

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by dna9179 View Post
    Lol i seriously dun know how to reply you the diameter of the sand. lol
    take a grain and measure by eye?

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    You mention about lots of fertilizer but may I just ask, did you put enough bacteria into it?
    Try bacter ball, bacter 100, PSB conditioner, effective microorganism & nitrate bacteria.
    Plop in some yamato shrimp also.

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by Foxtrotperv View Post
    You mention about lots of fertilizer but may I just ask, did you put enough bacteria into it?
    Try bacter ball, bacter 100, PSB conditioner, effective microorganism & nitrate bacteria.
    Plop in some yamato shrimp also.
    So which you recommend? bacter ball or bacter 100? which is more for helping to reduce algae from growing on my HC and help in stabilize water condition?

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    Re: My HC really can't make it in my tank despite the changes i made for them..Very t

    Quote Originally Posted by dna9179 View Post
    really headaches and confused
    I remember during my research in this forum, some posted in the thread that by dosing excel will never be better than having a cylinder C02 tank because it's harmful to fauna and the real cylinder will provide the real C02 which is best for the HC. That why i get the cylinder, are you suggesting me to provide HC with both cylinder and excel? I dun think there is a need for this. i felt it's kind of over doing
    There was reported by other hobbyist that excel help HC but take it as a pinch of salt. It may be just a placebo effect. I grow HC with normal CO2 injection an all OK. However when I pass it to my colleague who is using excel, it does not grow well and start dying. Again it maybe because wrong dosage. My point is it is not solidly proven. You can try to add but don't be discourage if it doesn't work well as you expected.
    -Robert
    Aquascaping is a marriage between Art and Farming
    My Blog: http://aquatic-art.blogspot.com/

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