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Brother glenn, why not get a room and place all of the tanks in that room and run air-condition. i guess this will be more economic then running 3 tank to a compressor. most air-conditioning system are split unit, cheaper to run.
I'm looking at doing two/three tanks in my new flat, and I was thinking it may make sense to have a locally built chiller. With the compressor "outside", then during renovation easy to run pipes. Any companies that can support doing a compressor "outside", and three tanks inside?
Brother glenn, why not get a room and place all of the tanks in that room and run air-condition. i guess this will be more economic then running 3 tank to a compressor. most air-conditioning system are split unit, cheaper to run.
CRS - CRazy about Shrimps
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Ya fully agreeOriginally Posted by eviltrain
Resistance is futile, you will be administrated!
No need to look for custom systems. You can consider the Daeil Chiller which System & Control Engineering Co. (better known as Bioplast) used to carry. I'm not sure if they still do. The Daeil indoor chillers are the same as the JBL Artica ones, but I don't know if JBL also has the outdoor ones.
The off-side is that the system is built with one in and out only. You probably have to run the water to a sump/reservoir which feeds the rest of your tanks. Also, means that all your tanks share water and disease can spread from tank to tank. And you cannot have different water conditions/fertilising etc. for each tank.
Daeil prices are better than JBL Artica series, however they only come with 1 year warranty, compared to JBL's 3 years. Note this information was from a few years ago, so you need to ask again.
System & Control Engineering Co. also handles air-conditioning, or used to, so you may want to ask if they can customise a solution for you.
Address below. One of the MRT stations exit is just across the road, so very easy to get to.
Blk 22 Boon Keng Road
#01-23
Singapore 330022
Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:A woman, without her man, is nothing.
A woman: without her, man is nothing.
Resistance is futile, you will be administrated!
Have you done the maths for this? Guessing is a very expensive risk.
I used to run a half horsepower chiller for a 6 foot tank. It was definitely cheaper than running my room air con 8 to 10 hours a night.
The volume of water to cool is a lot less then that the volume of air in the room. Cold air cooling water is definitely less efficient than a chiller cooling the water directly. You get better temperature control with a chiller.
I disagree. Strongly.
Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:A woman, without her man, is nothing.
A woman: without her, man is nothing.
I have the type of chiller that Vinz was describing and was supplied by System Control and Engineering. I have never used it after taking over from a friend. If you are interested you can come to clementi and take a look. No obligation. If you are keen contact me at 9786 3398. Thanks.
The temperature of water is usually lower by 2-3 Degree Celsius (DC) of the room temperature. Thus water temperature of 25-26 DC is easily achievable in a room at 28 DC. I have a tank in my study room without chiller, usually at a temperature of 29-30 DC. When I turn on my air con set at 28 DC, the digital thermometer shows the water temperature at 25-26 DC after an hour or so of operation. I do not know the power vs efficiency but the water temperature are definitely more constant than what I used to have when running chiller due to the 3 DC difference kick in.Have you done the maths for this? Guessing is a very expensive risk.
I used to run a half horsepower chiller for a 6 foot tank. It was definitely cheaper than running my room air con 8 to 10 hours a night.
The volume of water to cool is a lot less then that the volume of air in the room. Cold air cooling water is definitely less efficient than a chiller cooling the water directly. You get better temperature control with a chiller.
I disagree. Strongly.
Taking note that with one less pump, heat gain between pipes, rise of room temperature during operation of chiller (which increase the temperature of water due to heat gain), and not forgetting it cools you too, it is not totally unfeasible to consider using air con as chilling medium. Moreover, you can have your tank running at 20DG without water condensing on the glass.
I did considering having a big tank in the study room having air-con run 24/7. The only problem is my Air-con professional friends warn me that household air con are not designed to operate permanently. However, many marine tank owners like BFG (IIRC) use air con compressors as chiller instead of using it to cool the room but maintenance doesn't seems to be a problem.
Finally, TS, please be warned that our Utility Cost had risen ridiculously just recently.
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I am currently using the said compressor chiller. The company I got it from was chilldown dot com. So far no complaint from me as it worked as expected.
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Chiller cools the water directly where as Aircon cools the air then the water. So I would say Aircon is less energy efficient to cool tank water since it needs to cool an additional media i.e. "air". Unless the primary purpose of aircon is to cool yourself.Have you done the maths for this? Guessing is a very expensive risk.
I used to run a half horsepower chiller for a 6 foot tank. It was definitely cheaper than running my room air con 8 to 10 hours a night.
The volume of water to cool is a lot less then that the volume of air in the room. Cold air cooling water is definitely less efficient than a chiller cooling the water directly. You get better temperature control with a chiller.
I disagree. Strongly.
So Vinz, you are absolutely right. Unless the math proved that this is wrong.
unless you have multiple tanks in the same room.
Resistance is futile, you will be administrated!
I believe Glennswest is considering a compressor outdoors... not an indoor chiller.
Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:A woman, without her man, is nothing.
A woman: without her, man is nothing.
Resistance is futile, you will be administrated!
I think we have to look at this with the right perspective.
If you already have a room that is air conditioned 24/7 (or for the major part of the day), it makes sense to put your tanks in there to take advantage of it.
It does not make sense to me to air condition a room 24/7 just to chill a few tanks. If you plan to have lots of tanks, then air conditioning 24/7 may make sense.
Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:A woman, without her man, is nothing.
A woman: without her, man is nothing.
If you can chain all your tanks into a common sump which is cooled by an immersed coil running to your outdoor compressor it would be the most efficient.
For three tanks this would most likely be the most efficient solution, unless they are all maintained at different parameters.
Connecting tanks with a common sump carries a risk for community infection if 1 tank is hit with a certain outbreak of diease/algae, it will spread throughout all the tanks sharing a single sump.
When using chiller methods, the ambient air is the medium that heat up the tanks. When using air-con method, the room temperature is the medium that cool down the tanks. Theoretically, if you can insulate the room efficiently, especially the windows and the "sun-facing" walls, it is more efficient than chiller. Not practical to insulate a tank since you won't be able to maintain or view it anymore.
Yeah, but it wouldn't be practical to house 3 outdoor units. 3 pumps in a sump heat up the sump much faster unless he is considering those "high flow:low power" pump which are pretty costly. Things can get even more complicated if he decides not to use sump.
More or less there, but we need a hero to experiment how much it really cost for air-con, probably the latest inverter types, to run 24/7.........
My two rupiahs
Resistance is futile, you will be administrated!
LOL... this discussion is going nowhere unless someone can come up with some fairly concrete numbers.
Even then, it so subjective:
- How much is the room heated up in the day? A lot of difference between a room which has one or more walls, or a roof that gets a lot of direct sunlight each day, and one that is hidden in the basement. Ventilation is moot since air conditioned rooms are fully enclosed.
- How thick is the sunned wall?
- Size of the room.
- Heat generating equipment in the room. Like PCs, filters, pumps, lights, type of lights.
- Insulation.
Last edited by vinz; 19th Feb 2010 at 10:31.
Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:A woman, without her man, is nothing.
A woman: without her, man is nothing.
I think bro Jojoe is going the air conditioned room route with his upcoming shrimp room. I am curious to see the power consumption results.
Resistance is futile, you will be administrated!
We talk so much... where's the thread starter, Glennswest?
Vincent - AQ is for everyone, but not for 'u' and 'mi'.
Why use punctuation? See what a difference it makes:A woman, without her man, is nothing.
A woman: without her, man is nothing.
If you want to do the maths, I had the notes somewhere though...... LOL
Assuming you're not into 24/7 aircon, it'll definitely be cheaper to run a chiller with the compressor and condenser outside.
The only problem though I'd guess is getting someone who will build you an evaporator unit not made up of copper. Quite sure you don't want that leeching into your aquarium water.
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