Fertilizer

[geoffrey]

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On 5/12/2003 9:59:39 AM

Hi Guys,

I have tested the PH and Kh over the weekend.

KH : 3 ppm
Ph : 6.5 ppm ~ 7 ppm (as the green colour is in between the Tetra PH test kit indicator).
Checking the PH/KH/CO2 chart, the CO2 seem to be ideal.

However, I realised that riccia and some plants is infested with BBA. Oops, what should I do to remove this?

Is my weekly dosage enough? or Causing the problem?

Any advice?

[:0]
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You can only remove them by cutting away the affected areas. That is however not the solution because the BBA will come back again if your plants do not grow well.

Check your gH(Mg/Ca), NO3, PO4 and Fe to know if any of the nutrients are limiting and dose accordingly. My guess would be your NO3 is limiting since you have good CO2 reading. Do dose K2SO4 for 20ppm of K for good measure although we can't measure it without good kits.

[bclee]

Macronutrients deficiency, especially NO3 or K, may lead to BBA too.

If possible, test for NO3 & PO4.

BTW, there is no units for pH and the units for KH is °, not ppm. If you put ppm, it means something else.
1°dKH = 17.8ppm(equiv. CaCO3)

BC

[spidermen]

Thanks Geoffery and BC.

Oops u r right. The reading shld be:-
KH should be 3dkh (the third drops it turn to yellow).

Actually I am following the Chucks' recommended dosage for the 2ft tank:-

K 20ppm (K2SO4)
Mg 7ppm (MgSO4)

Thought that is ideal already? Need to add somemore?

Need to buy NO3 test kit? Sigh! pocket big hole already.

[]

[PeterGwee]

Spidermen...actually there is another way around testing. The key is water changes...Singapore tap water nitrate level is in the range of 0.5-15ppm but base on the "kiasu and kiasi" factor, I would think the nitrate level that reach us should be 0.5ppm [] . I did a test with my tap and the reading is zero...suspected though but can assume it to be 0.5ppm.

You can do the following with a test kit..just make sure your CO2 is good. Your CO2 fluctuation from 9ppm to 28ppm as seen from your test could be a major problem...maybe you can get a test pen for more accurate determination of CO2.

Assume of you have 14.2 gallons of water after deduction of gravel and driftwood volume.

50-70% water change
KNO3: slightly more than 1/8 tsp of KNO3 2X per week
K: Slightly more than 1/8 tsp of K2SO4 after water change
PO4: 1 rice grain of KH2PO4 2X per week
Traces: 3ml of Flourish, TMG or Sera 2X per week
GH: 3dGH and above

Do this and wait for at least 2-3 weeks to see results. Do prunning of dead leaves and manual removal of algae before big water change. []

[spidermen]

Hi Peter,

Thanks. It seem to be a big overhaul?

Btw, how to measure Gh? Gh test kit? Another big hole in the pocket.

[:0]

[PeterGwee]

Hahaha...AP kit does have a KH and GH combo kit...price quite economical if you ask me. By the way, our tap water GH is about 3 which is good...just don't know whether it is in the correct proportion or not. If you don't see Ca or Mg deficiency after dosing the stuff recommended after a couple of weeks, the water GH should be good enough. []

[spidermen]

Hi Peter,

Thanks. Where to get the AP kit? How much you bought it?

Funny thing is after I do the water change on Sun, and after dosing the K2SO4 (20.5ppm),MgSO4 (7ppm)and trace element.....the BBA on the riccia seem to have reduced....

have to pray hard that it will do away.

[PeterGwee]

Spidermen...the kit cost more than 10 but less than 15...[] As for the BBA, you need to prune them off your riccia totally and replace the whole set of nutrients and not just the ones you mentioned. It is only through hard work of prunning, big water change and redosing of complete set of nutrients would you see improvement over the 2-3 or more weeks later

[chrissia]

You can get the AP kit at polyart, clementi.

[spidermen]

Thanks. I will get it from Clementi.

Btw, Peter. wat do you mean replace the whole set of nutrients? What else i need? PO4? KNO3?

[:0]

[vinz]

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On 5/13/2003 9:27:09 AM

Hi Peter,

Thanks. Where to get the AP kit? How much you bought it?

Funny thing is after I do the water change on Sun, and after dosing the K2SO4 (20.5ppm),MgSO4 (7ppm)and trace element.....the BBA on the riccia seem to have reduced....

have to pray hard that it will do away.


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God helps those who help themselves... so praying is not enough.

There's nothing odd about it. Basically, two things could have happened:
a) You've diluted the N and P levels in your tank, denying the excess to the BBA
b) Your plants were being limited by K and Mg.
It could have been both that affected the BBA. When your plants grow healthily, algae have a lesser chance of surviving.

So what you have to do now is figure out what's usually lacking in your tank. Dosing K and Mg seemed to have helped your tank, is there anything else? Investigate your NO3, PO4 levels. Keep an eye out for Ca deficiency now that you're dosing Mg.

Liquid fert will take care of most nutrients, except N, P, K, Ca and Mg. K is good to add if you are pushing for the "typical" high growth tank. N, P depends on your plant-load/growth vs bio-load and feeding. Ca and Mg seems to be insufficient in our tap water for high growth tanks.

[PeterGwee]

Spidermen..I already quote the type of nutrient to dose didn't I? It is an estimative method by Tom Barr which requires you to know the N-NO3 and PO4 levels in your tap as well as to test for pH/KH only...no other test done as they are estimated. []

[vinz]

I only have one problem with Tom's estimative method... 50% water change per week. That's a total of 1400 litres of water per month for both my high growth tanks. [:0] [:0] [:0]. Other then the water bills, it's not a good thing to do in a water scarce country.

[PeterGwee]

Vinz..the only problem with using test kit is whether the results you get is indeed real? Measured 5ppm but actual is 0ppm...Unless you test your test kit to determine if it has deteriorated by the use of a know concentration mixed with distilled water it, you might never know when your kit is gonna give up on you.

[vinz]

Peter,

I'm not saying we should stick to test kits. I'm just saying that one 50% water change a week is a lot of water (total 200%) a month, especially for ppl with big tanks or multiple tanks.

If you take all the ppl nationwide who practice this, whether big tanks or small tanks, that's a lot of water down the drain, while at the same time the country is spending lots of money finding ways to be less-dependant on neighbouring countries for water.

The estimative method is not the only method, although it's one of the easier ones. I think we can try looking for our own methods, and/or try harder to figure out the routine for our own tanks. Many ppl have had successful tanks, before Tom came up with the estimative method. I'm sure Tom himself has had many successes before that.

Personally, I think the estimative method is good for resetting a problematic tank. And it's goes a long way in helping to figure out what the problem might be. After that, I prefer to try and figure out the nuances of the tank and cut down on the water change to 25% every 2 weeks (total 50% a month). Heck, if we can come up with system for high growth tanks that require even less water change, that's even better.

[FC]

Vinz got the point.

I am also trying to find a balance between each macros, fish foods added and traces. Not for algae control but to keep the plant happy enough without over-doing. That's I hope to strike an economical deal with good results. I hope I can continue to do 35% water change fornightly.

I am monitoring a newly setup 4ft tank that had only one time water water since setup 2.5 months ago. It is hardly fertilised. The Fe and PO4 is at all time nil, NO3 10ppm, CO2 20 ppm, GH 13, KH 7 (both from coral chips) light 0.6 watts/litre. For now, the plants are doing very fine and the glass walls are algae free.

[spidermen]

Hi Vinz,

Could you explained further on :

a) Diluted N and P? through water change every week?
b) Limited by K and Mg. You mean I dose not sufficiently?

What to looked out for Ca deficiency?

actually my plant and fish load quite high based on 2ft. Will try to take a photo and show it to you guys.

[]

[geoffrey]

a) Diluted N and P? through water change every week?
You ran out N, you need KNO3 or you ran out P, you need KH2PO4. But don't go buy them first, please. Check first. we maybe wrong. We are suspecting them because you only seem to dose MgSO4 and K2SO4. Like I said earlier, we may be wrong, your N and P may come from your feeding. So check first.

b) Limited by K and Mg. You mean I dose not sufficiently?
You may dose as much as you can for K and Mg but that is not going to help. All it takes is for ONLY ONE element to be missing and that missing element will limit your plants growth. We call that missing element, the "limiting nutrient".

What to looked out for Ca deficiency?
Put that aside first. Deal with the immediate problem, your BBA. You will confuse yourself with too many variables. I get confused sometimes too.

[vinz]

a) If your tap water has less NO3 than your tank water, by changing the water, you reduce the NO3 content. If your tank has less NO3 than your tank water, then its the other way around. Since you have BBA, I'm assuming the former in your tank. Similar for PO4.

b) No I meant that your plants were limited before you started dosing.

One obvious Ca deficiency is distorted new leaf growth.

[naturetan]

Vincent, I agree that 50% water change for big tank is really a lot. Singapore water resources are too precious to put such large amount to waste.

If Tom Barr could compromise with such large amount of water, his estimative method would be great!