genes's pleco tank

[desmondekker]

wow! congrats bro! very instant indeed. i read on the articles that the father raise them up better than us bro. hee, i guess you got to wait for the experts to advise you

[genes]

Thanks guys.

Colin, how do you do the initial egg count? They are being blocked by the father to get any full view of the eggs. Since it was Sunday that the eggs were laid. I was thinking to remove the fries into the aerated breeder box on friday. At around 6 days, they would have hatched into wrigglers so are more easy to monitor as compared to eggs.

Drake, I'm no master breeder. Besides, i think they are not difficult to breed with so many successful stories locally. I never even do anything to incite them to breed. Perhaps i was lucky to find a gravid female.

I was advised before by afew very helpful bros regarding the use of Amazonia soil as well as planted tank being unnatural for plecos. However, I wanted the tank to be a show tank too so i defied their recommendations. But the lower xingu species and L46 managed to bred in such a setup. So i guess whats demonstrated here is that there is not important to scape to their biotope to get them to breed. Celticfish's caves are definitely a vital point because nothing bred in those slate caves i got from USA. Celticfish's caves have enabled me to breed the lower xingu, L333 and now the L46.

There are still so much to learn from the experts here
By the way, my tank is also running on CO2 at 2bps for 7hrs a day.

[barmby]

Hi Eugene, it is not recommended to count the eggs before it hatched. It is not possible unless you shine the torch. And I don't do that for fear that the male will makan the little ones. Also, once you disturb/lift/move the cave, you have to take out the eggs. However, water change is still ok. If it is routine, it is ok. I always believe in ... the pair being "zai", they can do wonders.. And their fries raising skill is very steady.

There is nothing much you can do until day 4-5 in which the fries will leave the shell. Start counting when you take out the cave and shake everything out..

I cannot agree more that Celticfish's caves are vital. Once you put it in. They simply can't stop having sex . ahem.. I mean breed.

It is perfect situation. I mean your tank has reached its equilibrium. Planted tank, with CO2, no algae (haha!), zebura, spawn and babies. Wow.

[desmondekker]

I cannot agree more that Celticfish's caves are vital. Once you put it in. They simply can't stop having sex . ahem.. I mean breed.

Laugh Out Loud! sidetrack a bit...my L25 loving the sofa inside celticfish cave

[Ah_ZhaN]

Congrats Eugene,

Are your L46 all F0 ??

[doppelbanddwarf]

Congrats Eugene. You make fish breeding look so simple. Good luck with the fry!

[genes]

Thanks again all.

Zhan, i think you mean F1 right? Yes they are F1s because the adult zebras are all wild.

[celticfish]

@ genes,
Nice pick with the female!
And righfully rewarded!

I did my egg count "backwards".
From kicked out eggs and wriggler count.
I can't tell if the dad eats some though.

Amazonia is "usable" for zebras.
Though they do breakdown over time.
Since they are smaller sized plecos it should take some time for it to happen.


@ desmonddekker,
I'm glade you didnt get too disheartened from your recent mishap and bounced right back!
I alway tell people of the "blight" that took away the lives of 10 adult from my colony of 13 then.
Didnt stop me and went right back on acquisition mode!


Thanks for the comments on the caves!
But I didn't make them!
I just imported them as I feel they are the best tools for hobbyist wanting to breed them.
And its the breeding that keeps the interest alive IMHO.

My first success with zebra were slate caves but they were smaller than those from zcliff.
Don't forget he breeds L333 so his cave size is a little bigger.
I did advise someone then who made the previous mass order to be sure they got the smaller ones.
This recent MO they did on AF shows he has got two sizes now.
I still go for the German made ones as I do not want to "reinvent the wheel".
They have been breeding them for the longest time and have had time to refine the tools and process.
Though the caves are not precisely made they are all in the "ballpark" and ready for play!

[jerrywll78]

Suprise suprise, the female has been confirmed a female because she has bred with a male in the tank in less then a week upon introduction. So Irwin, you are so spot on! So now my concern, to remove the eggs now or wait for a week....

Tank specs as follows
GH - 120
KH - 0
PH - 6 (using ADA Amazonia below the gravel)
NO2 - 0.5
NO3 - 20
Temp - 33deg

Hi Genes...i just wondering you tank temp. is 33 deg.?? Maybe in this temp. the pleco will breed??

[Cup]

that's a terrible pleco tank--it's far too beautiful.

[genes]

Haa...thanks cup. I thought i made a real mess out of the woods and cryptocoryne balansae.

jerry, not sure about the temperature. I also do 10% water change once every 3 days.

Sharing the same tank is this piece of scarlet. Amazingly, the zebras are more of the bully then this spiky and bigger fellow. The L25 also lost out to the zebras when competing for food. I have to "hand feed" the L25 for fear it may not get to the food at all during feeding time.


And the zebras just killed one of the 3 L144 in the tank. The damage done to the male L144 is pretty savage. Looks like alot of biting going on.

[Champ-BKK]

Haa...thanks cup. I thought i made a real mess out of the woods and cryptocoryne balansae.

jerry, not sure about the temperature. I also do 10% water change once every 3 days.

Sharing the same tank is this piece of scarlet. Amazingly, the zebras are more of the bully then this spiky and bigger fellow. The L25 also lost out to the zebras when competing for food. I have to "hand feed" the L25 for fear it may not get to the food at all during feeding time.


And the zebras just killed one of the 3 L144 in the tank. The damage done to the male L144 is pretty savage. Looks like alot of biting going on.

Nice fish with Pro-skill to taking a pic.

[genes]

Hey guys, need some advice again. I have never poured out fries that are lesser then 2 weeks old before. So when you guys remove the fries with dad wedged inside the cave, you just shake the fellows out? Won't the yoke break or get damaged? How's the usual survival rate of the fries being poured out? I'm also afraid dad starts trashing around and killing all the fries.

Today is the 6th day and i could see wrigglers with yoke sacks in the cave. I am thinking of pouring out because it seems i have another female that looks gravid and keeps on staying around the alpha male thats guarding the clutch. Plus the alpha male now sometimes moves out of the cave with only its head inside which makes me worry. I thought the male suppose to be inside the cave always till the fries become free swimming.

[celticfish]

Having only his head out is normal.
They little ones get a little too irritating for dad as they get closer to explusion day 18.
At this time mine was in the middle trying to keep them in.
But the occassional few will escape much earlier (recall lab rat in my thread).
Don't worry about the adult L46.
They treat them like they were invisible.
But I'm not sure about the L144 and L25 though.
Never had other fish in with them.
I reckon as one to 3 day old wrigglers they will very possibly be seen as a meal.
Once they get to day 7 or so, when they look like the adult shape but are still pudgy with the egg sack they should be safe.
At this time they are able to whizz about when threatened.

[genes]

Thanks irwin, i'll be removing them in a day or 2. They are all still "bundled" together at the end of the cave and yoke is still present. However, dad is giving them alot of space by keeping his body out of the cave with just the head inside. Any slight movement and he dashes into the cave. Also, he is venturing out to eat when the food drops near him. Very interesting behavior that i have not seen with the lower xingus. And the rest of the colony just eats openly infront of me! Am loving these guys, finally a pleco that i can see everyday, every now and then....

[genes]

Harvested 7 fries. Took quite some time to shake the fries out of the cave with dad wedged inbetween them. Think dad got the scare of his life man...

[p.albert]

pardon me if i am wrong.
i was researching about zebras online.
they said to leave the eggs with the dad?
so whats the practice?
also, what is the recommended substrate?
like what would you guys recommend?

[Cup]

Personally, I think pea gravel is the best substrate. I try to keep the fry with the parents until after the yolk has been absorbed. I have found the father to always care for his brood better than I would.

[genes]

The fries are so tiny compared to the lower xingus and L333. Will snap some shots soon.

[desmondekker]

Harvested 7 fries. Took quite some time to shake the fries out of the cave with dad wedged inbetween them. Think dad got the scare of his life man...

seventh heaven! mind sharing what do you do after collecting the fries? do you place them in the breeder box?